How hard would it be to make a simple set of dies to make HBWC?

[MBTcustom]

I have a friend/customer that wants a simple HBWC for his 357. He showed me an example of one that he buys already made from some manufacturer. It has no lube grooves, it is strait walled, and appears to be tumble lubed. He said he would be thrilled if I could just get him some dies that he could use in his RockChucker to smash these out of wire or a similar boolit.
Just a spherical hollow base and a flat nose.
I do not have a heat treating facility, and I do not have a cylindrical grinder.
I can lap surfaces in though.
I pretty much told him that swaging dies are outside my comfort zone as a machinist, but what he was asking for was so insanely simple, I just can't quit thinking about it.

How small a gap will lead squeeze through? .0005? .0002? less? (Remembering that we are talking about the force that a RockChucker can produce.)

Do dies need to be hard for forming lead only? (as opposed to jacketed boolits)

I'm thinking about just giving it a try, but I really cant justify blowing all the machine time unless I'm sure I can get it done with what I have.

Also, can anyone tell me where I can send this fella to get some dies made like this and other configurations? HBWC molds?

Thanks for the help!

[marten]

Just have a go! nothing ventured nothing gained!
Bleed will be something to be careful of, but if you can lap so that your punch slides nice with lube you should be ok. You will get away without hardening for lead only (if you use soft lead).
Fill your boots and jump in!!!!

[MBTcustom]

Alrighty then!

[ReloaderFred]

Zero Bullet Co. used to make a bullet like that. It was a plain cylinder with a deep hollow base, and lubed with their black dry lube. They still leaded horribly, at least in my PPC revolver when I was shooting a lot of PPC matches in the late 1970's.

It should be an easy die to make, and the bullet should come out ok, if the end user sticks to pure lead, or at least nearly pure lead. One thing that will be critical is the weight of the slug used to swage the final bullet. If he uses something similar to a cast double end wadcutter, that should put him pretty close to the final weight and be easier on the die. He would simply use the swaging die to remove the lube grooves and form the hollow base.

If he went that route, he could also size and lube the double end wadcutters prior to swaging the hollow base. Then when he ran them into the swaging die, the lube would stay in place and only the hollow base and flat nose would be formed. With that method, he could then tumble lube the finished bullets to further reduce leading.

Hope this helps.

Fred

[Reload3006]

if your friend is just wanting a hollow base semi wad cutter lead bullet Hawk dies would probably be the least expensive route. as far as leading I knurl my bullets then tumble lube them in 45/45/10 or straight up LLA I have zero leading with them in both 357 out of a gp100 and .430 out of a smith 629 they shoot great and easy to make no leading plus cheap.

I have not personally used hawk dies. I do know people who have and love them Sasquatch is a member here that has them My gear is R Corbin.

[DukeInFlorida]

Mihec recently did a group buy HBWC mold. It's a Cramer style mold.

He still has some .412 and .432 versions left in inventory. He must have sold all of the .359 molds already. I have one, and it casts fine.

That's what I use for the HBWC's, and it has a generous lube groove also.

[KCcactus]

As of 8/27/12, MiHec still had some hbwc molds. Send him a PM.

http://www.castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=163158

I have this one in .360 and .432. Both cast great when you get them to the proper temp.

[30yrcaster]

I did a test for Lee with their liquid Alox around the time they came out with it on smooth sided bullets with no knurling or cannalures. They told me at the time they hadn't tried that. It was horrible and same as Corbins dip lube. Most of it scraped off when loading the bullets. I had lead spraying me in the face and lead in the cylinders, barrel and forcing cone. I knurled some and used the Liquid Alox and it worked fantastic. They told me they already knew it worked with knurled bullets. I got my first bottle from them free for my report.

[Mozz]

I have a set of Corbn's 38 HBWC (Smooth sides) dies, I use a mix of Alox, floor wax and have no issues with leading. In fact I can't remenber when i last cleaned the barrel, accuracy is as good as the first day i used it.

Mozz

[deltaenterprizes]

If you make them like the old Herters and C-H it would a lot easier. I have done then with a core seat die and a pointed base punch.
Look on Corbin's site for drawings to see how a core seat die is made.