General Lube Sizer Question

[Nocturnal Stumblebutt]

So here is the story, my Mother told me to pick out something nice for her to get me for Christmas, she loves that I cast, reload, etc. So I was thinking of asking for a Lyman 4500 with heater. Can I get some feedback on:

1. The advantages/disadvantages of lube sizers in general,
2. the 4500 in particular.
3. Whether I should get it at all, I have been tumble and pan lubing up to this point, but not everything tumble lubes well and pan lubing can be tedious when I'm doing high volume loading.

Thanks for the advice everyone.

Also, I am open to feedback about RCBS and Saeco lube sizers, but the Star is WAY out of my price range, so please keep the "get a Star" comments to a minimum.

[theperfessor]

I have an old 450 that I use and it's fine now that I've rebuilt it. If I were buying a new one of the in-out type I would go with the RCBS. The die retention nut is coarser and less likely to strip, and the punches and most dies are interchangeable with Lyman so there is a lot of used stuff floating around.

The Saeco is fine but most punches, dies, etc. are a little more expensive (from most sources) and won't interchange with any other brand.

The 4500 is fine but still has some mechanical deficiencies.

I don't know about what commercial heaters might fit the RCBS but there are lots of ways to home-engineer a heater if you use hard lubes.

That's a real nice offer from your Mom by the way.

[462]

I have an older 45 and a 4500. If I were to buy new, I'd go with the RCBS, due to it's seemingly better ram alignment system.

A heater, while not necessary, could be a worthwhile addition, especially if you experience cold winters or use hard lubes. There are a number of other ways in which to soften lube without a heater's added expense.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I prefer the older Lymans...particularly the 45
I've heard too many bad stories of the 4500.
I am also not a fan of the 450.

since you are directing someone to buy you a new one, I'd go green.
But if your Mom is ebay savvy, tell her to watch for a 45.
Jon

[Nocturnal Stumblebutt]

Thanks for the advice everyone, it is a very generous offer, so I don't want to have her feel like she got me the wrong thing if it breaks, etc., moms are like that. After the advice here and reading a lot of reviews i'm going to go for the RCBS. My next question is whether my homemade Saeco Green (1 lb. Beeswax, 1 lb. Gulf Wax, 1/2 lb. STP, 1/4 bar of Ivory) will be too soft? If fairly sure I won't need a heater for my home brew but I know that the lubesizers are built for hard lubes and some soft lubes can get messy.

[Nocturnal Stumblebutt]

Also, can someone explain to me why the RCBS sizing dies have one row of lube holes, while the Lyman dies have two? does on work better? Although I am fairly experienced with casting, this whole lube sizer world is very new and unfamiliar to me. Any advice on owning/using/maintaining it would be very helpful.

[MT Chambers]

Okay, I'll say it; "get a Star".

[Nocturnal Stumblebutt]

unfortunately I don't have that kind of money now, and I'd feel terrible if I asked my mom for something that expensive. Escpecially since I'd want it with the air pressure regulator on the lube.

[Mk42gunner]

Also, can someone explain to me why the RCBS sizing dies have one row of lube holes, while the Lyman dies have two? does on work better? Although I am fairly experienced with casting, this whole lube sizer world is very new and unfamiliar to me. Any advice on owning/using/maintaining it would be very helpful.

Different manufacturing methods, both brands work okay.

I usually buy Lyman's becauses they are a little less expensive, if I am buying new.

Robert

[Nocturnal Stumblebutt]

So it doesn't really have to do with whether the boolits have one lube groove or 2?

[VHoward]

So it doesn't really have to do with whether the boolits have one lube groove or 2?

No. It only works that way with the star dies. RCBS and Lyman dies are interchangable and doesn't matter how many rows of holes are in them

[Nocturnal Stumblebutt]

No. It only works that way with the star dies. RCBS and Lyman dies are interchangable and doesn't matter how many rows of holes are in them

Thank you. These are the details that aren't in any of the books.

[doctorggg]

I have 2 lyman 4500s bought in the last year. They get the job done but I do not like their cheap chinese ratchet wrench. The gears have stripped already. I also do not like the fact that my hand hits the threads of the return rod when I work the ratchet which hurts. I do like the heater unit that installs in the back and can be purchased fairly cheaply in a package deal. I probably would go green if I had it to do over again. RCBS customer service is superior to Lyman IMHO. Should you get the 4500 the die retention nut driver from "theperfessor" will be some of the best money you can spend. Every time I use mine I mentally thank theperfessor for making it. It saves so much aggravation and prevents stripping the threads.

[jlchucker]

I have an older 45 and a 4500. If I were to buy new, I'd go with the RCBS, due to it's seemingly better ram alignment system.

A heater, while not necessary, could be a worthwhile addition, especially if you experience cold winters or use hard lubes. There are a number of other ways in which to soften lube without a heater's added expense.

I agree completely. I've got a 450, but if I buy another new unit it would be the RCBS one. I've got a heater---a Lyman unit that I purchased a few years ago. All of my lubing is with alox, so pretty much the only time I plug this thing in is if I'm sizing and lubing boolits down in the basement on a cold winter day. The Lyman unit is a rectangular block of steel that is mounted to your bench, and then the lubricator is attached over it with screws that go into tapped holes. I've never had an RCBS unit so I can't say if the tapped hole spacing is such that an RCBS unit could be mounted to it. There's no on-off switch on the heater. You just have to plug it in when using it. I think that unless you are going to use some of the harder lubes, you could live without one of these heaters.

[Jeff82]

If you currently pan lube, you'll like the convenience that a lubesizer offers. I think when you produce at a certain volume as lubesizer just makes the whole process move more quickly and smoothly with a lot less mess.

As the other poster have said, the RCBS is generally preferred to the Lyman 4500. Nonetheless, I use a Lyman 4500 and like it. Mine has an integrated heater, which is the main reason I bought it over the RCBS. And, I do think that you really need to use a heater with the 4500, due to its weaker design. Still, I have to say that the 4500 has worked well for me.

Lyman also makes a heater for about $50.00 that will work with the RCBS lubesizer. So, if you're willing to spend a bit more, you can have the best of both worlds.

Also, Lyman and RCBS dies and top punches are interchangable.

[fishnbob]

I've never had an RCBS unit so I can't say if the tapped hole spacing is such that an RCBS unit could be mounted to it. There's no on-off switch on the heater. You just have to plug it in when using it. I think that unless you are going to use some of the harder lubes, you could live without one of these heaters.

The hole pattern on the Lyman heaters will line up with the RCBS, I have two of them rigged that way. Also you can wire a dimmer switch to your outlet and control the heat with that easily. The heaters take a load of pressure off of the unit and I think is a good investment. You can find them on EBay but they usually sell for retail price.

[ShooterAZ]

I have both the 4500 and the RCBS. While they both work well, I like the RCBS. Gas check seating is easier, and it just seems sturdier than The Lyman. The RCBS sizer will bolt right onto the Lyman heater, no problem there. I did have to send my RCBS back when I first bought it due to alignment issues. As usual, RCBS took care of it promptly. That is another big plus for RCBS, their customer service is hard to beat.

[HeadLead]

Just read through this whole thread. Interesting comments and preferences. I purchased my 4500 off e-bay and just received my dies and top punches as well as the heater I ordered from MidwayUSA. I am looking forward to using it and will subscribe to this thread so I can watch for new developments or comments.

I may use my PID controller with a surface mounted sensor to control the heater.

[MT Chambers]

I have and use 3 Stars, 2 RCBS, 2 Lyman and from my experience the RCBS is a better choice then the Lyman as it is much more robust, and has no weaknesses, except the "off centre" probs. inherent with that type of sizer, and really only a concern if you're working with top accuracy loads in rifles.