Range report

[jdgabbard]

Went to the range today. And put a lot of rounds down the firing lane. Got a few things to report.

First, was a pretty good test with my S&W 65. Three loads were fired. Two for comparison against each other. The third was a beginning load. All three provided good accuracy at 20yds. However, the third was not what I would have liked it to be.

The first two loads were both 358495s loaded over 3gr of bullseye with wolf primers in 38spl cases. One batch of 100 was lubed with carnauba red. Another batch of 100 was lubed with essentially old NRA lube (petroleum jelly, beeswax, and canning wax). With the non-adjustable iron sights of the model 65, both loads performed exceptionally well. Giving no leading, and keeping everything in the black of the targets (about a 5" circle). However, to my surprise, the old NRA lubed loads showed to be noticeably tighter. Although groups were not measured. Also all lube grooves in both variants were lubed. Next try will be with only two lubed.

The third load was a 358477, loaded with the starting load of 2400 in 357mag brass (don't remember the grains at the moment). The boolits were sized to .358 and lubed with old NRA. Well I was able to keep these loads on target. But that's about it. Groups werent too wide, but there was a lot of vertical stringing. I'm pretty sure I wasn't limp wristing, but the recoil was very noticeable. I would not push this load over 20yds, however it did seem better than a lot of the factory loads I've shot. Will continue to work up this load.

The fourth load was loaded for a 9mm Sigma, using the Lyman 120g TC for 9mm. Lubed with carnauba and loaded over 4g of unique. I experienced horrible accuracy with this load. There was leading, and recoil was significant. I will be looking for a alternate load for this boolit. Possibly looking at using bullseye instead next time.

[x101airborne]

Sounds like you had kind of a frustrating day. Another pistol lube that I have come to enjoy is Pinko Commie *** Lube. It is in the lube section. It is a very soft lube that works for me in all my loads from light 38's to heavy 44 mags. It is good stuff.

I would lighten up the charge on the 9mm. If it was that substantial in report and recoil, it is pretty hot. What alloy are you using? For my autopistols, I use straight air cooled WW's. Lots of things to try. Just keep at it.

[Cherokee]

You did not mention the size of the CB for the 9mm. You might try a larger size since your description makes me think the bullet was undersize for the barrel. Did you slug the barrel ? 4 gr Unique should not be a hot load but you might try backing down some. For the 357 & 358477, my guns like 2400 above a starting load. Vertical string could be inconsistent ignition. Just some thoughts from my experience.

[Hogdaddy]

4gr under a 120gr TC is light in my book depending on COL ; )
H/D

[bruce drake]

My load for my FEG Highpower is 5.2gr of Unique with the same Lyman 120gr TC. I seat the boolit to the point where the cone starts so it feeds through my pistol with no issues.

I am thinking the 4.0gr of Unique is light as well but the Sigma is a polymer pistol and the load might feel snappier in the lighter pistol.

Also, I'm shooting my 120gr TCs at .357 in diameter. They just shooter better than when they are sized to .356 in my pistol.

Regarding the 357 Mag loads. Did you tip the pistol up after every shot for a consistent powder column in the cartridge? Your vertical stringing can come from the ignition patterns of the powder as well.

[jdgabbard]

I checked my load data to make sure. The 2400 load in the .357 was at 12g, which is 1.0g above minimum. The 9mm load was actually 4.3g of unique: Boolit was sized accordingly to .357.

As to the question of tipping the barrel up to seat the powder, no I did not. I think that the 2400 load will work itself out as I raise the charge. Ignition may be an issue, however I've heard over and over again that 2400 likes standard pistol primers, not magnum primers. And I used standard pistol.

As to the recoil of the 9mm, I mostly shoot wheel guns. Although I have been shooting automatics ever since I was a child. Worked as an officer for a while, and had to qualify to Oklahoma's Council on Law Enforcement Education and Training Standards with my duty piece. Was not a problem. And this load shot better than what those rounds I used to qualify did. So when I say that the round was snappy, trust me, it was snappy. I had more felt recoil with the 9mm than I did with the 2400 loads. However, the 2400 loads were a little more uncomfortable on the web of my hand.

Something else I noticed, and guess I had forgotten over this last deployment. But man my lube smokes! A puff of smoke with every pull of the trigger.

[bruce drake]

grams (g) or grains (gr) a huge difference when it comes to measuring gunpowder.

[jdgabbard]

It was grains. I always just use g... I was born and raised in southeastern oklahoma, gimme a little slack.

[fcvan]

Whenever I start to thinking my loads smoke too much I take out my percussion revolver. Nothing like black powder or Pyrodex helps keep 'smoke' in perspective. I once fired my 1858 Remington at an indoor range. They put me on the far side (alone) and turned me loose. The operator purposely turned the fans off. 6 rounds and visibility was thicker than London fog. My home made lube smokes, but nothing compared to the black. Frank

[I'll Make Mine]

It was grains. I always just use g... I was born and raised in southeastern oklahoma, gimme a little slack.

Problem is, if someone comes on a post out of context (as from a search engine or in an archive 10-15 years from now), and isn't from Oklahoma, and sees "g", they might well think it's grams (since the US is the only part of the world that doesn't deal in grams more than any other unit for small masses) -- now, it's unlikely someone could put 15.4 times too much powder in a case, but not impossible if they're loading something like 5 grains of Bullseye for a cat-sneeze load in a large case -- and that big a load of Bullseye or equivalent would blow up anything.

[mdi]

Problem is, if someone comes on a post out of context (as from a search engine or in an archive 10-15 years from now), and isn't from Oklahoma, and sees "g", they might well think it's grams (since the US is the only part of the world that doesn't deal in grams more than any other unit for small masses) -- now, it's unlikely someone could put 15.4 times too much powder in a case, but not impossible if they're loading something like 5 grains of Bullseye for a cat-sneeze load in a large case -- and that big a load of Bullseye or equivalent would blow up anything.
Kinda nit-picky ain't it? Any reloader, with any experience at all, would/does know what the poster means when designating a powder charge whether g, gr., G or GR. Try to put a 6 gram load of Unique in a .357 Mag. case (92.6 grains), and I doubt if my .44 magnum cases will hold 5 grams of Bullseye (77.16 gr.)...



.

[I'll Make Mine]

And what about the new guy who has no experience and is learning this stuff by reading the instructions that came with the dies and load data found on the Internet? No, he isn't going to fit 90+ grains of Unique in a .357 case, but he might well fit 75+ grains of Bullseye (which should have been a cat sneeze load of 5 grains) in a .45-70 -- it'd compress a bit, but...

When doing something with the kind of precision requirements and consequences there are in reloading, it's important to use the correct terms -- every time. Call it nit-picking if you like, but remember when NASA lost a billion dollars worth of Mars probe because one contractor specified a maneuvering thruster in pounds, and another programmed for it in Newtons? The result was a meteoric burn-up for what should have been a fairly gentle aerobraking orbital capture maneuver.

[jdgabbard]

I'll make mine, if you don't like it you don't have to comment on it. I don't take well to having people telling me what to do.

[tudor8055]

I always list my loads as XXgr. Never been scolded for it either.
Can't hold everyones hand.

[mdi]

To reload, one must think. If one cannot think (trying to stuff Bullseye in a 45-70 case), that one should stay away from any type of reloading. And he'll prolly need help crossing the street...

[I'll Make Mine]

I apologize -- very sorry to put safety and precision ahead of personal feelings. I'll try not to let it happen again.

[Budda]

http://captionsearch.com/pix/t8zrasr0.jpg#You%20got%20trolled

[Mal Paso]

Grams are UnAmerican and Not Allowed in the reloading room.:bigsmyl2:

Bad enough I have 2 sets of wrenches in the shop and on the truck. And what's with 18mm. 17 and 19 were PLENTY! D*** Engineers have to use EVERY NUMBER before bolts become obsolete?

What? Oh sorry. One of the biggest 2400 Lot to Lot Variations is light load ignition. A little more powder is better than a Mag Primer.

[jdgabbard]

Mal, I've heard the same as well. And I'm pretty sure that may be the issue.