Plastic or ceramic tumbling media

[Sakdog]

Has anyone ever heard used plastic or ceramic tumbling media?

I was thinking something along the lines of the little pellets that they use for plastic injection molding. I am sure that there could be a plastic that is impregnated with an abrasive too that might work. it would seem that something like this would work good because when it got dirty you can take the media out and wash it.

I see the harborfreight stuff and it seems a bit large 1/4" pyramids their ceramic beads are bigger yet.

Just wondering if anyone had any success with this concept.

[HiVelocity]

Yep, I tired it once. Bought 20 pounds of ceramic tumbling media from a guy on FleaBay, plus a solution to "enhance" the cleaning process.

"Totally Useless"

If I recall, more reading on ceramics is for machine products, NOT pistol or rifle brass.

The best yet is the stainless steel tumbling media sold by the company in the marquis above. That's your best bet.

HV

[drcook]

Ceramic media works just fine, as long as you purchase the correct size and shape. I have been using mine for almost 6 years now, it has cleaned cumalatively thousands of cases. The cases come out shiney and clean, no shortening of the brass etc.

[Sakdog]

Drcook, Any comments on your source for media, and the size/shape that worked/works best for you?

[AMProducts]

If you work with the vendor, they are usually able to guide you specifically for your application, this is part of the reason I don't deal with people on ebay whose sales support is "buy it or don't".

This is the place I usually work with: http://www.manufacturersserviceinc.com/

They have been very good to me over the years, I use steel shot "jewelry mix" as I can use magnetic separation on the material, MSI has been my source for corncob, walnut, tumblers, abrasives etc for years.

[drcook]

this is very close to, if not what I use.

http://www.kingsleynorth.com/skshop/product.php?id=98174&catID=786

you can also do a search for Dave Maurer, he supplies tumbling media to a lot of the BPCR folks

here was a post over on bpcr.net where we spoke about this

http://www.bpcr.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=3420

[rasto]

According my location I couldn't get STM so I bought Ceramic cleaning media.
I bought 2 types one for pistol and .308 (3x5mm) and one for .223 cases (2x4mm).
I had no time to use it in rotary tumbler so I just made small experiment with small vibratory tumbler.
http://www.webforum.sk/viewtopic.php?p=143326&highlight=keramicke#143326

[AMProducts]

Nice writeup Rasto!

I can't read slovak, but I think I get the gist of it.

2kg of ceramic to 1.6kg of cases (450pcs) and 800ml of... I'm guessing teplej vody is soapy water? for 60-90 mins?

Sounds like a good recipe.

[rasto]

almost :-)
tepla voda means hot water and I recommend to leave it there for 60-90 minutes.
The brass is not moving around but only shaking so It needs to be stir by hand from time to time or use higher powered tumbler to activate the volume, because it is heavier in comparison with standard tumbling media!
Do not forget to put in the tumbler liquid cleaner and citric acid like with STM tumbling.

[drcook]

If you are going to try it in a vibratory cleaner, BY ALL MEANS, make sure it is waterproof ! You don't want anything wet getting down into the electronics.

I have a CH4D vibratory cleaner, got used once and put back in the box. The heavy duty Thumbler's Tumbler is all I use at the present time.

I do have some once fired .308 brass that I bought that I might try it on again, but the results out of the tumbler on my brass that I shoot blackpowder with is good.

The only issues that I have, is that in smaller cases, the media that I have will jam up inside. I then bought some 3 mm spheres but they don't clean the corners of the primer pockets and 3 mm spheres are just the right size to occassionally get 2 jammed in a primer pocket. I did put a small quantity of small angular pieces in with the spherical and it helped some

BUT

Once the budget allows, I am going to try and get some smaller diameter cylindrical ceramic or some stainless for cleaning the smaller cases such as th 38-55's and 38-70's

[Nobade]

I have used and still have 3mm porcelain balls. They work reasonably well in large caliber cases, and are fine enough to not cut the brass. Use with soapy water.

Do not use the ceramic tumbling media designed to deburr machined parts. Those are made to remove metal and will eventually tear up your cases.

By far the best I have tried are the little stainless steel pins sold by Pellets LLC or the stainless steel tumbling guys. Buy a Thumler Model B high speed machine, use those little pins in it with dish soap and Lemishine and all is good. Brass comes out looking like new and it even cleans the primer pockets for you. (have to decap beforehand of course)

[Sakdog]

Yeah I am guessing that any of that ceramic stuff will eat up the brass given enough time. Does anyone make a media that can be used dry? (ceramic or plastic) I think that If I got the point where I was going to tumble brass wet I would just stick with my ultrasonic cleaner. It works good but there is something to be said about the convenience of just throwing brass into a tumbler and not drying it etc. Maybe ill just stick with corn cob media after all. I am really put off by the idea of tumbling with liquid agents in the bowl (Even with a unit designed for it)

Interesting stuff though

[drcook]

Drying is not an issue. I save water from the dehumidifier for the final rinse. After rinsing in this water (no minerals or other chemicals) I shake them off and throw on a towel to roll them around on and get the larger drops off. Then I stand them up in an old cake pan and dry in the oven (set at the lowest temp) for 20 minutes or so. Just enough to heat them up and evaporate the water. These low temps don't hurt them brass at all as it is not going to any critical temp level. The brass comes out clean, shiny and dry.

[cajun shooter]

You are very wrong about the ceramic media. I have used it with great success for over 5 years.
It is no different than any other product in that you have to use the correct size and shape of the ceramic for it to do the intended job. It does not wear out and will last you a lifetime.
If you insist on using it your way instead of the intended way then your results will not be any good. That does not mean the product is inferior.
It is intended to be used in a good high speed rotary tumbler such as the Thumblers model B High Speed motor model.
It is used with just enough water to cover the cases and ceramic. You then add a good squirt or two of Dawn with OXY and a teaspoon of Lemi-Shine. The Lemi-Shine may be purchased from Wal-Mart in the Dishwasher soap section. If you are cleaning nickel cases then don't use it or cut way back as it will remove the nickel on the cases. (Don't ask me how I found that out)
The ceramic I use is a mix of two sizes, one is long with angle cut ends and they measure .400 in length and .124 in diameter. The other type I use are the ball shapes and they measure .127 in diameter.
The very first thing you have to do with any cleaning media is run it at least twice with no brass, by itself with the soap and Lemi-Shine to remove any dirt, grime from the manufacturing process. If you fail to do this the brass will come out with a dull dirty coating that has to be removed with a bath in mineral spirits.
You will find that you need a stainless wire mesh colander to pour the finished load into for rinsing and sorting. Your brass will appear as it did the day it was made both inside and out.
This is where the ceramic and SS pins excel. Your other types of tumblers and media don't even come close to cleaning the inside of your cases to this degree.
Buffalo Arms is the best and cheapest I have found on the purchase of the Thumblers tumbler, and they sell the media.
You will have to use a dental pick at times to remove the stuck ceramic in certain cases. You will not have to do this with the SS pins but the rest of the process is the same.
Later David

[jmorris]

The Lyman moly coat tumbler kit comes with ceramic media. That wouldn't destroy lead bullets, turned them into black mirrors. That's the only time I have used it for cleaning, have used larger media and vibrators to debur parts though.

[Nobade]

Ah, I see something here. Shooters talk about ceramic media, because that is how it is sold by the shooting suppliers. But in industrial applications the stuff we use is called porcelain media. The stuff they sell as ceramic media is like arkansas stones. It is quite abrasive and really removes metal. The little slash cut cylinders and balls used for tumbling don't do much more than burnish metal.

The main thing is you do not want the media we use in the burr king or your cases will get much shorter and thinner!

As for the question of wet or dry tumbling, for me it was easy. I developed a terrible allergy to walnut dust and couldn't use it any more. So I tried wet tumbling. After seeing how much crud gets washed down the drain after wet tumbling I figured I was way better off getting rid of that stuff rather than bathing my brass in it every time. And no asthma attack afterward, and seeing how much better it works than dry tumbling (or ultrasonic cleaning) I would never go back.

[Sakdog]

I guess the junction that I am at is that tumbling in corncob works fine and my harbor freight ultrasonic cleaner works very well too with the right solution the brass comes out almost indistinguishable from factory new. The concept I would almost like to see is a tumbling (DRY) media that is light weight, durable and creates a high lustre finish. I guess one of the things in my mind are these little roloc 3m disks that go into a die grinder that have little rubber/plastic fingers that are impregnated with an abrasive. I would think that a thermoplastic impregnated with glass bead or some sort of abrasive would do the trick.

One thing I thought of today is using silica gel beads, They are round, hard, light and might be mildly abrasive enough. generally speaking that wouldn't be a cost effective alternative but since I happened upon a load of it for free I might give this a shot. I will not be sniffing the silica dust that is created so please no posts with the obligatory warnings. Safety is a must, this I know. (Also will only be using white silica beads not the cobalt containing blue ones"

If someone has tried this I am interested to hear about your great success or abysmal failure.

[natty bumpo]

I guess the junction that I am at is that tumbling in corncob works fine and my harbor freight ultrasonic cleaner works very well too with the right solution the brass comes out almost indistinguishable from factory new. The concept I would almost like to see is a tumbling (DRY) media that is light weight, durable and creates a high lustre finish. I guess one of the things in my mind are these little roloc 3m disks that go into a die grinder that have little rubber/plastic fingers that are impregnated with an abrasive. I would think that a thermoplastic impregnated with glass bead or some sort of abrasive would do the trick.

One thing I thought of today is using silica gel beads, They are round, hard, light and might be mildly abrasive enough. generally speaking that wouldn't be a cost effective alternative but since I happened upon a load of it for free I might give this a shot. I will not be sniffing the silica dust that is created so please no posts with the obligatory warnings. Safety is a must, this I know. (Also will only be using white silica beads not the cobalt containing blue ones"

If someone has tried this I am interested to hear about your great success or abysmal failure.

I'm not an expert on silica beads but I think silica anything is going to embed into the brass and scratch the livin daylights out of your dies. Jus sayin!

[jmorris]

I was going to respond to this one only to find I did over 6 years ago...

[John Boy]

Might want to read this. Thread has been read 7332 times ... http://www.theopenrange.net/forum/index.php?topic=9753.msg64517
PS: I increased the size of the Kramer media to 3mm K-Polish to preclude less media in the primer holes

[poppy42]

Just so everyone knows. Corncob media can be cleaned ! I’ve cleaned 20,000 + rounds of various different calibers using the same corncob media over about three years . It gets dirty I put in a fine mesh delicate garment bag in a bucket with some dishwashing liquid in with water swish it around for a little while and then rinse it with a garden hose . When the water gets dirty take the garment bag out hose it out with a garden hose rinse it with a little fresh water . The biggest problem is drying summertime is an too bad it takes a good day in the hot sun I’ve hung mine up in the garage with the fan in front of it let it blow on it for a few hours but it still takes a while to dry thoroughly . As a sidenote don’t try what I did putting the closed garment bag in the dryer . It was working great till the added weight of the wet corn cob media broke the zipper on the garment bag ! You don’t want to know how long it took me to clean your dryer out ! Or the amount of trouble I was in with the wife ! Oh well you live and learn and part of the learning process is making mistakes and being smart enough to never do that again ! Anyway it does work and cleans it quite well for those that don’t want to keep buying corn cob or Walnut dry tumbling media.