Model 1 Sales AR-15 Kit (mini-review)

[ilcop22]

'Evening,

I recently received a Model 1 Sales AR-15 kit for an A2 target gun build I've been wanting for offhand service matches. Here's the kit I ordered:

KSE200 20 Inch Standard Rifle Kit:
- 20" 1-9" E.R. Shaw manganese phosphate chrome moly bbl
- Standard A2 flashider,
- A2 upper receiver w/standard rear sight aperture
- Standard bolt & carrier
- Standard trigger
- Standard charging handle
- Front sight base w/std front sight
- Round A2 handguard
- A2 buttstock
- Standard A2 grip

Lower:
- LRB Arms M15SA

Order was placed on 06/05/12; shipped on 08/02/12. I was notified of the backorder (which I expected, despite there being no backorder notice on their website) the next day. At the time, they were running a 6 week backorder due to high order volume.

I've only been able to put 20 rounds down it, and I wasn't seeing impacts on target at 25m. More on that in a bit.

Overall fit and finish of the kit is good, and what I would expect at this price point. The LRB M15SA lower is, of course, fantastic, as I've now assembled 4 different rifles using them. Fit and finish on that lower is great. A nice surprise with the Model 1 kit is a hex head grip screw, which was a whole lot easier to tighten down than the typical flat head screws that come with. It's the little things that keep me going.

I ran into two problems, one of which relating to the accuracy issue mentioned above. The first issue was with the front takedown pin installation. The takedown spring was out of spec, and I had to cut off 2 or so coils from it to get the detent and takedown installed. Those of you familiar with installing the front takedown can imagine the cursing I was doing trying to get that sucker in before realizing the spring was too long. I hate chasing detents.

The second problem was that the FSB was not trued up, as it was slightly canted. This accounted for the accuracy issues I had previously experienced. I first verified the issue with a laser bore sighter, which left me with a RS windage all the way over to the left. After tearing down and repinning the FSB, the issue has been corrected. A minor issue I found relative to that was the FSB pins were not properly heat treated (if at all), so I actually had to bore them out with a drill press because my punches were smashing them like a hammer to lead. A bit of a disappointment, but an easy fix.

Other than those minor issues, I found the kit to be worth the $510 price tag, and would recommend such a kit or any other kit from Model 1 Sales based on my experience with the company.

I'll hopefully be going out tomorrow for accuracy testing now that the FSB has been adjusted. I may do some minor tweaking to the rifle (NM sights, for instance) within CMP guidelines, but for now, stock is what I wanted, and that's what I received. My club holds monthly offhand rifle matches, which prohibit sling use, so I'll be holding off on a free float tube sleeve unless I decide to compete in CMP with the rifle. M4orgeries are fun, and we should all own at least one, but I'm a rifle man, and I love the classic look of the A2 rifle. :coffeecom

[rromeo]

Thanks for the review. I have heard many bad things about them, but nothing was ever firsthand experience.

[tomme boy]

I have done 2 of them from M1S. Make sure to keep an eye on your CC for about 6 months. I got nailed with charges from someone that stole the info. This was the only place I had used the card so I an about 1500 other people had their info stolen from them. It is a well known issue with M1S.

[Idaho Sharpshooter]

That would keep them off my list of people to do business with.

thank you for the warning.

Rich
Sua Sponte

[ilcop22]

I have done 2 of them from M1S. Make sure to keep an eye on your CC for about 6 months. I got nailed with charges from someone that stole the info. This was the only place I had used the card so I an about 1500 other people had their info stolen from them. It is a well known issue with M1S.

I've had my credit card number stolen so many times, I've lost count. No big deal... Get a phone call from the bank, tell them what charges aren't authorized, they send you a new card. Problem solved. That said, I hope the mods take notice and don't let this thread turn into a discussion on whether or not the company's security systems are sufficient based on what they heard from some guy on some forum... :hijack:

[tomme boy]

Do a search on AR15 for M1S an credit card theft. Here I will make a search real easy for you. I was just trying to help. And as for the kits. They are the bottom of the barrel. But they are good to learn the hard way. Watch out for cracked bolts after about 500 rounds. Accuracy is hit or miss. Even though they use Shaw barrels, they spec them to very poor standards.

http://www.google.com/search?q=model+1+sales+credit+card+problems&rlz=1C1AFAB_enUS491&aq=0&oq=model+1+sales+credit&sugexp=chrome,mod=7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

[ilcop22]

It wasn't personal... Take a breather, tomme boy. I didn't post this for second hand opinions, just to inform other members my experience with the company. If you have a first-hand experience, please feel free to share it. Otherwise, you're just hijacking the thread.

[Dead Dog Jack]

I, too, built a standard A2 with the Model 1 Sales upper kit. So far so good for me. No complaints and it's as accurate as I can shoot it at 100 yards.

One thing I did change was the front sight post. I put in a KNS Precision .034" post.

http://home.comcast.net/~swaffield/AR15rtsidefull.jpg

[zomby woof]

I have had my hands on three of these kits over the years. They offer a good entry level kit. I may have had problems with little parts, no big deal. Good deal for the money.

[Echd]

New member, thought I'd talk about my model one experiences.

Purchased about 6 years ago in HS, it was by far my most expensive rifle I had purchased to that point, and considering it represented a lot of hours bagging groceries, I made sure to get exactly what I wanted, and it hasn't let me down yet.

I'll post some pictures tomorrow, but my only gripe is at the time, all I thought about was possible mechanical accuracy and I bought the heaviest, longest guns out there in my zeal to reach out and touch somebody. I barely shoot past 200 (piedmont of NC is hill country!) but its a good shooter.

Mine is a 24 in ss barrel on a dpms lower with RRA parts and trigger. 1 in 8 twist. It shoots fantastic little bug holes with any upper 60 weight bullet or higher (77 gr smks being the best) but stays in tight down to the 50 gr bullets. I have gotten about 3/4 moa to 300 yards with the smks.

Delivery was prompt - I recall ordering and receiving within the week.

No complaints and would not hesitate to use again. It's still one of my favored irons, and new shooters love it for the heft and scope on it. ARs are a great platform to use for womenfolk and small children who are new to shooting and want something easy to bench that won't kick.

[ilcop22]

First off, welcome to the forum, Echd! I think you'll like it here.

I did make it out to the range today, and I put another 60 or so rounds through it. Accuracy was good. Shooting IMI 55 gr M193 rounds at 50 yards, I was grouping at or just over 1 MOA. Only issue that arose was with the front sight post. I adjusted the rear sight to use the IBZ, and @50 yards the front sight is elevated far up to the point that it isn't sturdy. It's my first experience with the IBZ, so I'm wondering if it's the rifle POA, a short detent spring, or some other element. Any advice to that end is appreciated.

I was very pleased with the way it performed, and the fact I was getting out-of-the-box 1 MOA accuracy with it. I'd post pics, but there's nothing special to it, and Dead Dog Jack put a picture of his, which looks identical to mine. :drinks:

[tomme boy]

DPMS sells a taller front site post. It is very tall. File it down to where it regulates with your rear.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/810857/dpms-front-sight-post-square-extended-030-higher-ar-15-matte

Check around, you might be able to find one cheaper.

[tomme boy]

Ilcop, since your in IL, check out RRA. Give them a call, they might have one. Or PK Firearms. I get a lot of parts from both of these places. I'm only about 20 miles from RRA and it is just easier for me to call an order the parts then drive over to pick them up.

[ilcop22]

Great, thanks for the tips, tomme boy. Definitely something I'm going to have to fix.

[ilcop22]

A little update about the build - I added the extra tall front post, but haven't yet had a chance to zero it. I dropped in a JP Enterprises reduced power spring kit, which I've used in the past, and brought the awful 8-9 lb factory trigger to around 4.5#, and it breaks like glass. I highly recommend that pack (less than $20) for AR shooters. Works great in my patrol rifle, and I'm just as happy with this new build.

[montana_charlie]

My only dealing with Model 1 Sales was when I ordered two tapered pins for my front sight.
They are listed on the sight by the standard part number for that type of AR part.
When they arrived, they were not tapered. Instead, they were the straight type, which requires that the FSP abd barrel be setup for them from scratch.

They don't fit if the FSB has already been drilled for taper pins.

I contacted Model 1 Sales and told them of the error, and requested they send the right part. They told me that they don't carry tapered FSB pins, so I asked for a refund. They wouldn't send a refund, because they had sent the pins "that I ordered".

I explained that, by describing their pins by simply using the mil-spec part number, they were signifying that the pins are tapered. Since I had ordered "that part number" and paid their price for it, I wanted to be given THAT PART NUMBER!

THEN they decided they could cough up a refund.



When you find that you have to track your rear sight all the way to the left to get the windage close, it's a good idea to re-torque the barrel nut before doing a major smithing job on the front sight base.

Clamp the upper in a vise with the proper block(s), loosen the barrel nut, place a straight object in the opening on the FSB so you can keep five or ten pounds of counterclockwise torque on the barrel as you retighten the nut.

When you recheck your rear sight, it will probably center up for you.

CM

[ilcop22]

The FSB pins were straight/oversized on my M1S kit. I ordered some DPMS standard taper pins when I adjusted the FSB for zero, and they worked out fine. It's unfortunate you had to go through all that. I checked the fit of the barrel, as I was concerned it might not be torqued right when I adjusted for zero, but fortunately, it was fine. After adjusting the FSB, I zeroed and it ended up a couple clicks right of mechanical zero.

[montana_charlie]

I must admit to having made a mistake in my previous post.
The problem I described above occurred with M&A Parts, not Model 1 Sales.

As for rifle kits are concerned, I recommend you stay away from akpartskits.com.
I just finished building a rifle with a kit from them, and their aftersale support is (essentially) non-existent ... besides being 'snotty' to talk to.

CM