Small Ring Mauser in 30 30

[rob55]

Is it possible? Has anyone done it? Id love to have a classy mannlicher stocked rifle that ran on regular.

Thanks

Rob

[Dutchman]

Anything is possible with enough $$$$.

The rim diameter is really too large to use .30-30 Winchester. But there are other calibers like .35 Remington, .30 Remington. Those are both rimless and would function ok.

Also .300 Savage...

Dutch

[izzyjoe]

Dutchman is right, the rim is big, and you may have alot of trouble with feeding. they make a few barrels that are short chambered for the SR mauser. a 300 sav would be a winner. i'm in the process of rebarreling one to 6.5x55, it's gona be a light handy woods rifle.

[Multigunner]

There was at least one prototype Mauser in .303 British. This rifle used a slanted magazine of a type used by British gunmakers like Rigby. The rifle was intended for use by central european machinegunners armed with WW1 surplus Maxim or Vickers guns sold by the British.

No reason the bolt face couldn't be opened up for the larger rim, thats done often enough when chambering for magnum rounds, just an added expense.

Maybe a purpose made .30-30 magazine intended for one of the pump action or bolt action .30-30 sporting rifles could be mounted in the Mauser magazine well.

[Reg]

A small ring Mauser in any rimmed cartridge is going to be a expensive number and will wind up with varied results. It's not to be recommended unless you like single shots.
Good cheap bet though, is find a good usable Springfield barrel and set it up for 300 Savage. Almost same exact performance and I have never seen one that wouldn't feed very well.
The old 300 has taken more than it fair share of game.

:coffee:

[Bullshop]

Siamese Mauser was another 98 patern with slanted box mag intended for rimmed cartridges.
On this side of the pond we were supplying the p-14 Enfield for rimmed cartridges.
I have both p-14 and p-17 and dont see much difference.
There are other commercial efforts that function rims from a mag or clip like the 788 Rem in 30/30 and 44 mag.
Lots of older rifles that feed rims in 22 hornet, 218 bee, 25/20, and 32/20.
I think a gun nut tinkerer with a head on his shoulders wouldnt have that much trouble converting a small ring Mauser to feed and extract a 30/30 rim.
If you hold a 30/30 rim against a non mauser claw 30/06 size bolt face you will see that the size is close. Getting the right amount of hook to the extractor is part of the challange. Maybe having to add just a little length then getting the right temper back so as not to be brittle enough to break or soft enough to bend.
At one time I was going to attempt it with a Savage 110 but the mood wayned and other bright ideas superceeded.

[I'll Make Mine]

The Mosin Nagant also (when correctly set up) flawlessly feeds rimmed cartridges from the magazine, though you'd have to convert the bolt face and probably shim the interior of the magazine and hot bend/retemper the interrupter for the smaller .30-30 rim and head (advantage being you can get a Mosin Nagant barrelled action for well under $100, or a complete rifle for not much over $100). Get a Finn-made version (.308-.309 groove, marked 7.62x53R instead of 7.62x54R), and you could even set back and rechamber, rather than rebarrel (the larger groove size of the Russian version would require you to use larger bullets that might not chamber in another .30-30).

A Mosin ought to be a pussycat with the .30-30, compared to the original Russian round (which is in the .308 ballistic category), and if you choose you could even retain the original military appearance.

[Gtek]

"GUN NUT TINKERER" ? that hurts. Gtek

[Reg]

The extractor is a no brainer. ( I.E. , a good easy single shot ) The problem is the magazine box and feed rails. Whole different ball game.
A number of years ago it was common to rebarrel 93 and 95 Mausers to 45-70. It was done and done successfully but with the difference in labor costs between now and then if you can do it yourself, it's doable but if you have to hire an experienced gunsmith to do it, you had better be prepared to take out a second.

[gew98]

Is it possible? Has anyone done it? Id love to have a classy mannlicher stocked rifle that ran on regular.

Thanks

Rob

I knew an old timer in NJ whom was an ameture machinist/gunsmith. He took a shot out 98k action and removed the barrel. Bought a 30/30 chambering and finish reamer set on the cheap. He got a cheap 30 cal barrel blank and took the mauser barrel shank - cut it down and threaded it on his lathe ( internal threading ) . He cut threads on the barrel blank and screwed the two together. Then maesuring headspace after screwing to the receiver and modifying boltface and extractor he unscrewed the barrel and used his chambering reamers to exact dimensions and reassembled. He parked the whole action and he had an awesome single shot 98 mauser in 30/30 cal. He was thinking of modifying a savage 340 magazine to work in it but don't know if he ever did.

[frnkeore]

Here is my suggestions,

1. If you have a lathe, machine the rims to .468/.465 or you can use 225 Win cases for a short version. No extractor work this way.

2. If you use 225 brass, you won't have to shorten the bolt face, if not, cut the bolt face back .010.

3. Use the improved version with a .410 shoulder diameter and it should stack well in the mag.

Worth a try in my opinion.

Frank

[Antietamgw]

Here is my suggestions,

1. If you have a lathe, machine the rims to .468/.465 or you can use 225 Win cases for a short version. No extractor work this way.


Frank

I did just this some years back as I had a .30-30 reamer and a spare used barrel blank I wanted to do something with. Turned the rims on some cases to .470, fed from the mag more or less with 311291's loaded and without any action work. Details are a bit fuzzy - but it did work. At the time, I didn't really care whether it fed or not as I just shot it from the bench and with the kids with popgun loads. The barrel had some other issues and I ended up installing a new takeoff barrel from a Rem700 when one became available. The breech end of the Rem. barrel was cut off enough that a 7X57 reamer would clean up the 7MMMag chamber. Measure close and there is enough meat to thread for a small ring. It was a fun handy little rifle. If I were going to do it again in 30 cal., , I'd chamber for .300 Savage and think about 311299 or something similar but lighter so that short neck would cover the lube grooves. Brownell's may still sell a threaded short-chambered barrel for small rings in .300 Savage and .35 Rem. I am a sucker for the .30-30 case but I believe the .300 is a better choice in the Mauser. Happy tinkering!

[lreed]

Yes, it is possible to build a 30-30w using a sr Mauser action. All the reasons not to do so in previous posts are valid. I know because I just completed one, after putting together several rifles using threaded, contoured and short chambered barrels I wanted to try my hand at the whole deal. I have always wanted a 30-30 bolt gun so that was my choice. I had a rough truck axle sized rifled blank,and by the time I turned,tapered and threaded this thing I had developed a new respect for store bought barrels. The bolt face had to be enlarged and faced off, wow,but those old bolts are tough stuff,I reshaped the extractor to make a pushfeed possible,never intended it to load from mag,cut a relief in breech face for extractor Yugo24 style. I used a Redfield receiver sight and a Lyman globe front It is a cast boolet only, fun gun. I really enjoyed the work,but if figured my wages at 50cents a hour I'd have the price of a good used car!! Hope my story helps! lreed

[handyman25]

35 years ago a friend had a mauser in 30-30, I think it was a small ring but not sure. The bore was excellent but the out side was a mess. He said he got it from a big importer out of los angles that puchased firearms from all over the world. they told him that it came from mexico and the mexican army used it. It shot very well and worked well. I think he purchased it around 1960.

[leadman]

Midway sells blank extractors for the small & large ring Mausers.

The feed guides are part of the receiver so not easily converted to another cartridge. I tried a 7.62 X 39 in one of my SR mausers and it did not feed it well. I bought another one and it does feed it.

Numrich is selling a 7.62 X 39 ( .310" bore) barrel and feed kit.

If I had it to do over I would go for a 300 Savage. I may still do this as my idea of using the cheap ammo is not a good one. The pressure is all over the place on this stuff. I had one round go over 2,600 fps and locked the bolt. When I got it open the primer was smeared across the face of the cartridge.

If you can turn down the rims on the 30-30 it may work just fine. I may try that just to see what happens.

[Uncle Grinch]

Wonder if the 30-30 would be a good fit for a Siamese Mauser action?

I've got a 45-70 and have seen a 30-40 Krag and have read about a 303 Brit, but never considered a 30-30.

[nekshot]

Well since I feel at home with you guys for thinking these thoughts, I also have been kicking this sr mauser30-30 thing for a couple years. I have a 95 action crying for a barrel. I am convinced it can be done and done to work with the mag. I spent alot of time playing with this action and decided yes it will work with some fitting. The 300 sav always tempted me but the short neck says no for cast. Out of a stroke of genious I lubed a 308 casing and sized it in a 300 die. Now this is the way to go for cast boolits. I think I am going to go this route when I finnish my current projects. With a barrel ready to finnish ream and you can then lengthen the throat for as much neck length as you feel you need. I believe factory ammo could still be used. The 308 I think woul fire form ok.

[GREENCOUNTYPETE]

358 winchester should work , sounds like one heck of a cast boolit shooter to me

you can already make 8mm Mauser from shortened 30-06 cases , 308 is the same rimless case head as 30-06 , and the 308 case is shorter but would allow for some long boolits

I to had been thinking about how to make a nice bolt 30-30 for shooting cast

the most cost effective conclusion i came to was get an old savage 340 or 325 or go 308 or something in the 308 case 358 win is a 35 cal in a 308 case a 200 -250 gr boolit at 22-2400 fps is about max for the cartridge but means it is a fairly efficient cartridge as far as powder to projectile go , and not a lot of unused potential from the case when using cast
add some nice 35 cal boolit designs and it sure sounds like a sweet boolit shooter

[Frank46]

I seem to remember the 300 savage case being used in hunter benchrest. The case designation was 30x47. Had a buddy that shot one. I'm guessing that after he passed all the relatives got his guns. The 30x47 did really well with the lighter 30 cal bullets. Just wondering if a 1891 argy action could be made to feed 30-30 cases with the rims turned down to .473 or therabouts. The action is strong enough. But I also have a winchester 54 action that was made in 1928 as a 30-30, 1 1/4" diameter 308 bbl with mauser threads that the chamber could be removed (about 2") and leaving me with 21-22" of barrel to play with along with a pre '64 marksman stock that bubba got to. Something to thing about. Frank

[357maximum]

but the mood wayned and other bright ideas superceeded.


Hey Dan ...stop telling everyone the title of my autobiography will ya?:kidding:[smilie=2::lol:

[HARRYMPOPE]

I have had two Large rings that were in 30-30 and one in 219 Donaldson Wasp as well.One was an FN single shot the other two FN standard 98's just used as a single shot.An extractor for a magnum case works fine.

George

[Buckshot]

..............Several years ago I was buying an 1891 Argentine from from a guy recommended by a board member here. I went to check out the Argentine, and ended up buying it, but of course we got to talking and he showed me a few of the results of his tinkering. One was an older French side by side outside hammer shotgun he'd turned into a double rifle. The other was a VZ24 he'd rebarreled and chambered to 30-30. I was very interested in it. I asked him how it functioned and he said it ran like a champ so long as you loaded it with succeeding rounds' rims ahead of the previous round in the magazine.

I have a small ring Mauser in 35 Rem and one in 7.62x39. The 35 Rem needed no alterations to the magazine, follower, boltface or extractor. The 7.692x39 conversion got a shortened magazine (via a block), shortened and modified follower. No boltface or extractor mod. I'd think that loading the magazine mindfull of the rim placement and possibly a judicial mod to the follower a 30-30 would be do-able. Especially after seeing one that HAD been done :-)

................Buckshot

[nekshot]

Buckshot, that was what I found when messing with this 95 action. Keep the rims ahead of the previous and it worked. The extractor on mine is worn and takes the rim fine, all would have to do is open the bolt face. But the more I think of this reformed 308 to 300 sav case with its long neck tempts me more to go this direction and I guess I am getting off the thread and I apologize for my ramblings.
nekshot

[Antietamgw]

I to had been thinking about how to make a nice bolt 30-30 for shooting cast

the most cost effective conclusion i came to was get an old savage 340 or 325 or go 308 or something in the 308 case 358 win is a 35 cal in a 308 case a 200 -250 gr boolit at 22-2400 fps is about max for the cartridge but means it is a fairly efficient cartridge as far as powder to projectile go , and not a lot of unused potential from the case when using cast
add some nice 35 cal boolit designs and it sure sounds like a sweet boolit shooter

I believe that the Savage would be the way to go for simplicity and cost if .30-30 was desired. Bedding can be an issue with some of them but lots of guys have good luck with them. I 'm working on one right now, refinishing and blueing, just to see for myself. Frank Marshall used to call these a "little Krag" and loaded with 311284 or something similiar. I've got 311290 and thought I'd try it. It looked kind of lonely and tired in the gun shop. It was cheap because everbody out our way knows that .30-30 isn't fit for anything anyway :D

[Dan Cash]

BritHunter has or did have a beautiful little Mauser stalking rifle in .30-30. I think it was a small ring. Contact him and see if you can't get some close up pix. It can be done.

[nekshot]

I have a savage 340 I bought as a action only and restocked it hoping this would fix the 30-30 bolt thing in me but my savage cannot be modified to allow bullets to engrave into rifling and still eject them without pulling the bolt out and that is a pain. So the dream continues for a nice little lite 30-30 bolt action rifle.

[Bob S]

For 30-30 bolt guns, in addition to the Savages, the Winchester Model 54 was also chambered in "30 WCF", AKA 30-30. For a more recent 30-30 bolt gun, there was the Remington 788 ... but finding one for a reasonable price might be challenging. I'm not selling mine!

Resp'y,
Bob S.

[Baron von Trollwhack]

How about a 30-30 equivalent? 30 Remington in your Mauser type action? That seems most do able in a "91.

BvT

[flounderman]

the takeoff remington 700 barrels have enough meat under the remington threads you can thread small ring mauser threads under them. been doing it on the turks for years. personally I would stick with something with a standard rimless design like the 308 and load it down.

[JIMinPHX]

Midway offers a wide variety of semi-finished Mauser barrels off-the-shelf in many calibers.

http://www.midwayusa.com/find?userSearchQuery=mauser+barrels

I've had good luck with the ones from A&B.

[Reg]

Buckshot, that was what I found when messing with this 95 action. Keep the rims ahead of the previous and it worked. The extractor on mine is worn and takes the rim fine, all would have to do is open the bolt face. But the more I think of this reformed 308 to 300 sav case with its long neck tempts me more to go this direction and I guess I am getting off the thread and I apologize for my ramblings.
nekshot

nekshot,
I to do not mean to hijack the thread but what you are thinking does work and work well.
Many years ago a good friend up in Wyoming was lamenting the fact the .308 preformed well but he thought it could do better with cast if it had a longer neck. I do not recall the exact dimensions but with a Jap action he had and a Douglas barrel I came up with, we put together what he called "The Long Neck Rebel."
basically a .308 with the neck as long as a 06 neck. He formed cases from standard 30-06 brass then trimmed to length. He should have gone into competition with some of the groups he came up with.
Alas, both he and the rifle are now long gone but your idea has worked and can work again.

:drinks: