My KISS approach...will it work?

[ronbo40s&w]

Hi folks. Just a tiny bit about me. I am a former Air force B52 radar navigator. In My military flying time, i found myslef always looking for ways to simplify, while still maintaining checklist discipline.

When I started reloading, my primary goal was to shoot more for my money. I strongly resisted the idea of another hobby and decided reloading was a means to an end for me. Single stage, two calibers (probably the easiest two...308 and .223/5.56) of rifle-only reloading. I found myself doing a degree of load development on each caliber, but FORCED myself to stop and simply produce my best load to date in each in quantities adequate to keep me proficient and let me do some semi-auto blasting away/plinking like all good men/women will.

My best .308 load consistently groups under 3/4" at 100 yards and that satisfies me with a best group of .362"....but I don't want to just shoot the darned thing from a bench (and I don't). My mini 14 groups under 2 inches at 100 and I have done extremely little development on it...i use a load that groups under 1" in my savage bolt action and it is good enough for me.

Here's a dilemma I ask you cast boolit experts for help with. I have signed up here...simple. I have bought, sorted and cast my first bucket of ww into muffin ingots...simple. I have some free blessings headed this way in the form of brass and lee bottom pour pot. My son GAVE me an M&P40, and I have been reloading plated bullets on a lee loadmaster for awhile. SIMPLE, SIMPLE, SIMPLE, SIMPLE.

What's the dilemma? I can feel the demon of a new and complex hobby knocking at my door. Just stirring the shiney melt and casting simple muffin-shaped ingots made me feel like a revolutionary war soldier. I liked it! I can see myself overcomplicating, overspending and generally overdoing this as a hobby unto itself....and shooting less as a result. Anybody ever end up doing that? Honestly i can see myself re-melting ingots just for fun...lol.

This is my cry for help...Help me Keep It Simple...Stupid (me).


God Bless!

Ron

[bradh]

Ronbo, you drank the kool-aid didn't you?

[ronbo40s&w]

(Hiccup) Kool-aid? (hic) what kool (hic)-aid?

[ronbo40s&w]

Oh...i guess i should add, Ronbo is a nickname given me by my crew way back when...i like it when people use it...takes me back a little.

[1Shirt]

Just accept the reality and press on!!!!
1Shirt!

[mdi]

Well sir, you're standing on the presipus (sp?), er edge. Let yourself go. It's easier that way. The dark side welcomes you...

Welcome. Anyway, casting is fun, and prolly the most satisfying aspect of rolling yer own ammo.:bigsmyl2:

[ronbo40s&w]

Yeah..I figured as much. My buddy back home has been doing it since we were young. I guess i'll just have to see where this goes.

[runfiverun]

when you get into a hobby you will either expand your interest or the hobby will wane and die.
the direction you take will be based on your goals.
casting is the offshoot of your desire to keep things simple.
you can take the hobby of casting as far as you want, same as reloading.
keeping it as simple as possible is actually an extreme in the hobby of casting/reloading,
it takes more of your time to do it that way.

[gray wolf]

What's the dilemma? There is none, it ain't broke so don't fix it.I can feel the demon of a new and complex hobby knocking at my door. great fealing isn't it.Just stirring the shiney melt and casting simple muffin-shaped ingots made me feel like a revolutionary war soldier. You are a Soldier just a different time.I liked it! I can see myself overcomplicating, overspending and generally overdoing this as a hobby unto itself...It is.and shooting less as a result.
You wont.Anybody ever end up doing that? yup
Honestly i can see myself re-melting ingots just for fun...lol.and the problem Is ??

This is my cry for help...Help me Keep It Simple...Stupid (me).
ain't going to happen, go with the flow and enjoy, look in the mirror and say ""I am normal""

[ronbo40s&w]

Lol..thanks. Good analysis.

[3006guns]

Don't worry........you'll be fine. Until the "investigative bug" gets you.

"Well, golly gee....those cast pistol boolits were fun and cheap. I wonder how much trouble it is to cast for a rifle? Can I get decent velocity without leading? What are the terminal ballistics like? Hey, maybe I can shoot that gun Dad brought back from the war!"

Trust me, a separate shop building can be very comfy...........:kidding:

[geargnasher]

My advice is keep it simple......buy a nice Smith & Wesson .38 Special, get an RCBS die set, Lee tumble-lube, two-cavity mould for it, a Lee push-through sizer kit, a Lyman casting ladle, and cast boolits out of a small iron pot over a propane burner outside. Mix up a batch of Recluse's 45/45/10 tumble lube formula with the liquid Alox that comes with the sizer, buy a pound of Bullseye, and enjoy the heck out of it. That should keep you going for at least a year, and minus the gun, brass, and primers, cost you less than a hundred bucks.

Then, if you like it, you can start buying gear for the .308. If you don't, you'll have a nice revolver anyway.

Gear

[Wayne Smith]

Yup, done and done. Spend more time casting and reloading than shooting, but then the range is an hour drive one way.

[ronbo40s&w]

Funny thing...I have been looking at the Police trade-ins on Buds gun shop...269 bucks for s&w model 10 in .38 special! Lol..it's too late, I am loading for the .40 already...today i put several draw and shoot shots into the dead center of 1 and 2 inch orange sticky targets at 8 yards. Those were Missouri bullets. I suspect my own cast can do the same.

Hooked...the ingots are made, the gift bottom pour pot is enroute...i lack a mold, but It looks like at least the .40 is going to see some cast bullets soon....308 can wait. It's all set for deer season anyway.

Um, nobody made any effort to talk me out of it...lol. Thanks anyway. looks like a two bullet mold to start, unless you guys think the 6 bullet mold is worth twice as much money for a new guy. I kind of like the idea of a wooden handle on the sprue plate...your thoughts?


God Bless!

Ron

[StratsMan]

Geography may affect your time, too... As Wayne just indicated, a nearby range can keep you focused on shootin' and just reload as necessary... When my home range was only 10 minutes away I'd work up j-loads, go shoot 'em, then go back to the bench at home and go to the next step in my workups... no time for casting, 'cuz I was too busy shooting...

Now the nearest range is indoors with limits on centerfire rifles (223 only), and the nearest public rifle range is about 40 minutes away... So now I enjoy casting, working up (and shooting) new pistol loads indoors, and rarely shoot rifles anymore....

I do miss shooting Garands....

[ronbo40s&w]

My range is 150 feet from my patio. I quick walk east and I'm there. I even jog to get the heart rate up a little for the first few shots. I see what you mean about doing less rifle..i never thought that would be possible, since I LOVE shooting rifles. Still, the cost factor and the multiple challenges really make this a hobby with imbedded hobbies..loving it!

If you can see my avatar, you'll understand I actually like to crawl with a rifle for exercise and training. That will always be that way, but you don't need as much ammo for that either.

I'm grateful for this site.

God Bless!

Ron

[PuppetZ]

I started shooting, reloading and casting a year ago all at the same time. My first cast were done with a lee mold, propane stove and a small soup paddle. Can't do much more simple than that. Since then I spent a bit on more tooling(lucky me SWMBO doesn't know exactly how much...). I must say that casting has made shooting all the more enjoyable as there is a little bit of me going down range every time I squeeze that trigger.

If you want to limit the amount of experiment you do, go the exact same way you have with your j-word loads. Work up one that satisfy you and keep up with it. As for me I'm a finished tinkerer and I'll keep changing my loads "just to see if it gets better"




Um, nobody made any effort to talk me out of it...lol. Thanks anyway. looks like a two bullet mold to start, unless you guys think the 6 bullet mold is worth twice as much money for a new guy. I kind of like the idea of a wooden handle on the sprue plate...your thoughts?
Ron

Why would we do such a thing and cut you off from the great sense of accomplishement when you realize that you can make a bullet that will shoot with the best of them in your garage?

As for the 2 or 6 cavities....Depends on how many you want to do. A 6 cavities produce a lot more in the same time. I you like to shoot a lot, I would urge you to just get the 6 cavs. A 2 cav for a slow firing weapon should be ok. Anything that fires semi-auto, get a large mould for it. These eats through a pile of boolit at an amazing rate!!

Hope that helped.

Frank

[shooter93]

Casting can be as simple or as complicated as you like. Do as Gear says or something similar and shoot to your hearts content. Or.........if you enjoy it you can forget ever saving money, keep looking for better and/or faster ways, strive for high velocity accuracy, experiment with many many different molds and lubes (this list goes on forever ya know,lol) and then finally admit like the bulk of us here that the demon has won. The choice is yours.

[LUBEDUDE]

"Yup"


Hank Hill

[SciFiJim]

Honestly i can see myself re-melting ingots just for fun

Yep, been there done that! It is part of the initiation and learning process. I started out with a single cavity round ball mold. It will definitely teach you patience. It will also teach you a great deal about casting lead, from melting stage to cooling stage and that with molds you need to watch for the secondary draw of molten lead from the sprue as it cools.

Also, with this, like many other things, the more you learn the more you realize there is to learn. That too is part of the process.

[williamwaco]

I can feel the demon of a new and complex hobby knocking at my door. Just stirring the shiney melt and casting simple muffin-shaped ingots made me feel like a revolutionary war soldier. I liked it! I can see myself overcomplicating, overspending and generally overdoing this as a hobby unto itself....and shooting less as a result. Anybody ever end up doing that? Honestly i can see myself re-melting ingots just for fun...lol.

This is my cry for help...Help me Keep It Simple...Stupid (me).


Ron


Sorry Ronbo.

It is to late for you. You are already gone . . .

[dromia]

I shoot to cast.

I shoot to handload.

Seems simple enough to me. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/adamsutherland/Smilies%20FB/FB%20UK%20Smilies%202/icon_e_wink.gif http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/adamsutherland/Smilies%20FB/FB%20UK%20Smilies%202/icon_lol.gif :lovebooli

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

You should be doing this just because the government doesn't want you to. You'll be following directly the line of all those soldiers all the way back to the minute man. His government didn't really want him either, but they needed him and he delivered, then they made the government permanent and they settled down into a slightly uneasy peace with it, always keeping that rifle handy just in case.....Seems like a great thing to do to me. Now where's that .223 caliber mold?

[ronbo40s&w]

Hahaha...yeah, there's that too! now THAT would be some cheap boolits...handloading for .223! That would put the mini 14 back in the affordability to shoot category. That thing simply burns it faster than i can afford to reload it lately. Then again, my same buddy from NY just gave me some 55 gr fmj winchester bullets with cannelure to try. He gave me 500 to try! And says i can have more if i like them, so i guess I can't cast any cheaper than that. I just need to get after it and stockpile some .223 so i can shoot the thing. Seriously it eats ammo like my .40 and I love to shoot it. I wish there was a powder that only took 4.5 grains for that one!

[thegreatdane]

Welcome to the do-it-yourself addiction of ammunition perfection :)

so rewarding

:cbpour:

[MtGun44]

The hobby will be what you make it. If you want simple, do what gear has suggested or
something similar that fits your needs. Let the complexity come because you want it or
keep it away, as you choose. I only had two molds for 20+ yrs, now have more than
65, really lost count. Before it was just for making ammo, now it is a hobby.

Bill

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Hahaha...yeah, there's that too! now THAT would be some cheap boolits...handloading for .223! That would put the mini 14 back in the affordability to shoot category. That thing simply burns it faster than i can afford to reload it lately. Then again, my same buddy from NY just gave me some 55 gr fmj winchester bullets with cannelure to try. He gave me 500 to try! And says i can have more if i like them, so i guess I can't cast any cheaper than that. I just need to get after it and stockpile some .223 so i can shoot the thing. Seriously it eats ammo like my .40 and I love to shoot it. I wish there was a powder that only took 4.5 grains for that one!

There isn't, but we can help you with this little problem. Think 844 and 846 surplus powder bought in 8 pound jugs from places like hi tech ammo and jeff bartletts.....oh and surplus brass can be had for various folks fairly inexpensively. Like around $100.00 for 2000 shipped - 85 for the brass, 15 for the fixed rate box (got some right here). And if you need primers, those wolf primers from Widener's are only $14.00/1k when bought in 5K bulk lots.....There's a group buy for a .223 - 55gr bullet going right now in the group buy section of this board and it's not too late to get on the list:violin:

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

See how easy it is to get help?

[ronbo40s&w]

Wow. It's like a 12 step program for castaholics.

God Bles!

Ron

[scarry scarney]

Ronbo-STOP. Do not look into the silver stream, repent now. Just send your equipment to me and be done with the evil demon!:-D

[pastor]

its not simple, not uncomplicated, not cheap, sometimes not alot of fun, wont save money, will take up alot of time, will consume you, etc,etc,etc........

you will love it

[ronbo40s&w]

Ronbo-STOP. Do not look into the silver stream, repent now. Just send your equipment to me and be done with the evil demon!:-D

So far my equipment is my daughters camp stove, a 1 gallon stainless steel measuring container (I thought it was only 2 qt..i was mistaken), a few dollar store spoons and an old muffin tin. Postage to send it would be more than i have in it...lol...the silver stream sure is purty...

God Bless!

Ron

[rbuck351]

You are going to love the Lee drip o matic as it will really simplify the casting part. I would get the Lee 6cav for your 40 as it will make them almost as fast as you can shoot them.
I can't help you though as you are already completely hooked.

[Bullet Caster]

Ronbo, turn back now before it's too late. DO NOT look into the silvery stream or you will be hooked into an addiction that there's no turning back. I started casting about a year ago and one look into the silvery stream was all it took. KISS (Keep It Simple, Stupid) really works.

I started out with a wobbly cast iron pot from flea bay and a Lee ladle which I've modified a couple of times now. It's now over 18" long with a wooden handle attached with 2 hose clamps. I did manage to update my pot. I found a nice flat bottom pot that holds 20 lbs. + over the previous one that is delegated to smelting wheel weights now. I still use my Coleman camp stove and am torn between a nice turkey fryer burner and an electric pot.

I've only got 2 cavity moulds, all Lee's, 1 124TL 9mm, 3 .45's, 1 .312 155 grain for the AK-47, 1 200 grain .309 for the M1 Garand and a .490 round ball mould for the flintlock. I prob. should have gotten 6 cavity moulds since my autos consume ammo at an alarming rate just as your mini 14 does. However, I'm not a really high volume shooter as most here are.

My goal is to have 1000 rounds for each weapon on hand. Quite a task for 2 cavity moulds. Enjoy the hobby as it looks like you're completely hooked and there's no turning back.

StratsMan, you should never have given up on the M1 Garands. Mine is a pleasure to shoot and is the best shooting firearm I own. Everyone needs an M1 Garand. Part of our history. BC

[W.R.Buchanan]

Ronbo: I don't understand, what is your question? You're already past the short answer.

If you want simple, get a Classic Lee Loader and a plastic mallet. It doesn't get any simpler than that.

I added a small pot and a ladel, and Lee bullet mould next and cast .44's over my kitchen stove (pre wife)

Since you are already beyond that, you might as well accept reality and just open the flood gates.

Hobbies all require passion to function properly, and passion means money spent.

Might as well accept it and move on.

You'll be happy you did.

Randy

[ronbo40s&w]

Well, the election results certainly motivate me to make as much cheap ammo as possible. Off we go!

God bless!

Ron

[429421Cowboy]

Dave beat me to it, Widners sells surplus powder and pull-down .223 bullets that make great ammo for the Mini to chew through for CHEAP!

Like many here, i was a gun nut before i started reloading a few years back when i was 17. I enjoy working on my rifles, gear, cutting my own meat, and generally having the ranch attitude that i can probably make it better, for cheaper, if i weld, nail, sew, drill or any combination to make what we need. I had always been interested in reloading and had helped friends load before, but getting a magnum revolver made me realise that $35/50 of watered down "cowboy" ammo (hate that term) was either gonna make me really broke, really quick, or not let me shoot enough to get any better. Once i started loading, i was hooked! Now its rifle, precision, minimize run-out of loaded rounds just grnerally seeing how far this can go. Most of us go till we plateau, then start looking for the "next step" in the sport i.e casting, swaging, wildcatting, building rifles, making your own black powder all the way down the line...
There are guys on this forum that have went so far as to build their own presses, dies, case feeders, cleaners and a thousand other things. Sure this shows that we have some truely great machinists, metal and wood workers or tool and die men, but part of me wonders if they do it just to prove they can, and to find a new challenge in this hobby of ours.
It has gotten me to the point of shooting to reload, and i am almost to where Goodsteel's plan of getting a trade in .38 to blast cast cheap, just so i can load more!
So from where i sit, you have a long way to go before you have over-compicated this sport!

Good luck to you, God bless the Blue!I am from a big USAF family!

[gunoil]

Clean-nick-LEE addictive! yes it is... Boolit kingdom.











Gotta job at 82nd Airborne motor pool, yea! I love it.