Some serious work with the 6.5

[KCSO]

I have a virgin 6.5 rifle that I want to develop a target load for this summer. The gun ( I am trying to post photo's) is a M63 Swede military target rifle. I got the gun a couple of years ago and it was literaly new when I got it. It came in a packing crate covered in cosmoline and I don't think it had ever been fired. The gun is in my opinion the full equal of a Springfield target gun of the 30's This one was made on a Carl Gustav action dated 1916 and has all matching numbers. The sights are the Swede target peeps with a globe front with interchangable disks. The trigger is two stage with a final break of 3 pounds even and dead crisp. After cleaning I fired 10 of my favorite jacketed loads through the gun and I put 10 into 1 1/2" at 100 yards from a bench rest. I then cleaned the bore completely and did a chamber cast. The bore is just a little tighter than my M96 military target rifle and the throat is just a little less than 1/10 " shorter.

It is finally time for shooting some cast loads. I don't have a mold for cast for the 6.5 yet and would like to beg a little help from the 6.5 shooters here. If I could just get a few samples to try I would have a better idea of what to have made or what to buy. I am willing to trade and I have 30, 303, 44, 45 50 ect.
I can't help but feel that this gun should be the ultimate test bed for a 6.5. With the new bore and a free floated heavy bbl this one should shoot.

Then again I might be wrong.

[Buckshot]

..............That's a fine looking piece, and worth quite a hefty chunk of change these days. I don't recall exactly what I have cast up for the 6.5 other then for sure some of the Jumptrap 140gr FN's. I might have some of the Oldfeller 172's also.

Should see about lining up some surp WC860/872.

Shoot me a PM with your address and I'll forward some of whatever I have.

............Buckshot

[Four Fingers of Death]

With the shorter throat it should work better on cast than the standard 6.5s.

[KCSO]

First thanks to everyone for the help. I have been putting this off for some time as I have had conflictiing reports on the 6.5.
My other 6.5 is a mint M96 Target rifle and the sights interchange between these two. The M63 was a happenstance deal as I had two target shooters that wanted to order thses and I got it a buy 5 price. The gun is somewhat unique as it is set up for left and right hand use with a cheekpiece on either side. The gun is hand bedded and free floated and was made in 1964. I would like to make this my lead bullet target gun if I can wring enough accuracy out of it.

I use a 6.5 with jacketed slugs for a hunting gun and My dad killed a mule deer with it this last year. I am more inclined to consider this gun with cast as strictly a target proposition as I don't know that a 140 to 160 bullet at 1700 in 6.5 would be enough for deer. By the time I get done shooting wet pack this summer I will make up my mind.

[Bob S]

The twist in the CG63 is not as extreme as the service rifles. I think it is 1:9. Much more cast-friendly.

Resp'y,
Bob S.

[KCSO]

Leave it to Bob to thow in a monkey wrench. I checked and the 63 has a 1-8.65 twist. Now I have to work up a load for the 96 and one for the 63. I am busy turning up rear sight inserts for the Swede peep.

[KCSO]

First off thanks to everyone for their help on this.

I got out tonight to try a couple of different bullets and loads in the 63 and the gun does have some definite preferences. It doesn't like 172's at all. I started with the 172's and unique and groups with 10 grs were 3 1/2 to 4 at 100 and upping the charge to 11 grains threw them all over. The shorter throat on the 63 means that I had to seat these quite deep in the case. In addition the flat points will not feed from the magazine for the left side rounds, so these are out for any kind of timed fire. 15 grs of 2400 did no better and W/W 748 at an estimated 1900 fps was a disaster with the bullets hitting sideways. These bullets were sized to 264 and came from Waksupi. I got some 150's from Linstrom and sized these to 265 and they showed better grouping with Unique 11.0 going into 2 1/4", not nearly what the rifle should do, but enough to give me a starting place. W/W 748 at 1900 fps was almost as bad as the 172 with 3 going into 11" and the bullet cutting egg shaped holes. I will be trying Red Dot and 2400 tomorrow if all goes well.

[waksupi]

Jim, sorry to hear those didn't shoot well. Would you like some unsized to try out?

[StarMetal]

Jim

My 260 Rem did the same thing with those cruise missiles. I believe you said your rifling twist was just under 9. Nine is what my 260 is. I now shoot a shorter bullet pretty good. I got it from 45 2.1

Joe

[Buckshot]

.............Whattever you do, don't try and exceed about 1700 fps. I know yours has a slower twist and I have no experience with the 6.5 other then the 7.8" twist, but it seems the same bad stuff is showing up.

...............Buckshot

[KCSO]

I may do some more work with the 172's as they group at 50 but open up bad at 100. I had the same problem with a 303 once and I finally had to go to a filler. I figure I have about 20 more loads to try before I even have an idea of where to go. I will post as i go along. The 63 is a completely different gun from the 96 as the 172's shoot good in the 96. This will take a lot longer than I thought.

[KCSO]

I am finally starting to get some semblance of accuracy from the M63. I ended up shooting a Lyman 150 gr bullet with 16.5 grs of 2400 and a pistol primer. The load does not like rifle primers.

I will offer these observations on the 6.5 in the M63...
The rifle does not like a clean bore. A squeeky clean bore with a light coat of oil takes 3 to 4 rounds before the rifle will group. This caused no end of problems as I was cleaning between different bullet types and just shooting 5 round groups. I would get 3 tight ? and two flyers almost ever time.

This rifle likes hard bullets. My best group so far has been with 1/2 and 1/2 w/w and lino water quenched.

The 6.5 seems to be a lot more finicky than even the 270. I had some bullets that had tiny wrinkles on one side, in my 30-30 bullets like this will open up the group about an inch at 100 yards. In the 6.5 these flawed bullets opened up over 2". I am probably going to have to weigh bullets. By contrast my 1886 Winchester 45-70 will shoot 3 into 1 1/2" at 100 every time with any bullet that looks pretty good.

The 6.5 sure is a ***** cat to shoot. With a 29" heavy barrel and a total gun weight of 10.5 lbs there is almost no recoil and very little noise. This is a blessing for a fellow with a bum shoulder as I can only shoot my 86 in 2 3 shot groups a day or I ache for days.

Although this rifle has some really fine peep sights I wonder every range trip how it would shoot with a good scope. I hate to change anything on the gun, but I still wonder.

[Bob S]

I'd be willing to bet that Buckshot's latest group buy 6.5 mould will do well in that barrel. It will be a while before I have time to cast some up from the mould that arrived last week. I have been thinking about getting a Lothar Walther barrel (the 29" military profile) for the 1896 long rifle because I think the twist is 1:9 or close to it. I just picked up a 7.62 x 51 GEW profile from them to replace the sleeved barrel on my Chilean 1912/67, and I am impressed by the quality.

I searched "The Nation's Gun Show" at the Dulles Expo Center for a CG-63 (among other things), to no avail. Very few Swedes at all. It seems that the folks that have them don't want to part with them.

Resp'y,
Bob S.

[Herb in Pa]

http://www.sarcoinc.com/guns12-14.html