.38 spl and H lil gun

[JoeTheMechanic]

i was wondering if anyone has tried loading a CB over Hodgdon 'lil gun in .38 spl?

i was looking through the lee load manual and noticed in the 32H&R magnum data that lil gun is interesting for a "magnum" powder. for an 85gn jacketed bullet it has the highest velocity, and gets there with about 20% less pressure, 16,800 CUP compared to 20k +/- for the other powders. the other thing i noticed is that the starting charge is a full 12.5% reduction from max, which without doing the math, is some SERIOUSLY low pressure for such a slow powder to be properly burning at.

then, for something more relevant, i flipped over to the 158gn xtp in 357 mag. and all i can say is WOW. lil gun sends that slug zipping along at 1577 fps while only making 25,800 CUP, while H110 only gains 14fps at 40,700 CUP :shock:

all this is making me think that 'lil gun might be a good option for developing an updated "fbi" load, as well as for magnum CB loads in general.

[bobthenailer]

1st question are these going to be fired in a gun chambered in 357 mag or 38 special ?
Ive used a few pounds of LG powder in the 22 hornet , 357 mag and 454 casull with excellent accuracy and in the 22 H & 357 mag a velocity increase of 200 to 300 fps higher velocity than you can get with powders such as 296/ H110.
those two usually require almost a full powder charge to burn correctly , i think they state do not reduce charge weight more than 10%. im not sure about LG ! all 3 that ive used LG in had chamber pressures in the 25,000 + psi/cup range . i guess you may have to be the gini pig on this one

[geargnasher]

I haven't tried it, but even HS6 is too slow for standard .38 Spl. loads. Dirty and inconsistent in my experience. I would suspect Li'l Gun to be even worse.

Gear

[swheeler]

Joe; never used it in 38 spcl but have in 357, it will push 190RD(195 grs full dressed) to 1200 from 4 5/8 BH. I have read internet chatter of rapid forcing cone errosion and strap cutting, I keep checking for it but nothing yet after a couple pounds.

[uscra112]

I use Lil'Gun as a go-to powder in .357 Max loads, and have used it in the K-Hornet. It wants to work at pressure that is well beyond what most .38 Specials can stand. The stories of forcing cone erosion may prove true. Lil-Gun burns longer than other powers of its' "speed", giving higher velocity for lower peak pressure. Not something that a revolver would be happy with.

[357maximum]

Joe; never used it in 38 spcl but have in 357, it will push 190RD(195 grs full dressed) to 1200 from 4 5/8 BH. I have read internet chatter of rapid forcing cone errosion and strap cutting, I keep checking for it but nothing yet after a couple pounds.

LilGun approaching 58,000 psi will erode your leade and move it forward.....trust me on that one.

[MT Chambers]

There has been a lot of discussion over on "Freedom Arms" forum(Greybeard) about Lilgun wearing out revolver forcing cones due to extreme heat.

[TCLouis]

Sorta on topic . . .

I note that it sure does heat a gun up faster than other powders.

Guess it is the down side of long burn time, low pressure.\, high velocity

[JoeTheMechanic]

if hodgdon published a load for lil gun that maxed at 16,800 CUP with a starting charge 12.5% below max, i have to assume the powder is burning decently at that pressure. the main reason i am interested is my suspicion that this is the powder used in buffalo bore's FBI load, the one that claims to push a 158gn SWCHP at 1000fps from a 2" barrel without exceeding saami 38 +p limits.

what im after if it works out is to streamline my SHTF ammo. a hot carry load that wont blow up my older 38s but plenty of zip out of the 2" 357s would be nice. that way i could devote all the 357 i carry to the lever gun and a pistol for backup while hunting, and have one load for SD carry that will work in all my wheel guns.

[SciFiJim]

what im after if it works out is to streamline my SHTF ammo. a hot carry load that wont blow up my older 38s but plenty of zip out of the 2" 357s would be nice. that way i could devote all the 357 i carry to the lever gun and a pistol for backup while hunting, and have one load for SD carry that will work in all my wheel guns.

Maybe something else to consider. The heavy 357s for the lever gun will be great for larger animals like deer. I have also been contemplating a light load for small game like rabbits using a 358156 in .38 brass. It would shoot to a different POI, but could be adjusted for at close range without changing the sights. The rounds could be told apart by feel if necessary.