Advise on 30-30 load from a short barrel?

[Lucky]

I'll spare the legal mumbo-jumbo, but trust me this is legal where I am, now. Purpose will be fun and wilderness protection.

I'm planning on making a 30-30 Win94 with a 10" barrel, maybe less, and hopefully with a pistol-grip-only stock.

These are sort-of my goal:

http://www.wildwestguns.com/Bushwacker/bushwacker.html


What would be a good load for this? I'm planning on just using a 180gr Lee .303 Brit mould for boolits, but if there'd be a better one I'm open to hearing it.


With such a short barrel what would be a suitable powder, and best bullet weight? If a powder like 3031 doesn't fully burn in the short barrel, would it be acceptable to simply load less of it in the cartridge until the fireball stops?


Thanks;
Scott

[jh45gun]

I do not know Canada's Rules but I know in the states you cannot make a gun like that unless the reciever is new and never been on a rifle so it is a pistol manufactered new. I think even then you have to tell the BATF your making such a gun to get it approved. I am curious what is Canada's ruling on this. I am not doubting you if you say you can legally do it so be it I just am curious what Canada's laws is on this?

[junkbug]

I have no idea what loads a gun like that would prefer. To me, a short barrelled 30-30 is my Marlin 336 SC with an 18.5" barrel.

I remember my first Sierra reloading manual (published in 1978 I think), treated the 30-30 in the Thopson Center pistol as a separate cartridge. That manual is in storage, so I just can't look at it right now. The main reason for the separate listing was the short barrel length, not the stregnth of the pistol. But 30-30 Contender loads would be the place to start.

I have used substantially reduced loads of IMR 4227 for cast boolits in other calibers (19.0 gr for 180gr gc boolits in the 30-06). Since this is a regularly listed powder for a lot of 30-30 data, you should be able to reduce it substantially. That 30-06 load was less than quater case full, and I used no filler.

I used that same 19.0 gr load with a 215 grain, gas cheched boolit in a Steyr 1895 long rifle in 8x56R. That case is just as large as a 30-06. No filler. Average 1525fps, with only a 25fps total velocity spread. Pretty consistant powder for light charges.

Good luck if you try IMR 4227 in yout new 30-30.

[NickSS]

The lee bullet you mentioned has a rather sharp round nose. It could be dangerous in a tube magazine. For plinking try like 9 or 10 gr of Unique.

[fourarmed]

Sounds as if you want a powerful load. It is well known that the powders that give the most velocity in a long barrel do so in a short barrel as well. Having said that, I settled on 15/2400 with the RCBS 165 SIL in my 10" Merrill pistol barrel. Accuracy was my only consideration there, however.

[hs45/70]

What you propose to do is illegal "everywhere" in Canada.......you are creating a "Prohibited Firearm".

If you think you are creating a "Restricted firearm" you are wrong!!!! ( nearly all pistols/revolvers are "Restricted" in Canada.. ..those that aren't grandfathered prohibs. or prescribed antiques are classified as "Restricted" and can be taken to the ranges with the appropiate paper-work which is usually good for 5 years)

If you think you are making a "Resticted" you still can't legally deviate from what your
5 year" permit to transport" stipulates..."To approved Ranges and to gunsmiths for repairs etc" this does not allow legal carry in the "Bush" unless you have the Special Permit to carry a pistol in the Bush...and you may "qualify" but this does not cover Prohibited firearms

You can have a 94 win with a 16" trapper barrel if it came from the factory that way...but you can't take your 20 inch brl down to 16 inch. You can buy an 870 Rem with the Dlask (SP) short- short brl. but you can't cut your regular shot gun brl. to the same dimensions.

.........If you think I'm wrong, plse advise accordingly with the appropriate sections from the Cdn. Firearms Act so these folks in the U.S can provide you ( with good conscience) , data for the "sawed off rifle" you think would be legal..

[LarryM]

Don't get me wrong, I think it would be a cool thing but I am real curious under what circumstances this weapon would be legal in Canada or the US.

[jh45gun]

At least in the states we can make a trapper if we want to or any other carbine or a short shotgun as long as the rifle barrel stays above 16 inches and 18 for the shotgun. I kinda figured what was proposed was illegal. Thats the problem with these companies that make the short sawed off weapons that are Class III or like in the case of the Mares Leg a legal pistol as it was made as such yet folks see these and they think they can do the same thing themselves which they cannot at least not legally. What really sucks is they do make these guns then they charge an totally obscene price over the price of a standard rifle and folks buy them because it is a legal way to get a short rifle. The company that is making the Mares Leg which is the copy of the model 92 that Steve McQueen used in Wanted Dead or Alive is made on a Rossi or Puma model 92 action and they get over 1500 bucks for such a gun and it is considered a pistol as the company calls it that so you do not need a Class III permit to own it. More cash than I can afford for such a weapon.

[felix]

If it is considered a weapon, I don't want it anyway. ... felix

[jh45gun]

OK gun does that make it better. :) I would love to have one of those Mares Legs but not at them prices.

[lovedogs]

I won't get into the legal aspects of this but can address the powders to use in a short-barreled .30-30. I have friends who have 10 in. Contenders and I use a
12 in. Custom Shop Contender bbl. I've not tried cast bullets in it yet... maybe some day. But I have used with great success the Nosler BT 150 gr. and the Hornady 130 gr. SSP. Both with H335. Regardless of bbl. length you can use the same powders as with long bbls. I get about 7/8 in. 100 yd. groups with both bullets. Vel. w/ 150's is just under 2000 FPS and the 130's go just over 2100 FPS. The H335 gives horrible muzzle blast in this short of a bbl. I've found that AA2230 does just as well and gives a little less blast and fireball in the .223's so will try it in the .30-30 when the weather here improves. If you use mag primers (CCI 250) these powders will work great in short bbls.

[26Charlie]

Loads I used in th eM94 20" rifle, such as 311291 with 16.5 gr. 4759, worked the same in a 10" Contender barrel but with less velocity. I don't see why any .30-30 laod will not work in the 10" bbl., just as has been mentioned some of them may produce lots of blast and fireball.

[Lloyd Smale]

lucky not to be snotty but its posts like this that get the batf looking at one of these forums. A guy should allways know that what hes posting about at least is leagal and if theres any doubt do some legwork on your own first. I dont know the canadian laws but it highly illeagal here to do what you want to do.