Wheel gun issues!

[NVScouter]

So I bought a Dan Wesson 357 6" last week. I've wanted one of these for a long time and the price was right. The revolver is tight with a low round count. Pretty good sites for as issued form.

I took it home, modified the grip a bit for fit, cleaned it, set the cylinder gap for .006 and went shooting. Fed 357mag 158JSP grouped about 5" at 50 yards slow fire bench rest. 125g 357 mag Fiocchi shot about 3" at 25 yards :x

My 38 special junk loads with Berry's 125g plated HP over tighgroup shoots a tiny ragged hole. I guess I cant blame the gun.

My 357 hand loads needed more taper crimp to fit so I didnt get to shoot those. I'm going to clean it again tonight and try it again. I'll pay extra attention to cylinder throats this time if its been a 38 shooting machine for years.

Any sugestions on getting this to shoot 357mags?

[btroj]

You tried 2 factory loads and want to know what it needs to get it to shoot 357's?

You haven't even tried a handload yet. Go shoot it, a bunch. Try a bunch of loads. Find what it like and doesn't like.

Until you get a feel for the particular needs of that gun how can you even begin to know what might work best?

Don't mean to sound crabby, I just think a gun needs a few hundred rounds thru it with cast to get a handle on what it wants.

[44man]

The DW if made during the right period is super accurate. There was a time when they were bought out that guns were real bad. Barrels were screwed into the frame crooked, cylinder fronts wobbled so the gap changed with each chamber and some internal parts did not work.
Before and after this period they were great, it is a good design.
Sorry but I forget history.
To the .357! I find it is not an easy caliber to work even with a good gun. It really does take more work and testing. Once found what the gun likes it will drive tacks.
I never figured it out, finding the smaller calibers can work in one gun but not another and you need a different load for each gun.

[cbrick]

The DW dominated long range revolver in national and international competition for years though in 44 mag, not 357. It would be kinda tough to get the power level needed for long range in a 357 DW.

My best results with the 357 mag revolver is with heavy for caliber bullets, a good solid crimp and the slow pistol powders using full loads, not dangerous loads but rather at or near top end book loads, work up carefully. The slow ball powders won't give good results with reduced loads or light bullets. I've also had excellent results using a mild snug bullet fit in the "throats" not the bore. A good revolver will have a groove diameter at or slightly "under" throat diameter.

As was already said, you haven't even fired your handloads in it yet so you have no basis to judge good or poor performance. Get out and shoot it, see what it likes or doesn't like, take good notes.

Rick

[44man]

The DW dominated long range revolver in national and international competition for years though in 44 mag, not 357. It would be kinda tough to get the power level needed for long range in a 357 DW.

My best results with the 357 mag revolver is with heavy for caliber bullets, a good solid crimp and the slow pistol powders using full loads, not dangerous loads but rather at or near top end book loads, work up carefully. The slow ball powders won't give good results with reduced loads or light bullets. I've also had excellent results using a mild snug bullet fit in the "throats" not the bore. A good revolver will have a groove diameter at or slightly "under" throat diameter.

As was already said, you haven't even fired your handloads in it yet so you have no basis to judge good or poor performance. Get out and shoot it, see what it likes or doesn't like, take good notes.

Rick
Right on. factory loads will not tell much. I love the caliber but just have no use because I hunt. I just want bigger. I wanted bigger for steel too. Yet it is a fine caliber but needs more thinking.
A good DW is a great gun too.
I wish I had more to share with the .357.

[Maven]

NVS, I have a 6" shrouded bbl. DW (stainless) and find it will shoot .357Mag. cast loads as well as my Ruger BH. Slug the bbl., set the cylinder gap with the included (?) feeler gauge, and make sure the grips are tight to the frame (tool supplied?). I was going to say to check the bbl. retaining nut for tightness as well, but if it shot .38Spls. so well, I'd say the problem lies elsewhere. Btw, I size to .359" for my DW and the BH as well.

[I'll Make Mine]

Did I miss something? A five inch, 50 yard group from a 6" barrel revolver is not shooting well? I don't see much to complain about there...

[Kraschenbirn]

Did I miss something? A five inch, 50 yard group from a 6" barrel revolver is not shooting well? I don't see much to complain about there...

Not terrible but not great, either. Back in the dark, old days when I shot DWs for IHMSA sillywhets, the accepted 'competitive standard' for revolvers was 2"-2 1/2" groups @ 50M...with full-bore, teeth-rattlin' loads that, looking back, should've been downright scary. (I was pushing a gas-checked, NEI 238-grainer out of an 8" DW .41 Mag at real close to 1400 fps...and, no, I won't post how much of what powder but will admit it was a compressed charge.)

Bill

[x101airborne]

STOP what you are doing, and send me the weapon. It is obiously defective and only I know how to fix it. I will take it for a small "rehoming" fee.


Seriously, load for the weapon, not the load. Take the gun to your reloading room and taylor a load for length and crimp specifically for that cylinder. You have a really great platform for working up with and I wish you luck. If you shoot a light boolit, shoot a fast powder. If heavy, shoot a slow powder. Stay with non-mag primers for most powders other than H-110 or slower. The boolits dont have to be super hard. My 357's get fed a diet of 10 - 12 bhn boolits and they are all plain base. I will admit though, I dont push them hard. Around 1100 - 1200 fps works for me.

If I can help you in any way, lemme know.

[NVScouter]

The DW dominated long range revolver in national and international competition for years though in 44 mag, not 357. It would be kinda tough to get the power level needed for long range in a 357 DW.

My best results with the 357 mag revolver is with heavy for caliber bullets, a good solid crimp and the slow pistol powders using full loads, not dangerous loads but rather at or near top end book loads, work up carefully. The slow ball powders won't give good results with reduced loads or light bullets. I've also had excellent results using a mild snug bullet fit in the "throats" not the bore. A good revolver will have a groove diameter at or slightly "under" throat diameter.

As was already said, you haven't even fired your handloads in it yet so you have no basis to judge good or poor performance. Get out and shoot it, see what it likes or doesn't like, take good notes.

Rick
Thanks i was looking for any DW quick checks before loading up a couple batches for the AM. I have about 15 each of the NOE 180/160HP loaded up over good old 2400 and another 40 38SPLs loaded like before. I made up another dozen 158 TC over Universal. My smaller .358 sizer isnt here yet so what I have is my start.

Going through my 38s and 357 brass was scary, its rather a story of a persons life to see all that military, SuperVel, W-W SuperMagum, Speer brass, etc! I've been reloading this stuff on and off for almost 30 years. That and the old stuff thats been passed on to me. :groner:

[NVScouter]

Did I miss something? A five inch, 50 yard group from a 6" barrel revolver is not shooting well? I don't see much to complain about there...

I shoot to hunt and have owned hundreds firearms over my collection. Partly because I'm a horse trader by nature and more often they dont make the grade. All of my current handguns over 4" barrels must be able to shoot a rabbit in the head at 50 yards, and a coyote in the chest at 100. My Rugers I shoot regularly to 250 and often to 500. A 5"@50y spread turns into a 10-12" spread at 100y and is worthless for me. Now if you arent shooting long distance then its fine.

And was said those arent wrist breaking loads so they should be more accurate. But I was disapointed in factory ammo. I travel a lot and love to hit local adds and pawn shops in the middle O' Nowhere places and get lots of firearms that way. This is how I got this one and it was factory or nothing, Ijust happened to have a handful of my old 38 reloads since another 357 was on my to buy list. When I saw this one for $300 I jumped on it.

[subsonic]

All the same things apply, many were already stated above:
Don't use mag primers (maybe with H110, but not me)
Make sure cases are all the same length so you can crimp enough, but not OVER CRIMP
Use a heavy boolit and a slow powder at or near book max
Fit the boolit to the throats, as long as they are not way oversize (in which case, just give up!)
Bell the case plenty
Seat the boolits straight with a die that aligns them
And lastly, make sure case neck tension is good and consistent from case to case

I am no master of the .357, but my "work in progress" 686 is shooting under 2" at 50yd now for 6 shots - with store bought Cast Performance 180 WFNGCs on top of AA9 with a standard primer. I want to do that with my boolits - I have a 175gr Ranch Dog mold that I had him plain base for me. Haven't cast any yet, but that's they next part of the saga...

[ebner glocken]

I bought this one in a similar circumstance not long ago. I shot some offhand with it at 50 yards and could hit a 6" circle if I did my part, nothing scientific. I cleaned it and reset the gap at .0025" and hitting the same target seemed to get quite a bit easier with the same ammo. When time allows I will get more into working a load up from the bench.


ebner