Help with a load for 45 Colt for hunting.

[joec]

Ok what I have are some Ranch Dog TLC454-290-RF molded bullets with the GC. Now I looked over his loading tips and see he calls for a load of Lil'Gun of 25.5 gr while in another spot he shows a maximum of 24 gr of Lil'Gun. I'm looking for a minimum load for Lil'Gun with the 290 gr .454 bullet. This is to be fired out of a Rossi 92 Rifle with 20" octagon barrel in 45 colt. These are for pigs and perhaps deer at close ranges not more than 100 yards.

Oh and I'm a bit leery of starting at the maximum levels ever and prefer to work up. I would especially appreciate any information from anyone that might have used the powder or bullet.

[454PB]

That sounds hot for a .45 Colt, and about what I use for .454 Casull.

If it were me, I'd start at around 19 grs. of Lil'Gun for .45 Colt and a 300 gr. boolit.

[joec]

That sounds hot for a .45 Colt, and about what I use for .454 Casull.

If it were me, I'd start at around 19 grs. of Lil'Gun for .45 Colt and a 300 gr. boolit.

Thanks 454

I was thinking of reducing around 10% of his max, however he has the max listed as 24 gr while he is shooting them at 25.5. I also wasn't sure if Lil'Gun was similar to H110 that it is suggest should only be lowered by 3% instead of 10% as most others. I just want to start out with a safe load that won't damage my rifle. Now I know the Rossi 92 will handle Ruger loads for their pistols with no problems at all.

At any rate I think I will take your advise and start around 19 gr and work up. The bullet is a custom design so not much data on it.

[Clinebo]

Is Lil Gun the only powder you want to use? I reload for my Ruger Vaquero and Rossi '92. For the pistol I use Unique and for the rifle loads for hunting I use either 2400 or H110. The H110 is a bit more accurate, but I have a LOT of 2400 so I use that the most. I'm not pushing as heavy a bullet (255 RNFP). But there is some info here that might help you some.

http://www.realguns.com/loads/45coltr.htm

[joec]

Is Lil Gun the only powder you want to use? I reload for my Ruger Vaquero and Rossi '92. For the pistol I use Unique and for the rifle loads for hunting I use either 2400 or H110. The H110 is a bit more accurate, but I have a LOT of 2400 so I use that the most. I'm not pushing as heavy a bullet (255 RNFP). But there is some info here that might help you some.

http://www.realguns.com/loads/45coltr.htm

It is the only powder on his list that I have on hand. I do have some other powders including Unique but not 2400 or H110. I also would like to duplicate how well his bullets work with pigs size and up game.

[454PB]

Thanks 454

I was thinking of reducing around 10% of his max, however he has the max listed as 24 gr while he is shooting them at 25.5. I also wasn't sure if Lil'Gun was similar to H110 that it is suggest should only be lowered by 3% instead of 10% as most others. I just want to start out with a safe load that won't damage my rifle. Now I know the Rossi 92 will handle Ruger loads for their pistols with no problems at all.

At any rate I think I will take your advise and start around 19 gr and work up. The bullet is a custom design so not much data on it.

I just checked my Hodgdon 2012 Annual Manual, and though they don't list that particular boolit, they do list a recipe for 325 gr. LFN PB.....RUGER ONLY....start load of Lil'Gun 17 gr.= 1061 fps. & 20,700 CUP
Max load of 20.5 gr. Lil'Gun = 1235 fps. & 29,700 CUP. These are from a 7 1/4" test barrel, you could probably add another 100 to 150 fps. in a rifle barrel.

Another listing of the same weight but adding a gas check yielded about the same velocities and pressures.

I'm still recommending a 19 gr. start point.

[joec]

I just checked my Hodgdon 2012 Annual Manual, and though they don't list that particular boolit, they do list a recipe for 325 gr. LFN PB.....RUGER ONLY....start load of Lil'Gun 17 gr.= 1061 fps. & 20,700 CUP
Max load of 20.5 gr. Lil'Gun = 1235 fps. & 29,700 CUP. These are from a 7 1/4" test barrel, you could probably add another 100 to 150 fps. in a rifle barrel.

Another listing of the same weight but adding a gas check yielded about the same velocities and pressures.

I'm still recommending a 19 gr. start point.

I heard back from Ranch Dog this morning on the discrepancy in his data. He original data was for a Marlin 94 that he used for development of the bullet getting a max being 24 gr. Now with the Rossi it is 25.5 with the min being 15% less on both. He buy the way uses these in his 16" Rossi 92 while I will be loading for a 20" barreled version. He should have the updated data listed on his site though he attached to an email to me. The 92 Rossi can handle more pressure than the Marlin or Winchester 94 can but even with it at 25.5 it is about 35K psi. The list of suitable powders are also less with the Rossi also on the new data which he developed for his needs.

[w30wcf]

I'm thinking 25.5 / Lil Gun is closer to 40,000 CUP since there is a 5,200 CUP increase in pressure in just a 2.2 gr increase from 18.0 (24,500 CUP) to 20.2 grs
(29,800 CUP). A 5.3 gr increase over the 29,800 CUP would likely = close to if not over 40,000 CUP.

19 / Lil Gun under a 320 gr bullet went 1,520 f.p.s. in my Marlin Cowboy (24").

w30wcf

[joec]

I'm thinking 25.5 / Lil Gun is closer to 40,000 CUP since there is a 5,200 CUP increase in pressure in just a 2.2 gr increase from 18.0 (24,500 CUP) to 20.2 grs
(29,800 CUP). A 5.3 gr increase over the 29,800 CUP would likely = close to if not over 40,000 CUP.

19 / Lil Gun under a 320 gr bullet went 1,520 f.p.s. in my Marlin Cowboy (24").

w30wcf

With out referring back to his data I think it was something like 34 Pmax at 1774 fps for 25.5 of Lil Gun based on his tests.

[helice]

Just a couple thoughts.
First thought is that a 45 Colt need not be going 1770'/s to do the job.
Second, I've pushed a 305 gr RCBS to 1550'/s with H110 and been very happy with the results (on both ends of the rifle). 1500 to 1600'/s is just as effective on game and much easier on the shoulder.
Third, I had a leadmelter from NC send me a bunch of the Ranch Dogs and they are 'sweet' slugs. They will do everything you want them to do.

[joec]

Just a couple thoughts.
First thought is that a 45 Colt need not be going 1770'/s to do the job.
Second, I've pushed an RCBS to 1550'/s with H110 and been very happy with the results (on both ends of the rifle). 1500 to 1600'/s is just as effective on game and much easier on the shoulder.
Third, I had a leadmelter from NC send me a bunch of the Ranch Dogs and they are 'sweet' slugs. They will do everything you want them to do.

I have seen the results Ranch Dog is getting with them with hogs using a 16" barreled Rossi 92 and figured they would also work great in my area also.

The main reason I going with the Lil'Gun is I have a pound of it unopened that I got when I bought a used press and other components a while back. The guy I got it from used to load his 410 shotshells with it. As for H110 or 2400 I don't have it on hand but since I ordered 500 of these from NC I expect to be trying a number of powders just don't want to start at max either way.

I'm now working on a way to pad my butt stock as I have the 1892 design C shaped with metal plate. I know this are somewhat brutal on the shoulder. At any rate I have a buddy that does leather work making up a cover with a piece of limb saver filling in the C shape which can be removed for when I use the rifle in cowboy action events with much lighter loads.

[helice]

Joe,
We have a fellow here on the forum called Springfield who runs Whyte Leather Co. He makes a really sweet but cuff for these 92s and they are reasonably priced. Might want to give him a look-see.

[runfiverun]

yes he does, i have one he done for my 44 mag rifle [92] it looks good,fit's nicely too.
and helps with recoil on it's own.

i'll second the not needing sooper dooper mag velocity's.
a 300 at 1500 fps is near a 45/70 load. heck it probably beats some of the springfield pressure loads.

[joec]

Joe,
We have a fellow here on the forum called Springfield who runs Whyte Leather Co. He makes a really sweet but cuff for these 92s and they are reasonably priced. Might want to give him a look-see.

I think I've seen a couple posted here but not sure. At any rate I'm looking for something with a bit more padding and flatting the butt plate out somewhat without a permanent change to the gun.

[bigted]

get the lace-up butpad made from leather at baco [buffalo arms company]. i have em on almost all my rifles as my reach is longer then most so i require longer then norm length of pull. they look very nice and are more origanal looking then anything ive seen and with my cresent plates i have a hunk of carved very dense foam...like shoe soul foam..formed to fit the cresent so the pad fits flush and works for my needs.......also they dampen the recoil of some of my more rambunctious loads...very nice pads and come in 4 diff sizes...check em out.