new mystery mold

[brotherdarrell]

Picked this up today for not a lot of $$$. It is 44 caliber, missing all screws and sprew plate. Is is also appears to be in very good shape, with just a little lead around the cavities. No rust either. This is the third time I have seen this mold at the local gun show and finally offered $20.

There are no markings at all on this mold (as in zero). Vent lines are very faint, much like the markings on the outside of the mold.

One thing that does not make much sense in the handle screw holes. On one side the hole is threaded at the top and the other side is drilled through with the threads on the bottom. There is also no set screw for sprew screw.

Near as I can tell all three bands are the same diameter.
http://i1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff489/brotherdarrell/DSC00065.jpg
http://i1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff489/brotherdarrell/DSC00067.jpg
http://i1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff489/brotherdarrell/DSC00069.jpg

Thanks

brotherdarrell

[blaser.306]

Looks to be a Saeco / redding ?

[BCall]

Looks like an older Saeco mold. I have a similar mold. The handle screws are different, one is used as the sprue plate screw as well as a handle screw. The third hole on top is for a sprue plate stop.

There are no holes on the ends though? Mine is drilled through on one end for the set screw that holds the sprue plate/handle screw.

I don't remember if mine is marked, but I know alot of the older Saeco molds were marked on the sprue plate, so if it is lost or replaced, it is hard to tell what the mold is exactly.

[Ben]

Yes, an older SAECO.

[brotherdarrell]

BCall - nope, no holes on the end.

If I understand you right, the one screw holds both the sprew plate and serves at a handle screw? Does the plate have to be removed to remove the handle?

What are the odds of getting these parts from SAECO?

brotherdarrell

[BCall]

You are correct, the screw serves as both handle and sprue plate screw. I'll see if I can get some pics of mine up soon.

I doubt Saeco will have screws for this mould. You'll probably have to Find some that will work at the hardware store as they no longer use the same type of setup. The sprue plates are available, but expensive. BACO has them cheaper than getting them from Saeco.

http://www.buffaloarms.com/Detail.aspx?PROD=163703&CAT=3850

[MikeS]

You should be able to get the sprue plate from Redding, or Baco. As for the screws, they're 10-32 thread IIRC, so you could probably get them at a local hardware store. If you get the plate from Redding, you could get one of the mounting screws from them (the one that doesn't hold the sprue plate, it's a headless long screw, something hard to find at most hardware stores), but get the one that holds the sprue plate from a hardware store.

[BCall]

Here is my mold I am talking about. It is an older Saeco 321. It has the original sprue plate that is marked "Saeco Custom Precision no 321". The blocks are not marked at all.

You can see on the side with the sprue plate stop, the hole is not drilled all of the way through and I used a set screw as a handle screw. I found one just long enough to touch the bottom half and not extend above the block so it won't interfere with the sprue plate. Sorry, I dunno what size they are. I just took mine to the hardware store and found something that fit.

The other side is not tapped on the top half of the block, it is drilled straight through and tapped on the bottom half. Yours appears to be done the same way. I just found a socket head cap screw that fit and ran with it. Mine has a set screw drilled through the end though that locks that screw in position. It is a pain though as you have to adjust the sprue plate tension each time you use the mold. Either that or keep it mounted to handles permanently.

If yours is drilled all the way through like mine is on that side, but without a set screw, you could always cut the plate screw just long anough to go about half way through the bottom part of the block, and then use a small set screw up through the bottom to help lock the sprue screw in place. HTH, Billy
http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh259/blcall/SN852346.jpg
http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh259/blcall/SN852347.jpg
http://i258.photobucket.com/albums/hh259/blcall/SN852348.jpg

[brotherdarrell]

I figured I would have to make my own sprew plate, and for $27 I can afford to screw up the first couple.:shock:

MikeS, they do appear to be 10-32. Should'nt be too hard to find something.

BCall, thanks for the pics, they will help a lot.

brotherdarrell

[MikeS]

Darrell, your time must be very cheap. Whenever I see somebody willing to make something themselves, rather than buying the proper part, it ruffles my feathers. I used to be in the leather working machinery business, and our main machine was a sewing machine used to sew very thick leather, and is used by most all of the larger holster makers, and many of the smaller ones. The biggest advantage our machine had over other machines of the same type was that we still supplied ALL of the parts for them, whereas all of the competing machines had gone out of business long ago, and parts were NOT available for them. Well, a gun magazine did an article about one of our customers, and in the article, they stated "Like most holster makers they use the Campbell stitchers, machines first made over 100 years ago, and using old machines like that, parts are hard to find, and often they have to make their own parts" which really got me peeved, as they mentioned our machine by name, none of the others, then said parts can't be gotten which was an outright lie. So anyone considering getting one of our machines that read that article would be mislead to think they couldn't get parts, when in reality it was just that company being cheap, and thinking they would save money by making their own!

How much do you value your time? Would you work for $27.00/hour? How long do you figure it will take you to make one of these sprue plates? As it'll be your first sprue plate like it, would it be safe to say it'll take more than an hour? Do you think the one you make will work as well as one of their sprue plates?

I'm not telling you not to make one, I'm just saying that if you do, and then have problems with the mould, you might be blaming the mould for something your sprue plate caused, then feel you have to avoid Saeco moulds. And as I already said, I'm kind of sensitive to do-it-yourselfers making a fairly cheap part so they can save some money, when they make the mistake of not putting a dollar value on their own time. It's then easy to say that the company is cheating folks, after all, for a $0.50 piece of steel I was able to make a sprue plate, and the company wants $27.00!

[rintinglen]

Mike, I hear you, but I think you are making a leap that doesn't follow. The time we spend on our hobbies is not valued the same way as the time we spend on our jobs. And the moneyt we spend on our hobbies frequently is limited by the demands that the rest of our life makes. I make holsters as a hobby--I make tools for use in that hobby. The time I spend on the tool is part of the hobby.
If I put even a minimum wage value on my time, I could never justify making anything. So I'd have three store-bought holsters, not boxes of them that I made myself. Nor would I have the satisfaction that comes from being able to say, "I made it myself."
In fact, I can not justify making boolits--too time intensive. It's cheaper to buy them.
But, I like to make them.

[9.3X62AL]

This!----^^^^^

[cbrick]

I have the same mold in 45 caliber, 4 cav, no sprue plate and not a mark or stamp on it anywhere. It is an older SAECO and looks identical to other older SAECO's that I have. When I want to use that mold I simply borrow the sprue plate from one of the other SAECO's and it's a perfect fit.

This mold hasn't been used though since I got a very similiar bullet in a MP brass 4 cav (MP clone of RCBS 270), what a joy it is casting with that.

Rick

[brotherdarrell]

MikeS - just to be clear on one thing; I never said the sprew plate was over-priced nor did I say the company was cheating by doing so. Those words never escaped my keyboard.:-?

Why reload when you can buy factory?

Why cast boolits when you can just buy them?

Why make anything when you can just buy it?

If I followed that logic I would be dead broke instead of just looking dead broke.:veryconfu

Why buy a used mold when you can just buy a new mold?

How about we just throw money at something instead of finding a fix? Heck, our wonderful govt. does that all the time and we are in great shape, yes?

Why do I make my own recurves and longbows instead of "just buying" a new one?
Why do I tie my own flies instead of......... well, you get the idea yet?

It is just possible that I might learn something while making a sprew plate. Suitable material will have to be found, measurements will have to be taken, holes will have to be drilled and surfaces will have to be lapped (now where did I put my granite block?). Hmm, may have to take a class at the Comm. College to do this one.:confused:

I really don't have much of a problem with you posting your opinion, it is a free world and all that. And me ruffling your feathers is, well.... oh well? The only part that ruffles my feathers is having someone telling me how to spend my money/time. That, sir, is absolutely none of your business so please get over it, I know I will very soon.

Please have a nice evening

brotherdarrell

[MikeS]

Darrell, You are right, and I apolgize for jumping on you.

It was just the way you said that you figured you would have to make one that jumped out at me. Now if the mould was a Modern Bond, or an old Winchester mould, or some other mould where you can't go out an buy a sprue plate, then saying you'll have to make one wouldn't have bothered me. Or if you had said something like "well, I guess I'll take a shot at making my own sprue plate", or something like that. I'm not trying to tell you how to say things, you certainly can say/do anything you want, like I said, it was just the particular way you said it that sparked a nerve in me, which is totally my problem, not yours.

As long as you're going to make a sprue plate for the mould, make it thick enough so it can hold some heat. Also, while the sprue plate needs to be flat, it doesn't need to have a lapped smooth finish, in fact there are some companies that make their sprue plates and leave the bottom with a medium finish so the machine marks act as vents. Another thing, I don't know how you normally cast, but if you like to open the mould with just a gloved hand, as I do, when making the plate you can make the stub part (I don't know the exact name, I'm talking about the part usually tapped with a mallet to open the mould) longer than normal to give you more leverage when opening the mould. The centrally hinged sprue plate like Saeco uses is nice as you don't have any of the cavities too far from the hinge like you do with most other 4 cavity moulds. Once you've made the sprue plate, please post pictures here, as I always like to see how projects like this turn out.

And finally, please accept my apology, I really wasn't trying to jump on you personally.

[Castlead]

I make lots of stuff. Never thought about charging myself as I would have to call the collection agency on myself so just to stay on good terms with me, myself and I, I just do it pro bono!

[brotherdarrell]

MikeS - no biggie. I come from a long line of tight wads, and will pinch a penny trying to get change. I also come from a long line of Jack-of-all-trades Master-of-none types who enjoy learning how to do things. One thing I could learn from this is that it might be a whole lot cheaper and easier just to order the darned sprew plate.:veryconfu, but I "only payed $20 for this darned thing" and I would hate to ruin that by spending another $30 making it not such a good deal. The fact that Saeco 4-cavities now run over $150 makes me think you might be right.:shock:

As far as mis-reading what I was saying, well..... that happens a lot to me as my communications skills are horrible at best.

Appology accepted, not that it was necessary.

brotherdarrell

[JIMinPHX]

The handle screw slot design with one side threaded & the other side drilled thru is actually used in several different types of molds. A few examples of ones that I have run into are below.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=27543&d=1292034616

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=27544&d=1292035065

I would have gladly paid $20 for those blocks. I think that you got a good buy there. Of course, I've fooled around with making my own sprue plates before.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=23560&d=1278708753

[brotherdarrell]

Jim - I've looked at the picture of sprew plates three times and I can't seem to find one that will work, guess I have to make one.:mrgreen:

Luckily I spent better than 12 years working in Ace/True Value stores so I have a pretty good idea of what screws are available. Have most of it worked out, just need a chunk of steel to make the plate.

Thanks to all

brotherdarrell

[9.3X62AL]

Cool deal, sir. Enjoy--that's the object of the exercise, after all.

[Buckshot]

...............Not to be TOO off topic, but one morning the towelbar/handle on the sliding glass door of the shower broke. One of the little cheapie chrome plated plastic deals at either end of the bar. I could have made the 7 mile round trip to Lowes and gotten another pair for maybe $6, and been done in less then an hour. Instead ............

I decided I'd make my own. I band sawed off 2 pieces of 3/4 x 1.5" aluminum, put'm in the mill vise and brought them both to the same length. Humped the rotary table up onto the mill and centered it. With a centercutting 4 flute 3/4" endmill bored a hole halfway through one. Removed it and did the same to the other. At that point once a hole was D&T'd into the base for the mounting screw they would have been done. Square, but done.

It wouldn't have been right so I set one up on the rotab over a couple pieces of 1/4" alum and clamped it. Then cranking the rotab a half turn I turned a radius on the outboard end. Removed and repeated for the other one. NOW, I could in good conscience stop and install them, but I was having too much fun [smilie=w:

I took out the 3/4" endmill and put in a 1/2" ballnose endmill. I then created a concave feature on the outside perimeter of each piece. That took longer then everything else as each one had to be moved and re-clamped 3 times. It took me a bit over 3 hours (including a couple stops) to make both pieces. But by golly I now had a couple industrial strength towel bar holders that were rather appealing to the eye ............ in a heavy duty kind of way! I'd made them 3/4" longer then the old ones so that when I'm sitting in the library in the morning I can set my coffee cup on the towel bar, and it leans against the glass door.

..................Buckshot

[MikeS]

Buckshot, after that writeup we need PICs!