Question on brass jackets & cases

[Danth]

Hello all: Not really a swaging question, but you guys are working brass in ways which might lead to the answer to my problem. I have been trying to full length resize original 25-20 Single shot brass and having all kinds of problems. Wrinkles, collapsing and worse of all, separation at the neck leaving some of the brass in the die. I was wondering if annealing the necks would worsen the separation problem, or help. Does annealing effect the strength of the brass, or the malleability or both? On another note, I've been swaging 22cal bullets from 22lr brass without any annealing and haven't run into any wrinkle problems. Think I'm lucky, or maybe my particular dies for some reason don't require annealing? Thanks for your thoughts, Dan

[blltsmth]

First of all, annealing will soften up the brass for full length re-sizing and should help. Secondly,use a good lube, sparingly like Imperial Sizing die wax. Dis-assemble and clean your dies first with a good solvent to get all the crud out and then proceed with re-sizing. If it is new brass,it will probably be thicker than old brass. If it is old,once fired brass, definetely anneal about the top inch of the case first. Hope this helps.

[DukeInFlorida]

My guess is that you aren't using the right kind of lube for sizing.

Or, perhaps the dies might even be marked wrong.

I would contact the maker of the dies, and send them back to them, along with some of your brass, for a die repair. I;m sure they will he happy to fix it right for you.

[Danth]

Thanks guys. I'm using old original brass. I just got the sizing die back from RCBS. They removed the broken off piece, polished, replaced the pin and lock nut. I can't say enough for their service. Really a top notch company. I've used several lubricants; RCBS, Lee and even WD-40. They seem to all work about the same, apparently not very well. I'm going to anneal and try again. I thought it might worsen the problem and really didn't want to send the die back to RCBS again. I'll try the Imperial wax as well. Forgot to mention one of the breaks was right at the base of the case. What a pain getting the stuck portion out! Any secrets on how to best remove? Best, Dan

[blltsmth]

Taps that barely grab the inside of the case have worked best for me!

[.22-10-45]

Hello, Danth. You said cases were old original? Those broken cases could be from the old style mercuric priming. In that case..nothing will fix them, and they would not be safe to use.

[runfiverun]

^^^^^^ right there^^^^.
i know these cases are about unobtanium, but you are having annealng issues.
most likely caused by the mecuric priming or black powder used origionally.
you really need to be careful annealing these small cases,and it may not help these particular ones.

[SquirrelHollow]

I definitely sounds more like brittle cases, than a problem with the die or lubricant.

[Danth]

If the cases are brittle, will annealing them resolve the problem?

[DukeInFlorida]

NO.
The brittleness has to do with the poor chemistry in general of the brass.

Annealing the cases will weaken them and make them unable to handle the pressures of detonation, Annealing anything other than just a neck is dangerous.

I'd part with (toss) the old troublesome brass, and try to get some new good quality brass to use for reloading.

[Danth]

Thanks everyone for your replies. I knew this was the right place to get the information I needed. Best, Danth

[Wayne Smith]

Buffalo Arms has Bertram brass for your 25-20 Single Shot.