Functioning M1 Carbine loads w/311410?

[curator]

Fellow booliteers,

I have recently obtained a commercial copy of the US M-1 Carbine. I also have a Lyman 4-banger #311410 mould in my tool box. Fifty cents a shot is a bit rich for a plinker, so I want to make up some cast boolit loads using this mould. I note that #311410 is a plain base boolit (weighing 130 instead of the mil-spec 110 grains) and that load data of the M-1 Carbine seems to be in the 28-36,000 psi range. Ordinarily, this would mean the use of a gas check and WDWW alloy for any kind of accuracy and control of leading.

I seek guidance from experienced M-1 carbine reloaders. I have Alliant 2400, Reloder7, WC 680 & 820, and IMR4198 available as powders. Would a "wax gas-check" be advisable? I use these in .32-20WCF when pressures and velocity are on the high end with good results. Any suggestions about dies? The m-1 carbine case is tapered, will carbide dies work, or am I going to have to lube and degrease?

Your thoughts, experiences, suggestions, or advise would be appreciated---

[fcvan]

Recently, I have loaded and fired quite a few rounds through some M1 carbine rifles and a Ruger BlackHawk in 30 carbine. The load was 13 grains of H4227 which cycled the rifles well. I have two molds I was using in the carbine.

One is a plain based Saeco 321 which is supposed to be 32 Cal and 95 grains but is casting about .310 and 100 grains. I've been using the Lee C309-120 which is casting slightly fatter than .310 (I size to .309) and only weighs about 115 grains with the same alloy. Both boolits shot well in the carbine. The plain based boolit likes to be a little harder to avoid leading issues. The gas check design shoots well with range scrap and a gas check.

I have a gas check maker for 30 on order from Pat Marlins, a vendor one this site. You can get his checkmaker to make either regular gas checks or plain based gas checks out of soda can aluminum. I have some plain based check makers for 35 and 45 caliber and the thin aluminum checks work great on plain based boolits. I hope this helps. Frank

[curator]

Thanks for your response. My concern with the 130 grain Lyman boolit is plain base and 130 grains weight as compared to the standard for the cartridge, 110-115 grain slug. My limited experience with other rifle-auto-shuckers has led me to believe gas checks are necessary if decent accuracy and action function are priorities. I was hoping someone on this forum had actual experience with this specific boolit and the powders I have in stock.

[Larry Gibson]

I've shot lots of 311410s out of several M1 carbines in the past. Start with 10 gr of 2400 or 4227 and work up until accuracy really goes south (probably around 1600 fps +/-) or you get to 12 gr of 2400 or 12 .5 gr of 4227. I found that bullet was sutiable for plinking purposes but if full performance is wanted from the .30 carbine with cast bullets a GC'd cast bullet in the 105 - 118 gr weight range is much, much better.

Larry Gibson

[runfiverun]

one of the odd things i found to help with 2400 in the little carbine case was to use a magnum sr primer.
i stopped at 11. sumthin grains of 2400 but the mag primer is what really made things work for me.
dunno why it just did.

[curator]

Thank you fcvan, Larry, runfiverun! I will try the magnum primer to see if it makes a difference in my gun. While I have no intentions to shoot critters with this gun (I have much better choices) would a gas check design like Lee's C309-113F or C309-120R be a better choice than the 311410 boolit? What I am looking for is smooth feeding, reasonable 50 yard accuracy and simple reloading. How about using Lee Liquid Alox or 45-45-10 for lube. WDWW or air cooled?

[jimb16]

I use that bullet all the time in my carbines. Only one of the 30 or so carbines that I've owned over the years had any problem with it, and that one didn't like ANY cast boolit, GC'ed or not. I almost always use 2400 or WC820 with them, around 12 gr. I get good accuracy and reliable functioning with no leading.

[leadman]

That boolit should work just fine. Also your 680 will work well at the reduced velocities your boolit is capable of. I have found a boolit .002 oversized seems to make for more consistent velocity in the carbine, provided the chamber will allow it.

[curator]

Hardness? Will ACWW work or do I need WDWW? No problem making the slugs .311 as the mould drops them at .312 from WW +2% tin. How critical is case length?

[leadman]

The case headspaces on the case mouth so this has to be correct for function of the rifle. I water quench my boolits and have no leading or accuracy issues and it is so easy to do.

Measure the inside diameter of the case mouth fired in your gun with another load. This will give you an idea if the chamber is large enough to allow release of the oversized boolit from the case.

[UBER7MM]

Curator,

10.6 grains IMR-4227 and a standard rifle primer all under a Lyman 311410. That is Lyman's published minimum load and should serve you and the carbine well for plinking.

I hope that helps,