Lyman Customer Support

[grullaguy]

I touched on this on another thread yesterday, but thought my discussions with Lyman may be revealing for anyone else thinking about buying from them. Note the timeline of the posts.



Ticket Thread



Tue, Jun 26 2012 12:09am



Ref Order# 92854
Invoice# 336237

Using my blended alloy that casts the correct size or over size in my other molds, I am casting bullets varying between .3125 and .313 using my new Lyman .314 mold.

I called your customer service department this morning and I was told to send the mold back to be opened up more. Please let me know the shipping address so that the mold can go to the correct department.

Thank you,
John B




Wed, Jun 27 2012 11:05am - staff



Please send this in to us along with a brief note describing the problem. If you have a copy of the original purchase receipt, that would be helpful.
Please send it to:

Lyman Products Corp
475 Smith Street
Middletown, CT 06457
Attn: Service Dept

Thank you




Sat, Aug 18 2012 10:12am



Hello

It has been 7 weeks since I sent the mould to you to be repaired. I have heard nothing and was wondering the status of the issue.

John B




Wed, Aug 22 2012 2:43pm - staff



John,
I apologize for the delay, they re-cut your mould and I did test cast it but it was still undersized in the nose. I also had two other moulds here that had the same issues. Come to find out after we measured up the cherry cutter that it was undersized and had to be scrapped. They have ordered a new cutter and we are awaiting it's arrival, I don't have a time line on that, but as soon as it gets here we will get those re-cut and tested. I apologize again for the delay.




Fri, Oct 5 2012 12:11pm



Time keeps moving on. The customer that wanted bullets from this mould is long gone.

Do you have a timeline yet when I can expect to see this repaired mould?




Fri, Oct 5 2012 12:16pm - staff



The new cutter was tested and the moulds have been cut, I have pulled new ones I needed for repairs and it should be heading back to you.




Wed, Oct 17 2012 5:17pm



Quote: "it should be heading back to you."

When it is shipped, please inform me and provide a tracking number.




Thu, Oct 18 2012 12:46pm - staff



It look likes it was shipped on the 11th USPS here is the tracking number;
LN342841000US




Mon, Nov 5 2012 4:35pm



I received my mould a week ago and finally had a chance to cast with it today. It had a bullet with it in the box which I measured at .313" and I would assume was a test bullet.
Today the bullets I cast all measured .3125 with the alloy I had on hand. That is exactly the size I was getting with the same alloy when I sent the mould to you the first time. I feel like I have been running in a huge circle with you people and I am furious.
I though I explained properly that I wanted a .314" or larger bullet as is advertised by you people. I can size down an oversized bullet but I have yet to find a device that stretches the outside diameter of a bullet.
I am at a loss as what to say further.
Your turn to say something and please come up with something good for a change.
John B




Tue, Nov 6 2012 9:58am - staff



The bullet that was sent to you was a test sample. That bullet measured .313, our spec calls for .314, .313 so the mould is within spec. It was cast in #2 alloy as are all of our moulds (except black powder). The cutter used was new and was within our specified deminsions.




Tue, Nov 6 2012 10:28am



Then I suggest in future you advertize your mould as a .313" mould. .001" makes a huge difference in cast bullet performance. I will be ordering from custom mould makers more in future as will many of my friends.




Message Posted Successfully

[gunboat57]

It seems they could've told you the mold was "in spec" when you first sent it back to them if they really thought .313 was acceptable out of a .314 mold.

Your point about sizing down is right on. Molds should be specified with a +.0015/-.000 tolerance.

[Alzado]

All the more reason to order molds from Tom@Accurate Molds or MP. JMO :)

[captaint]

And this, my friends, is why our custom mold makers are doing so well. A shame. I have bought many used Lyman molds and like them a lot. Never bought a new one, though..enjoy Miked

[Von Dingo]

Nothing like the corperate stone wall. Have heard about this pertaining to them, and why there is no orange on my shelves, just red, green, NOE, and Croatian brass.

[Lance Boyle]

Yep they told me their 314299 specs were .313-.314 on the bands and .302/.303 on the nose.

I sent in a mold that cast .312/.299-300, I got back a mold that casts .314 and .300. So much for the .302-.303 nose. My recut still didn't meet their specs. I think I'm going to try lapping the nose and call it good.

[Hamish]

Did Lee buy Lyman awhile back?

[nicholst55]

Let me see, Lyman... Didn't they used to make reloading and bullet casting equipment - before they went out of business?

[Buckshot]

.............I'd bet a dollar that Lyman USED to make their own cherries to create mould blocks. In other words they had control of the situation. Now it's apparent that they outsource their cherry production to an outside vendor. I also find it hard to believe that they order their cherries one at a time? I'm pretty sure they do intend to make more then (insert number of moulds made) before they send it out (assuming they now send out the cherries to be re-sharpened) for re-freshening. From experience in cutting moulds, you'd think they'd have an idea of how long the cherries are useable?

I know for a fact that operations involved in production will buy various tooling in quantity. From experience they know that (say, a 5/16" HSS 2 flute TiN coated end mill) will produce at least 40 parts. At between 48 and 54 parts the tool will produce parts with a degraded finish, and at 60 parts the tool will fail. If it is an expensive part, or has critical dimensions, the facility engineer having done an analysis will require a tool change at, say 42 parts. The tool which can still appear as new/useable may be returned for recycling, scrapped, or sold depending upon their experience and the benefit to them.

I do not know if they still do, but Boeing Aircraft used to have an in house re-grinding department where used tooling would be surveyed. It was resharpened and placed back into inventory, resharpened and sold as surplus, or after inspection was scrapped.

Finally, reamers are finished to tenths, eg: .0001" and NOT thousandths (.001"). To suggest that Lyman would accept new reamers (cherries) which produced out of spec mould cavities while new, a full thousandth undersized is a bit beyond me. If it were me, I would copy my correspondence with the casting results from the new mould, and forward it to the chief executive of Lyman and ask for their thoughts on the subject.

You may get satisfaction, or you may then regard buying any further Lyman moulds as a **** shoot. I do know that on occasion your back and forth with a manufacturer may not result in your satisfaction. I have a friend who had a Ruger BH revolver in 45 Colt. The chamber mouths would pass a .449" minus pin gage and refuse a .450" gage. Before spending the $32 fee to UPS for Red Label overnight to return the piece, he contacted Ruger. He was told that that was within their tolerance. Apparently they would have simply returned it to him as received.

..................Buckshot

[stubshaft]

Customer Service and Lyman should not be used in the same sentence!

[ShooterAZ]

A while back I ordered the new cast bullet handbook, they sent me the 49th reloading manual. When I called them to get their mistake corrected, they told me I had to pay the return shipping. This didn't set well with me at all. On the other hand...all of my dealings with RCBS have been quite satisfactory.

[captaint]

I have a question for you knowledgable folks. Just how many cavities can be cut with a new cherry of proper dimensions anyway?? In aluminum - Mehanite - Brass ?? Cause I have no idea.... enjoy Mike

[warf73]

.I do not know if they still do, but Boeing Aircraft used to have an in house re-grinding department where used tooling would be surveyed. It was resharpened and placed back into inventory, resharpened and sold as surplus, or after inspection was scrapped.

The Wichita plant did until we got sold 7 years ago.

[.22-10-45]

Hello, grullaguy. I feel your pain. I too posted this before..Back in March of this year, I ordered a Lyman .25ACP M die from Graff & Son..backordered 3 weeks..When I inspected..it had a .270" plug in it..the darn plug was longer than the .25acp case!
Called Lyman..they would send out replacement. 2 weeks later..new plug is right length..only .257 dia.!
Have called on and off throughout summer & fall..last time I called , they said two weeks..we shall see!