Picking my first lever action rifle

[skippy]

I am planning on getting a rifle for recreational shooting, self defense and possibly TEOTWAWKI. Trying to get it right the first time. If I like my first choice I will buy a second identical one. One is none, two is one! Budget is about $1500 each, preferable less.

I am looking for:

1. Feed reliability with a variety of factory ammo.

2. Durability in extreme weather and rough handling (tumbling down rocky 45 degree embankments).

3. Ability to disassemble and reassemble with moderate skills and tools (I am ok with a 1911).

4. Manufacturers reputation for quality.

5. Lever action.

6. Reliable when dirty (like a sandstorm).

7. Compatible with quality ghost ring iron sights without custom gunsmithing.

8. New, currently manufactured.

9. No cross bolt safety.


I have narrowed it down to (any others?):

1886 Winchester/Miroku Extra Light 45-70
1892 Winchester/Miroku 357 magnum or 44 magnum
1894 Winchester/Miroku 30-30 or 38-55

All of these calibers, with the proper load, are more than adequate for any 2 or 4 legged critter that I might run afoul of. I would probably be handloading very light if I get a 45-70.

The Browning BLR is very nice and high quality but the insides look like a Rolex with all the gears; disassembly possible, reassembly improbable. Marlin has destroyed their reputation and I don't want to look for a good used one (used gun = somebody elses problem gun). Chiappa offers a nice 1892 44 magnum takedown Alaskan but very few in US and I hate to take a chance with an unknown (and they are priced near the top of my budget).

I guess my big unanswered question is which of these models and calibers has the best feed reliability, overall reliability and durability?

Thanks, Skippy

[JohnnyFlake]

With respect to the rifle, you may want to consider a Henry Golden Boy or maybe an Uberti Yellow Boy. The ones you have selected are fine guns.

My one thought that I have strong feeling about is your choice of caliber. You should take a hard look at the .45 Colt. It is very versatile and can be loaded light, at about 700fps with a 250gn cast RNFP or it can be loaded to near 45/70 power at 1500/1600fps with a 300gn cast RNFP.

[Rory McCanuck]

Made especially for the TEOTWAWKI scenario...

http://www.mossberg.com/products/rifles/mossberg-464/mossberg-464-spx
http://www.mossberg.com/assets/scripts/timthumb.php?w=625&zc=0&src=http://www.mossberg.com/sites/default/files/1329327678/%2341026_464SPX_30-30_SUPPRESSOR.png

[jmort]

Ah, a fellow Survival Blog reader. The 92 in .357 is a good choice. This article by Paco Kelly's from his web site www.leverguns.com will give you an idea of what the .357 can do in a strong lever action like the 92.
http://leverguns.com/articles/paco/357_magnum_and_the_literature.htm
I agree with Mr Flake about the beauty of the .45 Colt. Evil Roy site has some good deals on some 1873's that are tuned and short stroked http://www.evilroy.com/store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=1_4
Steve's Gunzs sells some "tuned" Rossi 92s that would be a real good choice.
http://store.stevesgunz.com/
For what you describe, a couple stainless R92s would be a good choice but the tuned short stroked 73s from Evil Roy are probably as good as it gets.
Regardless of which caliber you choose, .357 or .44 or .45 Colt, you can get some hand guns in the same caliber and use the same ammo.

[skippy]

Made especially for the TEOTWAWKI scenario...

http://www.mossberg.com/products/rifles/mossberg-464/mossberg-464-spx
http://www.mossberg.com/assets/scripts/timthumb.php?w=625&zc=0&src=http://www.mossberg.com/sites/default/files/1329327678/%2341026_464SPX_30-30_SUPPRESSOR.png

Yuk!!

[skippy]

With respect to the rifle, you may want to consider a Henry Golden Boy or maybe an Uberti Yellow Boy. The ones you have selected are fine guns.

My one thought that I have strong feeling about is your choice of caliber. You should take a hard look at the .45 Colt. It is very versatile and can be loaded light, at about 700fps with a 250gn cast RNFP or it can be loaded to near 45/70 power at 1500/1600fps with a 300gn cast RNFP.

I am not opposed to 45 Colt. In an 1892 is there any difference in feed reliability between the 357, 44 and 45?

[jmort]

Here is another article from Paco Kelly and Lever Guns site about the .45 Colt and will provide some more information that will help in your search.
http://leverguns.com/articles/paco/45coltlevergun.htm

[Artful]

I am planning on getting a rifle for recreational shooting, self defense and possibly TEOTWAWKI. Trying to get it right the first time. If I like my first choice I will buy a second identical one. One is none, two is one! Budget is about $1500 each, preferable less.

I am looking for:

1. Feed reliability with a variety of factory ammo.

2. Durability in extreme weather and rough handling (tumbling down rocky 45 degree embankments).

3. Ability to disassemble and reassemble with moderate skills and tools (I am ok with a 1911).

4. Manufacturers reputation for quality.

5. Lever action.

6. Reliable when dirty (like a sandstorm).

7. Compatible with quality ghost ring iron sights without custom gunsmithing.

8. New, currently manufactured.

9. No cross bolt safety.


I have narrowed it down to (any others?):

1886 Winchester/Miroku Extra Light 45-70
1892 Winchester/Miroku 357 magnum or 44 magnum
1894 Winchester/Miroku 30-30 or 38-55

All of these calibers, with the proper load, are more than adequate for any 2 or 4 legged critter that I might run afoul of. I would probably be handloading very light if I get a 45-70.

The Browning BLR is very nice and high quality but the insides look like a Rolex with all the gears; disassembly possible, reassembly improbable. Marlin has destroyed their reputation and I don't want to look for a good used one (used gun = somebody elses problem gun). Chiappa offers a nice 1892 44 magnum takedown Alaskan but very few in US and I hate to take a chance with an unknown (and they are priced near the top of my budget).

I guess my big unanswered question is which of these models and calibers has the best feed reliability, overall reliability and durability?

Thanks, Skippy

Ok, wake up - no end of mayan calender to worry about - Civil war not yet -

Now I have to say I like the lever action choices you put out, but I have to disagree with you about Used Gun = somebody elses problem gun, I knew lots of people that just bought a used gun used it for deer season and sold it back to gunshop.

Most good gun shops check for function / headspace etc before putting it out on the rack. While a nice shiney new gun is one of everyone's favorite toys, if your planning on making it a utility/beater I'd suggest getting a used in good condition and I would suggest a Marlin 336 or clone in 30-30 for a first purchase.

Points - easier to work on than Winchester design (love JMB but some of his designs are better than others) - 30-30 is easy to find ammo for and bottleneck shape lends itself to easy feeding - 30 caliber is easy to cast for - lots of molds available for it - minimizes consumption of your lead resources - longer range than pistol calibers - get a 100-120 grain plinker boolit mold for practice and small game - 170-180 grain FN for longer range / larger game - use the money saved for components and shoot the snot out of it, until it becomes an extention of your body. Customize with what you need to get it to work for you - Peep sight, sling, recoil pad - check rest/ammo carrier - mount a flashlight if you need that for TEOTWAWKI. Really want two (I did use this plan for awhile myself) go for it. And you'll still be out less than what you would have paid for ONE of your original choices.

Now I direct your attention to the used military gun rack - see those Mosin Nagant bolt action rifles - check the barrels out on those - if you find one with sharp bright bore and matching numbers - consider it - longer range than your lever gun and with a scope mounted you can really keep people back aways. Ammo is still inexpensive and you can stash all you'll need for a long period.

Have I tried other lever guns - yes - Have I taken guns apart and worked on them - yes - so I own Winchesters, Savages, Rossi, etc - yes - I have more Marlins than other brands - for what you describe I think it is the best choice for a lever action.

Do I get crazy with my guns - yes
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v355/rowdyfisk/FAL/762x39MauserWASRconversion.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v355/rowdyfisk/Misc/0612112302.jpg

Do you need to make it like this
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v355/rowdyfisk/Marlin_Tactical_Cowboy189545-70.jpg - NO

My $0.02, yours for free - you got what you paid for.

[starmac]

If any of them calibers you listed will do what you want and,or need, it is a no brainer. 30/30, ammo is cheap and sold anywhere ammo is sold. Even during the last ammo shortage, you couldn't buy, beg, or steal 22 ammo, but there was still 30/30.
We had searches out for 45 colt and no sporting goods store statewide with a box of ammo.
Will never be caught like that again, but I knew one person that bought a brand new pistol and couldn't fire it for over a month. lol

[skippy]

If any of them calibers you listed will do what you want and,or need, it is a no brainer. 30/30, ammo is cheap and sold anywhere ammo is sold. Even during the last ammo shortage, you couldn't buy, beg, or steal 22 ammo, but there was still 30/30.
We had searches out for 45 colt and no sporting goods store statewide with a box of ammo.
Will never be caught like that again, but I knew one person that bought a brand new pistol and couldn't fire it for over a month. lol

Years ago I bought a 357 Sig when they first came out. Couldn't get ammo for 3 months! Yeah, with today's prices anything but 30-30 requires a commitment to reload.

[btroj]

Buy a used Marlin 336 and never look back.

A used 336 will not be "someone else problem gun" as much as it will be a gun owned by a guy who shot a few rounds each year before deer season and nothing else.

You want ease of assembly for cleaning, etc. and tha means Marlin. The 92 and 94 Winchesters are a far more complex action, not something I would want to take apart very often. I take my Marlins down once a year or so for a good cleaning and relube.

The Win are nice rifles but simple actions and easy to take down they are not.

As for cartridge, 30-30 is the way to go. No question about that. Easy to find ammo for, easy to load for.

[gundownunder]

I've seen more Win 92 jam ups than Marlin 94 jam ups. I've only seen one with the dreaded Marlin jam and the owner has been shooting lever action competition with that rifle for 15 years, and it only started to jam a year ago.

If you want a decent hunting rifle I'd go 30-30, but if you want a good rifle for whatever happens, SHTF, defense, meat on the table, etc, I'd go a pistol round such as 357, 44, 45, etc. They don't over penetrate as bad (although I did see a 44 Mag factory load go through a window, a wall and a solid wood door when an idiot had an AD.).
Pistol ammo also weighs a lot less if you have to leave home and your vehicle behind at any time. There is a good reason the old cowboys carried both a rifle and revolver in 44-40.

[smkummer]

All good advice from above. Used model 336 Marlins all over the place starting at $300 and most will shoot a group 1/2 as small as a Win. 94 30-30. If it doesn't, put a 4X scope on it and it will. Takes more attention to get cast bullets to shoot well than the winchester but it can be done. Very few of us in the lower 48 would have us in situations that would need more power than a 30 cal 170 grain bullet at 2200 FPS. On the other hand, post 64 model 94 Winchesters are priced the same and generally shoot well enough for anyones 30-30 needs. A rear reciever sight helps the accuracy for most of us. For plinking fun at the range, nothing comes close to a pistol caliber rifle and the .357/38 would be the cheapest to feed. The .357 sending a 158 bullet out at 1700 FPS kills 2 or 4 legged critters dead but does not have the "womp!" when it hits a animal like the 44 or 45 calibers. If you watch any of Hickock 45 videos on y-tube, you can find him shooting a Marlin cowboy in 45 Colt and really having a knock out day in his back yard with one of these. This round loaded with the 300 and heavier bullets is often quoted at a light 45-70. When putting too much requirements for one gun it so much easier just to buy 2 guns and for myself those are used guns that can be bought for the price of one new gun. I own both a pre-64 model 94 in 30-30 and a Marlin 1894 in 44 magnum and feel my lever gun needs are meet, although I should add a 22 to the stable.

[rdlange]

Agree with btroj & others... used Marlin 336. Go to Marlin forum, they have a guide for checking a used rifle. An 1894 in 357 if you specifically want a 'combat lever', and will work for short range hunting. Mine looks 'normal' with a scout scope. A 30-30 should be less cost and as said, ammo is everywhere. Just fyi... I sold/traded all my Winchesters for Marlins.

[JohnnyFlake]

I am not opposed to 45 Colt. In an 1892 is there any difference in feed reliability between the 357, 44 and 45?

I really don't believe there is. Any given new rifle may have to be tweaked a bit but after that's done, if even needed, all of them should be very reliable.

Keep in mind that the .357, although powerful, is no where near what a .44 mag or .45 Colt can be, at the top end.

[Jeff H]

I'm not sure this will help you, so read on if you wish, but it may sound a bit lke lunacy. I came to the conclusion that the '92 in .357 is darned versatile but there are other very valid argumenst for other great combinations - and they still don't leave me alone, even as I use my carbine/cartridge choice to rather good effect.

I have beat the .357 carbine thing to death as far as being useful, versatile, easy to load for, easy to get ammo/components for, easy on the lead stash, can carry an awful lot of them in a small space (the cartridges, not the guns) and very fun to just mess around with, which means I use it a lot and that has made me pretty proficient with it.

The trouble is that I prefer a bigger bore handgun and don't own a .357 handgun - I have owned many but they have faded away in deference to bigger bores. The .357 makes a lot of sense to me in a carbine, but not as much sense (again, to me) in a handgun, so I have to fool with small pistol primers. The carbine shoots well for me out to 100 yards, and offhand, anything under that is pretty easy to hit. The .44 mag in a lever hurts me. Previous injuries make me hurt for a couple weeks after I shoot too many of anything of any noticable recoil.

I can load the .357 down to .22 CB noise levels or full tilt. Anything in between is good too with common and long and well known (and versatile) powders. Hard not to like it. If I shoot heavier than 158 grains, I start having accuracy and stability issues (Rossi with a 1:30 twist) but the 125s and 158s shoot very well.

HOWEVER, it's really flat here and the trees are sparse - wood lots here and there but lots of wide-open spaces. That means the 30-30 might have been a better choice and has haunted, goaded and chided me all the while I am making the .357 out to be such a wonderful thing - which it is, but the 30-30 keeps telling that it can do all that and better - except for the part about the space the ammo takes up and the weight of the rifle.

The .30 is not that much more difficult to cast for than the .357 and does not use up any more precious metals than the .357, the 30-30 shoots flatter and retains more energy at longer ranges with relatively similar bullets weights but is more likely to require a gas check than the .357 - at least so far for me.

The straight wall .357 has advantages in reloading and this is where the .44 mag. and .45 Colt rear their ugly heads and heckle me - "let's see you do that with black powder, Mr. Smarty-Pants," and I could choke the two fo them for muddying the decision! Yes, they ARE great cartridges but all I need is two more little voices in my head making the decision that much harder!

But the 30-30, maybe, I don't know, could get by with black', but what are the chances I would have to do that? All the same, the .44 and .45 keep bringing it up, not me.

So, a two-hundred yard shot at a coyote, or even a deer with a 30-30 would be easier for me to make than with any of the pistol cartridges, but I can't hunt deer here with a rifle. Coyotes show up now and then and need to be reminded that they must seek lunch elsehwere, as my little dogs serve another purpose, primarily making poop and keeping my Wife company while I am at work.

Hmmmm, 30-30, .357..............

I am sort of new to levers. When I got into this '92 design, I realized t here were a lot of screws and little parts and I have to say that it's a real contraption in there. I would NOT want to have to work on this thing in the field.

If I had to wander far from my home base for an indeterminate amount of time, I would want one of my Mausers. While this may sound like heresy to other Mauser fanatics, in this particular case, I would prefer a Swedish '94, '96, '38 or a Chilean '95 for simplicity's sake. I once dreamed of a .35 Remington on a Chilean '95 I had, sold, had back and sold again, and may yet buy back again. I love the '98s but the earlier models mentioned are much easier to take apart, in spite of the supposed pitfalls to this convenience. Wouldn't rule out an MN either - brutishly tough, simple and reliable.

Sorry for such a long post, but this whole notion rolls around in my head all the time and no one I know gets it or cares so I have to get it out once in a while. Ahhhhh, catharsis!

Oh, one more thing about the 30-30 - if I were to go that route, I would have to break down and BUY some JACKETED bullets, because the .308 Sierra 110 HP out of a 30-30 is wicked. In a lever, ONE in the chamber and ONE in the tube only - they are sort of pointy.

[starmac]

Is this going to be your one rifle or are you just wanting to add a lever to the your others.
Is this going to be your go to hunting rifle'
I would consider the game NM has to offer, elk, antelope, deer (mostly mule) and bear.
I would also consider the average ranges for said quarry (differs depending on what part of the state you hunt in).
I'm thinking that out of the calibers you have chosen, if I was only going to have one gun I would probably go with the 45/70., if the ammo is readily available off the shelf in NM.

[rbertalotto]

You can take a lead on the Henry rifles from Cowboy Action Shooting.........the Rimfire Henrys are great and very reliable......The centerfires..Not so much!


1. Feed reliability with a variety of factory ammo. (Winchester 92)

2. Durability in extreme weather and rough handling (tumbling down rocky 45 degree embankments). (Rossi 92 in Stainless Steel)

3. Ability to disassemble and reassemble with moderate skills and tools (I am ok with a 1911). (Marlin 336 or Marlin 1894)

4. Manufacturers reputation for quality. ( Rossi, Marlin (Pre Remington), Winchester/Miroku)

5. Lever action. (Is there anything else?)

6. Reliable when dirty (like a sandstorm). (None)

7. Compatible with quality ghost ring iron sights without custom gunsmithing. (All)

8. New, currently manufactured. (All Except Remington Marlins)

9. No cross bolt safety. (Current Winchester, Rossi, older Marlins)

I love Lever Actions.........Got myself a couple dozen of them from every manufacturer except Mossberg. From 1873 to current production.

http://images109.fotki.com/v143/photos/3/36012/69369/P1030479-vi.jpg

[rbertalotto]

Be sure to spend some time here:

http://www.levergunscommunity.com/index.php

The articles section is amazing. Lots of info there...........

[fouronesix]

I'll add another vote for a Marlin 336 in 30-30. Take some time looking around the usual places, classifieds, pawn shops, gun shops, friends, word of mouth, etc, Take some time inspecting the used guns. Bore condition and mechanical function are easy enough to check if you have the gun in hand. Oh, and for end of Mayan calendar stuff why a lever gun? I'd think along the lines of an MIA.

[northmn]

The 30-30 was the rifle of choice for the older depression era woodsy's I either knew or knew of in Northern MN when I was younger. They put a lot of meat on the table with them or 32 specials, including moose. A box of shells was supposed to mean about 18 deer if not the full 20. They were not particualry excellent shots as much as fussy nor did hunting season have the same meaning it does now. My daughter started out with a 30-30 and used it for at least 5 deer and I have taken a few with one myself.
Advantages of a 30-30. They can be handloaded with a variety of bullets. I have used everything from 120 grain to 190 grain. The 190 grain took out a deer at 140 steps from the tree very well. J bullets still only cost less than $15.00 a box and sometimes it is hard to justify handloading one. You can get the Leverevolution loads that are supposed to increase the range even more. 30-30 is easy to shoot. Rifles can be had new or used. many good used ones out there. Marlins and Winchesters are often drilled for mounting a peep sight. As for a matching pistol caliber, that was not universal in the Western days either as some wanted rifles when they carried a rifle and rifles can be made more efficient than the pistol calibers permit. The 30-30 took over and made obsolete all the old BP cartridges because it was easier to hit with at longer range. A lever 30-30 was a true survival rifle in its day, and still is agood one after over 100 years.

DP

[jp99]

If you want a decent hunting rifle I'd go 30-30, but if you want a good rifle for whatever happens, SHTF, defense, meat on the table, etc, I'd go a pistol round such as 357, 44, 45, etc. They don't over penetrate as bad (although I did see a 44 Mag factory load go through a window, a wall and a solid wood door when an idiot had an AD.).


To be honest any good defensive round should do what that .44 mag did, If it's gonna have the power to stop a person it's gonna have the power to go through a few walls. I've had .357 and .41 mags come close to penetrating 1/4" steel. Yes a .30 cal rifle round will penetrate more in most cases, however most rounds people pick for defense will be liable to go through every wall in their house.

http://www.theboxotruth.com/docs/bot1.htm

pictured is a 158 gr. speer gold dot .357 hit on a steel plate hanging from a chain at 100 yards. MY 158 gr. SWC actually put an even larger dent in it and nearly went through. I have also nearly gone through with 210 gr. bullets out of a 6" .41 magnum at 25 yards.

http://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/405354_3253581231752_1701826175_n.jpg

As for the question I like the 1892 any caliber should be fitting. I personally like the .357 and .41 magnum, but that is me. A larger action in .45-70 would be quite fun too.

Regards,

JP99

[Clinebo]

.45 Colt....nuff said!

http://i497.photobucket.com/albums/rr336/RCline69/ATV/IMG_0489.jpg

[jh45gun]

Buy a Marlin 30/30 used is fine if it passes muster and the bore is pristine, put a peep sight on it if it does not already have one. Then put a scout mount on it and put a red dot or similar type sight for fast handling. Or get a Angle eject Winchester 94 and do the same thing. I am going to make scout mount for my Post 94 that is not angle eject it involves a tapped dove tail blank and a hole drilled and tapped in the fore arm band and a base long enough to fit in length and fit on the barrel between the two points mentioned.

The pistol cartridges are fine but think about it if it is really SHTF scenario folks that have rifles and pistols in them calibers will be trying to scrounge for both. There are a heck of a lot of 30/30s out there and the ammo to feed them as mentioned you can buy 30/30 cal in just about every place that sells ammo including gas stations. I think I would give the 30/30 the nod on advantage for longer shots also.

I love the 45/70 I have a Marlin 95 but for the purposes you mentioned unrealistic. The 30/30 would much be better served. If you truly want it for SHTF 45/70 ammo is heavy and bulky compared to the other cartridges and it is expensive to buy factory and it might not be available everywhere. But on the plus side anything hit with it is gonna know it.

[jh45gun]

That Mossberg is poorly thought out and it should have just come with a plainer stock and it should have a scout scope mount with factory mounted peep sights. A simple forearm with maybe one rail on the bottom front would have made more sense than that ugly mess.

[starmac]

I don't think that mossberg was designed to be sensible or to be sold to a sensible crowd. lol

[jmort]

I like it, but Mossberg makes some "traditional" .30-30s and .22 LR lever actions. For some reason I think Jeff Cooper would like it, the "Brooklyn Assault Rifle" I think he called center-fire lever actions. It appears the bugs have been worked out by Mossberg, and the price is right on their 464s.

[northmn]

A few of the people buying "pistol" round rifles may be loading the rifles with questionable rounds for the pistol. They may not be totally interchageable anyway.

DP

[jmort]

^ The 73s are only good for SAAMI spec. So any of the clones or a real Colt would work. The 94s or 92s will work well with Ruger hand guns. But you are right, you need to think this through. I'd worry more about the 73s than the Ruger when it comes to pressure.

[jp99]

The pistol cartridges are fine but think about it if it is really SHTF scenario folks that have rifles and pistols in them calibers will be trying to scrounge for both. There are a heck of a lot of 30/30s out there and the ammo to feed them as mentioned you can buy 30/30 cal in just about every place that sells ammo including gas stations. I think I would give the 30/30 the nod on advantage for longer shots also.

The .38 special is still the most popular centerfire cartridge and most hand loaded. Just so happens that the Winchester 1892 chambered in .357 will cycle and chamber .38 specials. So I think it'd be easier to find .38 or .357 in a SHTF situation. A properly loaded .357 out of a rifle will knock a deer down at 200 yards. The .30 cal will naturally shoot flatter, both because it is slightly faster and has a better BC. I like the .357 because it will run fine in my revolvers and my rifle, and they are a little smaller and lighter cartridge with power that is coming close to the good old 30-30. I like the 30-30 too, but the fast sturdy 1892 action is by far one of my favorites, love the .357 ones and really would love to find one in .41 magnum for the right price at the right time some day.


A few of the people buying "pistol" round rifles may be loading the rifles with questionable rounds for the pistol. They may not be totally interchageable anyway.

DP

.357 magnum was originally loaded to 45,000-47,000 PSI, the L-Frame S&W was brought out when these loadings were slowly wrecking K-Frames that used a steady diet of full power .357 magnum. Sadly they also seem to have started to load down the .357 cases and have also recently started to make small frame revolvers in the .357 that will not take a .357 loaded to it's potential. So I would feel safe firing any heavy load I've done for my 1892 in any of my 686s, and definitely feel safe shooting them in a Ruger or Dan Wesson. I however wouldn't run them through a J-Frame or a Ruger LCR not only do to being dangerous to the frame, but also wouldn't be fun to shoot such in a light gun.

Regards,

JP99

[FergusonTO35]

I think the Mossberg 464 is worth a look. I have one and it's basically an updated Winchester 94 at a Mossberg price. The fit and finish is way better than the 94 I used to have and you can get it in stainless. For what it's worth, all my Marlin lever actions were purchased used and have given me no problems whatsoever, which I can't say for the 94 I purchased new in early 2003.

[popper]

So what is bad about a cross bolt safety? If you don't like it for a few $ you can get a 1 piece firing pin. I have a 336 30-30, never considered anything else. I'm not a brand name buyer, I go for function/reliability/price. If you beat it against a rock real hard you might break the stock. It is heavier than the 357 but I can load it from 22LR to full bore, no problem.

[boommer]

45 Colt-92 Winny my choice, 6 grs unique or 28 grs H110 where do you go with it,pee shooter or cannon.

[Crash_Corrigan]

I have and love my Marlin CB 38-55 Lever rifle. It holds 8 or 9 rounds in the tube and delivers accurate fire downrange at up to 350 yds. I have a globe sight on the front with the post and circle insert and a tang sight on the rear.

The recoil is low and I can and do use black powder quite a lot in this gun. I bought 500 cases from Starline at the beginning and I have not looked backwards. I handload and cast my boolits for it and I would not ever even consider looking for or buying factory rounds for it.

It has never had a j word bullet through it and probably never will.

Forget about the local gas station having ammo for it.....you hafta make it yourself. The action is simple to take down and clean and you do not have to be a brain surgeon to do it.

No lever rifle will do well in the sand and dust if you allow it to fall to the ground...for the most part it is reliable and would do well WTSHTF scenario takes place.

You can load this round light for small game or heavy for 2 and 4 legged critters.

[Olevern]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v355/rowdyfisk/Marlin_Tactical_Cowboy189545-70.jpg[/IMG] - NO

My $0.02, yours for free - you got what you paid for.


http://i885.photobucket.com/albums/ac56/Olevern/Marlin_Tactical_Cowboy189545-70.jpg

don't let Jim here on the board see that un......Janet'll never get that new couch!

[Jim]

I'm more afraid she would shoot me for coming home with such an abomination.

[Olevern]

Jim, you've just been out-bubba'd!

[youngda9]

I've settled on the Marlin 1894 pre-remlins. I have 2 in 44 mag (24" cowboy and 20" carbine). 10+1 in a carbine is attractive for any application. Very nice size and darn accurate, 1" at 50yds with cast boolits(RD-265gr @1650fps). Reloading cost is 8 cents a round with cast boolits, very good price and fast to re-load straight walled pistol cases many many times. It punches big holes in anything. It can be used for deer, hogs, bear, and Elk within the right range with 300 grainers for the larger animals. Most shots on game are going to be within 150yds. If you're hunting over a large field something else may be better, but most people don't need it.

I used to have a 30-30 but it didn't shoot well and took much more time to deal with the necked rifle cases for little performance improvement at the ranges I used it (<100yds)...actually I prefer bigger holes so I think the 44 is superior at ranges <150yds...and the 30-30 is only good for a couple hundred. Less capacity also in the rifle.

[Matthew 25]

I like the 45 colt or 44 mag choice. You'll never get that power out of a .357, but as you know you can make them as dainty as a 38 if you want. I've never considered reliability issues. I have a .357, two 44's, and a 45-70 in '92, '94, and '95 and I'm not sure I've ever had a problem (except for short-stroking due to poor technique).
There is no #1 answer here, but I do think the 44/45 caliber choice is best for a lever.

I have to ask, with the risk of being excommunicated...why would you choose a lever-gun in a pistol caliber for a SHTF scenario, given you can spend real money? There is absolutely, positively, not-even-close, no comparison of any lever gun to the complete *ss kicking ability of an M-14.

[I'll Make Mine]

I have to ask, with the risk of being excommunicated...why would you choose a lever-gun in a pistol caliber for a SHTF scenario, given you can spend real money?

The only sensible answer to this is being able to use the same ammunition in rifle and revolver -- never having the wrong ammo bag if you can only grab one gun during a bug-out, never having empty brass in one caliber and components for the other, etc. Not to mention that, as you note, a lever gun will still work -- even if you have to cobble up rounds with homemade black powder, buckshot, and primers reloaded with match heads. In .357 or .44 Mag, the lever gun works even if the only ammo you can dig up is the shorter case variety (.38 Special used to be the most common loaded ammunition in North America; it may be overtaken by 9 mm these days, but it's still available pretty much anywhere that has two or more calibers) -- in fact, it'll pick up a round or two in magazine capacity with the "shorts".

For a bug out bag, as opposed to a bunker, I think a lever gun in a cartridge that matches a revolver is an excellent choice; next best would be a blowback carbine chambered for the same rounds as a pistol (say, a Hi-Point 9 mm carbine to go with your Glock). I prefer muscle-operated mechanical guns for this scenario, just because in my opinion, they're more reliable with a wider range of ammunition. That said, I have a Mosin Nagant and three different calibers of handguns; that's what I have on hand, and I can't afford an upgrade any time soon.

[starmac]

IN all reality does many people worry about, or even think about a bugout situation when picking a caliber to buy? Just curious as it is not something I ever consider.
I can see the pistol calibers for the fun factor, but for my use they would be a tradeoff.

[jp99]

IN all reality does many people worry about, or even think about a bugout situation when picking a caliber to buy? Just curious as it is not something I ever consider.
I can see the pistol calibers for the fun factor, but for my use they would be a tradeoff.

Yes, I try to keep mostly the same calibers other than for specialty or collector firearms. I even try to have my bug-out or bug-in rifles share magazines, makes things much simpler if anything happens.

Regards,

JP99

[HiVelocity]

Buy what you're ultimately going to wind up with anyway................... a Rossi 92' in 45 Colt. For retail price plus sending it off for a reliability package, you would still have plenty of funds available left over to load and shoot with. I have full confidence in my 92' Rossi in 45 Colt, 285gr Lyman over 20.8gr of 4227 should make a real believer out of any intruder.

Sometimes more isn't better! Save your money, have fun.

Just my $.02 worth.

HV

[GREENCOUNTYPETE]

a 30-30 cartrige loaded with a cast 170gr boolit weight 23 grams a 44mag loaded with a cast 240gr boolit weight 25 grams i went with grams because it easily proved the point

so now that weight is negligible argue away