Slug loading components,Confused?

[shellshokt]

Hi,
The last box of commercial 12g slugs I bought cost an absolute fortune at £17.25 a box of 25, that's about $27!

I have a 1oz Lee slug mould and a 12g handloader that were given to me a few years ago and I think it's time to dust them off and try loading slugs. I am not going to use them for hunting, the load will be used for target practice/plinking and only loading about 50 rounds at any one time. I will probably upgrade to a decent press in time but intially I want to keep the costs down.

Now here is where I am having problems. Trying to locate the components listed on the lee instructions is proving to be troublesome. I have read volumes on not changing or 'subbing' components and the inherrant dangers of doing so.
The lee instructions list federal, remington and winchester hulls for the mold. Despite hours combing the net I have yet to locate a supplier of these in the UK.
I can obtain fiocchi and cheddite hulls, can anyone provide load data for these? Can anyone tell me if either the fiocchi or cheddite replicate any of the hulls listed on the lee instructions?
Hodgon list data for the Fiocchi with 1oz buckbuster is this suitable?
Alliant only list data in shot weight, would a load for 1oz shot weight be acceptable?
Don't flame me too hard;-)
Regards
Steve

[Blammer]

I'd sub the fiocchi or cheddite hulls no problem for the load you want. The cheddite and fiocchi hulls are straigh taper hulls if I'm not mistaken, they should work fine with the wads, just make sure nothing is really difficult to put together.

I mean make sure you really don't have to "cram" the wad and slug into the hull, that is where pressure and danger lies.

This is my opinion.

I did lots of substituting when trying my 20ga slug loads, if it was really difficult to put the wad in the hull, I didn't.

[shellshokt]

Blammer, thanks for that.

The Lee 2nd edition manual, chapter 12, page 196 states:

"Consider these advantages. Slugs are easily and quickly cast from scrap lead. Use standard wads and very reloadable trap cases. Any shotshell reloading tool works fine. Simply substitute the slug for shot and use the correct powder charge. Be certain you follow the load data supplied with the mold"

So bearing the above statement in mind, Alliant have load data for cheddite hulls & primer:
Hull /shot wt/ Fps / primer / powder /grains /wad / psi
2 3/4"Cheddite/ 1oz /1200/ cheddite/ Red Dot / 19/ 12SO / 7,800

Most of the information I have read also suggests a 16g nitro card between wad and slug, the load data from Alliant does not include this. Also, I plan to roll crimp and I am unsure of the effect this will have on the stated load.
I am thinking that with the pressure given as 7,800 a nitro card would be okay to add how about the crimp?

I am looking at this because I have Red dot and can source the cheddite hulls, primers and 12SO wads quite easily.

As before, if I am being a complete biff please let me know;)

[ovendoctor]

Blammer pm inbound

[UNIQUEDOT]

2 3/4"Cheddite/ 1oz /1200/ cheddite/ Red Dot / 19/ 12SO / 7,800

I have loaded a lot of the Lee slugs using the exact data above and they work quite well. You do not need any card wad with that load/wad combination. These as well as some i load using green dot are my low recoil target/plinking loads.

I would also state that you misunderstood what Richard Lee stated in the book. He didn't mean to substitute the slug for shot in any given load... that's why he wrote "Be certain you follow the load data supplied with the mold" after the statement, but i have experimented with several low pressure loads doing so and have had good results and no problems.

[35remington]

The only slight adjustment may need to be the particular wad used, but fortunately UniqueDot has already given you good feedback. In my most commonly used loads (16 to 17 grains Red Dot in tapered trapload hulls) I can select either the WAA12L (gray) 7/8 oz wad or the WAA12SL (pink) 1 ounce wad. The gray wad elevates the slug a bit more since it has a higher shotcup floor, while the pink wad will allow a 20 gauge card underneath, or it can be omitted and still allow a good crimp. This is essentially within the range of adjustment of the loading press, so the pink wads are used most often as they are a bit more versatile.

But then I shoot a lot of 7/8 ounce lead shot loads, so the grays are on hand too.

shellshokt, while I have not shot the 12SO wad with the Lee slug, given that it is intended for 7/8 to 1 ounce loads I am betting you will find it will work. I am impressed with the durability of Federal wads and they are a good choice for slugs......at least, the S3's have been for me, and that's a good pedigree that promises good results with the 12SO as well. Federal uses a durable plastic, resulting in maybe the most durable of all the "brand name" wads produced. At least IMO.

If the Cheddite are straight walled, they may require a couple grains more Red Dot to achieve similar velocities to the tapered wall hulls, due to the difference in capacity. Given that your load data suggests 19 grains where I normally use 16 to 17 grains in my tapered wall hulls, this has already been taken into account.

Why do you feel the need to roll crimp? A fold crimp should work fine.

I think you are on your way, and good luck to you. You'll have fun, and through a cylinder bore barrel and bead sights I can hold reasonable groups out to fifty yards. Fun to practice with, and good enough accuracy for that practice. Cheap is the big plus.

Should you get tempted to use these on the 25 yard pistol swinger targets made of mild steel (our range makes their own, about 8 inches in diameter) be advised that even if velocities are around 1100 fps (15.5 to 16 grains Red Dot) in my trapload hulls, the heavy slug's impact is hard on the welds, and the plates get popped off the swingers. I found that out the hard way. So even if the slug isn't denting the plate heavily the welds won't be long for this world.

The 1700 fps loads, tested on the same mild steel (not on a swinger; I'm not that vandalizing) turn it into bubble gum. Kinda chewed looking.

That reinforcing rib inside the Lee slug makes it harder on targets, and it penetrates much better than the soft factory Foster slugs.

[shellshokt]

Thanks for the input fella's.
Uniquedot; The quotation from the loading manual is part of the reason my thread is entitled 'confused'. The two statements seem to contradict each other. But hey, that's why I posted on this forum, to have more learned and experienced fellows show me the way!

35Remington: Re Roll crimp. The reason I plumped for this particular method is:
1. most of the commercially available slugshells over here use it.
2. I am not sure if the lee loader will crimp satisfactorily
3. I can obtain a roll crimp fairly cheaply and I dont really want to invest in a lee load all just yet.

I liked the look of this particular load due to Vdomemoires post advising that the lee slug was a good fit in this particular wad.

Slug ammuniton comes under completely different rules/legislation over here. You can own a semi auto shotgun, with a maximum capacity of 1+2 on a shotgun licence. Any shotshell ammo you buy can be purchased on production of a valid Shotgun Certificate. If you want a semi-auto or pump with a magazine capacity greater than 2 rounds then that is calssed as a firearm over here and you need a firearms certificate in order to legally own one. Rifled barrels are not permitted. If granted, you will have restrictions on the number of solid shot ammunition you can own or buy at any one time placed on your certificate. Solid slug can only be used for target shooting in competitions, 'Timed & Precision 1', or practice at approved ranges.

I dont shoot slug at 'swingers'. For targets we shoot at 'de humanised' figure 11 targets. Not politically correct to have civilians shooting at a picture of an armed soldier running towards you! Shot is used for plate type targets.

Thanks Again
Kind Regards
Steve

[SuperBlazingSabots]

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[35remington]

ss, swingers are plate type targets. Slugs are hard on them, even low velocity slugs. Ours on the pistol range are eight inches in diameter.

Isn't it wonderful having government telling you exactly what you can do because, when it comes right down to it, you aren't to be trusted?

We take great pains to try and see that this does not happen here. We must be ever vigilant.

[UNIQUEDOT]

2. I am not sure if the lee loader will crimp satisfactorily

The lee loader will roll or fold crimp once fired hulls very easily, but it takes considerable force to roll and especially fold a crimp on a new hull with it. You can get perfect roll crimps on new hulls using the tool, but with slugs it requires an overshot card.