Opinions on BP revolvers

[44man]

Been to another site I am banned from. Seeing posts about BP revolvers. Funny answers!
I have taken many deer with round balls from the Old Army and my friend has taken many with a Remington and round balls.
Some say a conical but you can't load enough powder. Some say a point blank finishing shot only.
We get 1102 fps or more with a round ball and penetration is amazing with massive internal damage. Some deer drop right now. Bones are smashed.
These things are as good as the .45 Colt but range is reduced because of twist and accuracy in the Old Army yet killing power is amazing.
Thinking back to the old west and getting shot with a cap and ball is scary.
I consider a cap and ball a shorter range .44 mag.

[Idaho Sharpshooter]

They add a degree of difficulty to hunting.

You said "many"?

I am curious, how old are you and where do you live; to kill "many" deer?

Rich
Sua Sponte

[Multigunner]

The Walker Colt with a full charge is right up there in magnum territory.
The round ball pushed at the maximum velocity allowable by the charge capacity is usually more deadly in most situations than the heavier conical bullet at a lower velocity.

The British found that the .36 Colt, which was a favored private purchase handgun for officers at one time, was not much as a manstopper when the "picket ball" was used. In one case 5 rounds completely penetrated the body of a native attacker in a tight grouping yet he still managed to close the distance and behead the British officer who'd shot him.
The round ball, of any sort including buckshot, gives up its energy in the wound more quickly than a conical ball. The conical ball may penetrate better, but unless the conical deforms or fragments, which it seldom does at C&B revolver velocities, the round ball will deliver more shock in a shorter distance traveled in the body.

This of course is only relivant when both bullets are of the same alloy and in traditional form, and at close range where the velocity advantage is still firmly on the side of the round ball.
Otherwise Semi Wadcutters seem best for most uses, and a short body semi wadcutter can give up its energy very rapidly.

PS
In the old west death from any sort of wound was more often from infection, no anti-biotics were available.
The major worry with bullet wounds was mascerated flesh pushed deeply into the wound.
Surgeons sometimes placed maggots in a bullet wound so they wound eat away the dead necrotic tissue that could not be removed by other means. The use of maggots has been revived in treating some types of wounds, the maggots being specially breed for the purpose in a sterile environment.

[44man]

They add a degree of difficulty to hunting.

You said "many"?

I am curious, how old are you and where do you live; to kill "many" deer?

Rich
Sua Sponte
Six with it. The last went up and down dead. I don't know how many my friend has.
I am in WV, eastern panhandle and get 5 to7 deer a season and quit when I can't give meat away. I do not feel handicapped with the Old Army. It is really a deer killer.
I am near 75 and have 375 to 400 deer kills, forgot exactly.
I do love the large stuff, .44, .45, .475 and .500 JRH but I can not call a cap and ball a weak sister.
Accuracy at range is a question because twist rates can be wrong, just shoot closer.

[RobsTV]

With an original 1858 New Army (see avatar), never had much accuracy shooting .459 143gr round balls over various amounts of Goex 2f and 3f. About the best the 8" barreled revolver would do was 4 to 5" groups at 10 yards. The bigger and stronger step brother, the 2012 version revolver in .500 with 8 3/8" barrel, is grouping 3" at 50yds and still has a lot left for me to get better. I would guess the meat would have a better chance with the BP revolver.

Calculator shows about 384 ft/lbs. That is close to 9mm pistol performance, and much less than 40 S&W.

[44man]

Accuracy can be a problem. It is just twist mostly to stabilize a RB.
I find they kill much better then a .357. Large game will be a problem but they seem to do well on deer.
I use Swiss powder for velocity but do see a reduction in accuracy the faster I shoot the ball.
I just shorten range. 20 to 25 yards is best. Nothing has been lacking to kill deer. It is actually surprising.
I have thought to get mine converted but it costs too much.

[subsonic]

I'm just happy I live in Missouri. Starting this year we can hunt with centerfire handguns during "alternative methods" season, which has replaced our old "muzzleloader" season.

I'm still gonna take my .50 caliber ;-)

[44man]

I'm just happy I live in Missouri. Starting this year we can hunt with centerfire handguns during "alternative methods" season, which has replaced our old "muzzleloader" season.

I'm still gonna take my .50 caliber ;-)
Wonderful. It takes some states a long time.

[Dale53]

Round balls have a very blunt profile. That, coupled with being made of pure lead, allows serious expansion and good terminal results. The only minus is that they can lack penetration. However, a Ruger Old Army should be just dandy for reasonable range lung shots.

My experience with round balls is with muzzle loaders. I had a very nice single shot pistol that I hunted small game with. Didn't have any rabbits run off after being hit. The .22 rimfire, in comparison, sucks. I have had rabbits shot to pieces but continue to run with even .22 rimfire hollow points. Recovered rabbits often weren't worth taking home. That didn't happen with the round ball guns (mostly .358")...

I also have a good deal of experience on edible small game with modern revolvers and the 1911 .45 ACP (from .32's to .45's). All of them, using proper flat nosed bullets, worked exceptionally well without objectionable meat loss. Of course, it was important to place the bullets correctly. Correctly meaning in the head on close shots and behind the shoulder through the lungs for the longer shots (through the slats)....

FWIW
Dale53

[subsonic]

We could always handgun hunt during "rifle" season, but now they've added handguns to the second season. You can only imagine how happy I was to read that!

Now there ARE a bunch of pissed off ML guys in our state as a result of this, but for the life of me, I can't understand why. They can still hunt with their smokepoles while I poke .50 cal holes through my deer with a BFR! I know which one is harder to connect with... and it's not the rifle!

They argue that a 15" Encore with a scope in .308 etc is just a rifle without a stock. Which only tells me they've never tried to shoot a deer with one... these must be the most difficult weapons to shoot unless you can rest the forend on something. Certainly a challenge to try to shoot offhand.

[Thumbcocker]

Don't get me started on in line "Muzzle loaders" with pellets, sabots, and variable scopes.

[44man]

Don't get me started on in line "Muzzle loaders" with pellets, sabots, and variable scopes.
I have felt that way too. It was called a 'Primitive" season at one time and I feel it should remain the same. There is room for everyone during each season but to see a guy kill animals at well over 200 yards with an inline is nothing more then a high power rifle.
The fact is that some places have so many deer it is just a better harvest to control the herd. I do not feel handicapped with a flinter or revolver. I will kill as many or more deer then they do.
We can only use a revolver during rifle season and I do better then most.
The choice is hunting or shooting. Sit a house to shoot or go in among the animals to hunt. I prefer hunting. Even an open tree stand rather then a house on stilts is better. Tracking deer and shooting off hand is hunting.
I had my dogs in the yard this morning. One is 16 and can't see good. A spike walked across the yard, past the blind dog to check the pear tree. Me and the other dog was close too. The deer circled the tree and walked towards the little blind one. My other dog just sat and watched.
I could never shoot it, he is almost tame. The wonder of nature. If I had a bunch of apples I think I could hand feed him. Some need a long range gun for deer when I can fool deer to be all around me in the woods.

[freedom475]

I love hunting with my Remington 58... My most accurate load for mine comes from using 25-30gr of 4ffff and a .457RB. It shoots VERY well and gives my 930fps

4ffff is not just for flinters and NO, the pressure is NOT to high. This has been thoroughly tested at the ballistics lab to be plenty safe for use in the revolvers.

I took this doe at over 50 yards and the ball went right trough. Broke a rib on the way in and the way out.:D

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/picture.php?albumid=200&pictureid=4709

[44man]

I love hunting with my Remington 58... My most accurate load for mine comes from using 25-30gr of 4ffff and a .457RB. It shoots VERY well and gives my 930fps

4ffff is not just for flinters and NO, the pressure is NOT to high. This has been thoroughly tested at the ballistics lab to be plenty safe for use in the revolvers.

I took this doe at over 50 yards and the ball went right trough. Broke a rib on the way in and the way out.:D

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/picture.php?albumid=200&pictureid=4709
Super. They really do work.

[Old Iron Sights]

Took a deer once with my walker. I think I was pushing about 65g 3F. It didn't run too far. My next choice would be my rem having the next highest capacity of the revolvers I have.

Nice pic. I need to keep my revolvers on me more deer hunting.

[Multigunner]

Some years back, on one of the history or discovery channels, they showed a test of the 1860 Colt on a balistic gel representation of a human arm with real bones imbedded.
The soft lead .44 ball shattered the arm bones in a spectacular fashion. The arm would have had to be amputated in those days, and like as not would have been unsalvageable even nowadays.

PS
A friend, long deceased now, killed a deer with one shot from a .44 brass framed replica Confederate revolver, same cylinder and bore as the 1860 only built like a 1851. He shot the deer in the brown below the antlers and lifted its skull cap killing it instantly.

[PS Paul]

I think 44man meets the qualification of "many" deer kills, eh? ha-ha!!

44, what did they ban you from the other site for? Too much honesty?

[Wolfer]

Don't believe I'm up to 44 mans count yet but he does have 20 years on me so maybe I'll catch up someday. Good chance I won't though because I tend to let several deer walk even when their well in pistol range. I love to hunt but I only need about 4 deer a year and if I don't have anybody wantin one I just don't shoot.

I've only killed two with my 58 rem and the lee 452-200RF with the cyl as full of 3F as I could get it. Penetration is good with this load but I get no expansion even when bones are hit and I always shoot pure lead.

I have killed several deer with a 45 colt and I can't tell much difference in the end result

[44man]

I would be very afraid of a cap and ball in the old days.
Then the kids that went to war in the civil war facing such destruction from the guns. A tribute to bravery and need of prayers even today to both sides. Fly the Confederate flag or the Stars and Stripes and get my respect, brave men all.
Why we do not fly both flags over our nation to this day baffles me. Why do we not honor both sides?

[Multigunner]

I would be very afraid of a cap and ball in the old days.
Then the kids that went to war in the civil war facing such destruction from the guns. A tribute to bravery and need of prayers even today to both sides. Fly the Confederate flag or the Stars and Stripes and get my respect, brave men all.
Why we do not fly both flags over our nation to this day baffles me. Why do we not honor both sides?

Because no matter how brave Confederate soldiers were the Confederacy lost, their flag represents disunity and the needless suffering of hundreds of thousands of Americans.
The courage of Confederate troops is often honored by battle reinactment groups and literature and film.
"Drums in the Deep South" is one of my favorite films. If you haven't seen it you can find it free on the Internet Archive.
For the flip side read "the Iron Furnace" or "Andersonville".

[EDK]

Don't get me started on in line "Muzzle loaders" with pellets, sabots, and variable scopes.

One of the more memorable lines that Val Kilmer (as Doc Holliday) in TOMBSTONE had was "there are limits to even my hypocrisy."

The items you mentioned aren't primitive in my opinion. I do not begrudge anyone all the hunting seasons he is able to participate in, but high tech black powder rifles......

I'm sure I will get abused for my opinion, but remember Clark Gable's immortal remark in GONE WITH THE WIND..."frankly, my dear, I don't give a d***!"

I'd grab an OLD ARMY with target sights...had one back in the 1970s...and find a mould for it that suited me and live happily ever after.

:redneck: :cbpour: :guntootsmiley:

[UNIQUEDOT]

their flag represents disunity and the needless suffering of hundreds of thousands of Americans.

If this is how you honestly view the symbol of the confederate flags i would really hate to hear your views on what the American flag stands for. Perhaps a symbol for warmongers or dictatorship? after all the confederacy did have the legal and guaranteed right to withdraw from the union. A right which was not honored. My views are if you are fighting for your constitutional rights the suffering is not needless, but necessary. General Lee indeed did the right thing for our country when he placed his sword before Grant, but i don't think either of those flags represent "the needless suffering of hundreds of thousands".

[JesterGrin_1]

This will sound Confusing lol.

I have had my Ruger New Army Stainless since it was made in 76. And have never hunted with it BUT I have killed a 200 pound Hog with it lol. Ok I understand What lol. Well I had it on me with a full load of 40Gr of 3F and a Round Ball. I went out Deer Hunting early about 4 AM and decided to sit on the ground next to a tree for Grins. And there was just a sliver of moon so very little if any light. And I heard what at the time sounded to me like a Rhino coming at me through the Mesquite and cactus so I just grabbed the Ruger and took my best guess and fired. And I was Blind lol. But I got lucky lol. It was a 200 pound hog that I shot square in the middle of the head so it took out its brain and went into the middle of him through a lung. Needless to say he dropped right there about 5 feet from me. Did it scare me? HECK YES IT DID lol.

[Taylor]

Because we were looked on as garbage,as "rebels" trying to destroy a nation.Because we stood up for what we believed in and was willing to pay for it.No different now,uncle sam still wants his sheep.Maybe someday the stars and bars will be turned right side up.Think about it,The Southern states stood up to the United States government,and they done by virtue of the contitution.Oh yeah,it offends some folks,I don't care about that.

[jwp475]

Six with it. The last went up and down dead. I don't know how many my friend has.
I am in WV, eastern panhandle and get 5 to7 deer a season and quit when I can't give meat away. I do not feel handicapped with the Old Army. It is really a deer killer.
I am near 75 and have 375 to 400 deer kills, forgot exactly.
I do love the large stuff, .44, .45, .475 and .500 JRH but I can not call a cap and ball a weak sister.
Accuracy at range is a question because twist rates can be wrong, just shoot closer.



How many per year? How many with a bow? How many with black powder? How many with a handgun?

[44man]

How many per year? How many with a bow? How many with black powder? How many with a handgun?
Why do you want to know?
It is like asking how many boolits you cast in your lifetime.
There is a time you quit counting. It is cussing that you need to gut, haul and butcher again.

[jwp475]

400 deer, assuming you took your first one at 10 years old that means that you have averaged 6 plus deer per year... WOW that is an amazing average

[waksupi]

Until the wolves moved in, some areas were good for around 24 deer tags per year. Some states have a one a day season. I may have to move to one of those, to keep myself in meat.

[Multigunner]

If this is how you honestly view the symbol of the confederate flags i would really hate to hear your views on what the American flag stands for. Perhaps a symbol for warmongers or dictatorship? after all the confederacy did have the legal and guaranteed right to withdraw from the union. A right which was not honored. My views are if you are fighting for your constitutional rights the suffering is not needless, but necessary. General Lee indeed did the right thing for our country when he placed his sword before Grant, but i don't think either of those flags represent "the needless suffering of hundreds of thousands".

The South fired first, they lost, get over it.
Had the North invaded the Confederacy without provocation you might have a point, but thats not how it went down.
The occupation of Tennessee by Confederate forces from Mississippi and Georgia with blatant derailing of the democractic process would have been reason enough to declare war on the Confederacy.
When you invade a neighboring state then kidnap and murder its citizens and destroy ballot boxes in order to falsify the results of a referendum, then you have committed an act of war.
That action alone completely destroyed any credibility the Confederacy ever had.

[44man]

400 deer, assuming you took your first one at 10 years old that means that you have averaged 6 plus deer per year... WOW that is an amazing average
Actually, during culls at orchards with unlimited tags I have gone as high as 17. I still get 5 to 7 a year depending on who takes meat. I keep 2 for myself.
One day I shot 5, not to mention the rest of the season. No meat was wasted.
I hate to gut and butcher but a lot of whole deer were sent to feed the hungry.
Now some states want you to pay for processing. I used to skin careful and salt hides to send to a tanner. They made me buckskin in 3 colors. I had a stack of boxes full of buckskin 6' high that I made all kinds of things with, jackets, vests, gloves, pouches, etc. I still have a lot left. It was 25 cents a square foot.
The outfit was Deerwear but they are long gone.
I know deer, they are easy. I fool them and have had over 17 feeding around me within 10 yards. I have booted a deer from a bed, played with her and she came back to the bed and laid down without paying me any attention and I was right next to her. I have had deer run around, come back and stand next to me looking at the other deer. I have walked right behind a feeding herd for 500 yards without them looking at me. You have no idea. I could have killed 2000 deer easy.
Have you ever made a deer walk to you from over 100 yards so you could shoot it? Have you ever been 20 yards from a huge buck as he tore up trees and worked scrapes? Have you ever been in the open in the middle of a herd as they fed?
Ask about camo and I will tell you all about it. I will tell you what sucks. A white "T" shirt works better. Blaze orange is best.
Do you really want to talk deer?

[M-Tecs]

I know deer, they are easy. I fool them and have had over 17 feeding around me within 10 yards. I have booted a deer from a bed, played with her and she came back to the bed and laid down without paying me any attention and I was right next to her. I have had deer run around, come back and stand next to me looking at the other deer. I have walked right behind a feeding herd for 500 yards without them looking at me. You have no idea. I could have killed 2000 deer easy.
Have you ever made a deer walk to you from over 100 yards so you could shoot it? Have you ever been 20 yards from a huge buck as he tore up trees and worked scrapes? Have you ever been in the open in the middle of a herd as they fed?
Ask about camo and I will tell you all about it. I will tell you what sucks. A white "T" shirt works better. Blaze orange is best.
Do you really want to talk deer?

I do want to talk deer. I have taken about 150 deer but I am always trying to improve. Please pass on some of your secrets. Thanks, Joel

[44man]

I do want to talk deer. I have taken about 150 deer but I am always trying to improve. Please pass on some of your secrets. Thanks, Joel
Anyone here can E mail me at jameswbrm@aol.com and I will send you what I put on paper.
Nobody would edit or publish and I never had money to pay. If I would have killed a record buck I could write anything but I have always been a meat hunter, can't stand buck meat. I shot many good ones in Ohio and had to give the stuff away. I think I made enemies! :bigsmyl2:
Each year I could add to it but no need. Last season I made a deer walk right to me, some is in my freezer yet.
Now I give it away just like my loading info.
I recently sent it to Gear and wonder if he liked it.
It is really simple, learned by trying things in the field and observing reactions.
It is funny to have a deer 2' away from you and not even look at you. You can walk around, kneel down, draw a bow, etc, like being with some cows.

[KCSO]

They don't do to bad on humans either a 44 caliber ball went in the front of the chest and came out the back leaving a 1 1/2" hole and a dead body. And on the humorous side the Detectives at the scene didn't know how to unload the gun so they dumped it in a sink full of water!

[Potsy]

I had a steel framed '58 w/adjustable sights from Cabelas when I was about 20 or so.
Packed it on a couple of trail rides and a couple of deer hunts but never shot anything with it.
It was accurate.
I'd love to come up on a deal on an Old Army, but those things are getting higher every day.
You can carry a cap and ball during our muzzleloader season in TN, but not cartridge revolvers or single shots.
Come to think of it, I've tried the big scoped single shots (Contender) and repeaters (Savage Striker) and would much rather carry either of my muzzleloaders. For that matter, I'd rather carry a ball bat, just because I saw absolutely zero advantage to them. But that's a matter of personal taste.
If someone would like to try to change my mind, I'd welcome it. I'm pretty open minded anytime I might run up on an excuse to buy a new gun.

[saz]

I do have a replica brass frame confederate '51 navy and it is a hoot to shoot. I don't load it over 20grs fff with a rb in fear of damaging the brass frame. It is very accurate out to 25 yards, never tried it any farther. I have popped a couple of hares with it though.

I found out at an early age that RBs are deadly on deer. They flatten out and do all kinds of internal damage. First deer I ever shot was at age 11 with an F.I.E. Kentucky long rifle (AKA 10lb fencepost) in 45cal. What a great shooter. No problems hammering deer out to 75 yards or so. Now, I do own 2 inline MLs but I DO NOT shoot sabots, pellets etc..... They are loaded with loose powder and lead conicals. Almost all of the inlines have fast twist barrels that are PERFECT heavy boolit shooters. My Remington Genesis is a 1:28 twist which is fed nothing but 495gr conicals over loose 2F and will shoot under 2" groups at 100 yards all day long. I also have a White Super 91 with a 1:24 twist that will do even better. I have printed a few .75" 100 yard groups but it will average right about 1".

I like both inlines and sidelocks, but if the weather is nasty and wet, the genesis gets the nod to go hunting, as the breech is very weather resistant and 209 primers help a LOT in crappy weather. The moose in my avatar was taken with that ML and conical.

[Multigunner]

I do have a replica brass frame confederate '51 navy and it is a hoot to shoot. I don't load it over 20grs fff with a rb in fear of damaging the brass frame. It is very accurate out to 25 yards, never tried it any farther. I have popped a couple of hares with it though.



I have a Brass frame .44 that I was given by the previous owner to scrap for parts after the cylinder arbor pin pulled through the receiver.
After finding that the frame had not fractured, only the threaded hole itself being distorted, I made a new arbor with larger threads and turned a shoulder on it near the base, then turned a mating shoulder inside the opening at the rear of the cylinder.

This way the frame and threads do not take any of the shock of firing.

After rethreading the frame I took the extra step of silver soldering the threaded portion in the hole, so it is as ridgid as it can get.

I've fired hundreds of 25 grain loads through the revolver since I made these repairs, and it has remained rock solid.

Anothing thing that reduced stress on the pin was my counter sinking the forcing cone and tapering the rifling at the barrel breech. This was done because the barrel had not been cleaned since the pin had pulled through and the breech end was very roughly pitted. I removed the pitted steel and smoothed every thing out as much as possible. This left everything gently tapered so there is very little engraving pressure.
Accuracy is still good.

PS
A couple of broken brass frames I've examined appear to have broken because there was too much material removed inside under the pin. One had only one thread on the under side supported by the frame threads.

The cylinder pin that pulled through on my .44 had very poorly cut threads, undersized and rounded.

Poor workmanship is more likely the cause of pull throughs than the strength of the brass.

Also Confederate "Brass" frame pistols were more often made of bronze rather than brass. Bronze is very well suited to the purpose. Brass with the addition of zinc is a bit too brittle.

Berylium bronze is stronger than tool steel and has been used to make some revolver frames in recent years.

[Hogdaddy]

I Dropped 2 at one time, Not one shot though, One with a rifle BP & a Replica 1851 but in 44 cal. I loaded 30gr of fffg Pyrodex over just a round ball, No wad ; ) PS Shot many deer with a string & sticks :bigsmyl2
H/D

[Four Fingers of Death]

My mate had a small property in a village about 15miles from the town where I live. He had a State Forest behind his property and while it was a small 10acre block, he was getting a disproportinate amount of game on it,including pigs and goats.

He decided that he would take a goat with his Ruger Old Army. We are not allowed to hunt with handguns in Australia (unless you are a cashed up tourist in the Northern Territory on abig dollar safari), but my mate was determined to use it, so crept upto the scrub one afternoon. He got a nice meat goat at about 20 paces, but as he fired, he set fire to the scrub in front of the gun and it was well alight. His neighbours came running to assist him to put the fire out, the neighbour on one side was a cop and his wife was a cop also. The guy on the other side is a firefighter. My mate was panicking that he was going to be in serious trouble. He had the revolver jammed in his waistband under his shirt while he was fighting the fire with his neighbours. When they finished, he invited them down to the house for a home brew. After a few minutes of washing the smoke away, his neighbour realised that the others were off talking and while they were not looking, she pulled out the ROA and handing it to him said, you might want to tuck this aways somewhere safe. He nearly fainted, he dropped it in the drama and the lady cop was beside him and scooped it up before he got caught with it. Cool lady. Her hubby was a real PITA and had no sense of humour apparently, but she was ok.

He never did get to eat the meat,but he popped plenty of crows from his back verandah with his 22 rifle who flew in to feast on the remains of the carcass.

[44man]

If anyplace on earth needs guns, it is Australia, too many nasty critters. I always felt bad for all you blokes allowing the taking of guns but it will happen here if Obama gets in again.
The gov is preparing for a civil war because we will protect the constitution.
The first ploy will be to limit and tax ammo.

[Four Fingers of Death]

If anyplace on earth needs guns, it is Australia, too many nasty critters. I always felt bad for all you blokes allowing the taking of guns but it will happen here if Obama gets in again.
The gov is preparing for a civil war because we will protect the constitution.
The first ploy will be to limit and tax ammo.

If you are prepared to jump through some hoops and pay license fees, etc you can have guns here, but we are only allowed to have handguns for target shooting and not for hunting.

One of our biggest problems at the moment is that Workcover, the national giverment body controlling workplace safety and worker's compensation (private companies are the insurers,but the controlling body is a govt agency and pretty much all powerful) is making it nearly imppossible to cart gunpowder to gunshops.

You can cart 30tons of gelly to the mines and many of those trucks go past the local gunshop's door,but are not licensed to carry gunpowder.

The is also pressure being applied to the gunpowder manafacturers and importers here to limit production to kilo or half kilo containers. Currently most powders are also available in 4kilo (8.8 imperial pounds) containers. Time to stock up, but I have the breeze in my drawers as the old Scots used to say (broke and with the a$$ out of my pants).

Slowly wearing us down.Strangely enough, there seems to be no interest inlimiting factory ammo being shipped about????

[44man]

Liberals are weird animals. We have some here in government that own guns and have had to use them to protect themselves against criminals. Yet they are on top of the gun control push. They think they are above all other people and only they can have guns.
I have never carried and never had a need to. I don't have a single handgun for carry. Mine are all so large for hunting it would be silly. Those that do should be allowed anywhere because they can save lives from nut cases. The gov thinks they can protect and by taking guns they will stop crime. What they do not think about is you can not regulate what is in a persons mind and a nut with a machete in a crowd is worse then one with a gun.
I worked for UAL for 42 years and after 9-11, security confiscated my nail clippers and fork from my lunch bucket. They took tools from mechanics.
Yet they could not search a woman in a burka because that is "profiling." When you remember Muslims were the cause, they SHOULD be the target.
If I remember it was a bad shooting in your country that started the gun take. Since the liberals can't go after nuts, they went after everyone. It is the liberal way. Your best bet over there is to remove them from government.
Over here it is hard now because the more on gov dole without having to work will vote for more liberals for free stuff from taxpayers. Tax paying companies flee to other countries. The answer is to tax the rich more.

[Combat Diver]

NC is considering allowing BP handguns for deer hunting this week. Hope it passes, I wouldn't mind carrying my 1851 Navy during ML season with my side hammer .50 cal.


CD

[44man]

NC is considering allowing BP handguns for deer hunting this week. Hope it passes, I wouldn't mind carrying my 1851 Navy during ML season with my side hammer .50 cal.


CD
We can only use a single shot pistol here in WV during ML season but I can use the BP revolver in regular gun season.
We lost the early ML and archery season in Sept this year. I don't think anyone hunted in the warm weather so harvest was too low. What they did was to open archery at the end of Sept, it is open until Dec 31. Bag limits look larger.