Boolit weight variation

[Goatwhiskers]

Search function didn't work for me. How anal should I be on sorting my boolits for weight. I'm using the RD359190, made a cast this afternoon, threw out the few that hit below 190gr, and a couple that hit the 193gr mark, the rest vary between 191.1gr and 192.9gr. Does this spread have any noticeable effect on accuracy? I've read about and practiced sorting for defects of course, but don't recall anyone mentioning variance in weight. Any comments? GW

[runfiverun]

the smaller the boolit the more it matters.
1 gr or so out of 190 is nothing.
i eyeball sort most of my rifle stuff.
for the 22's i weight sort,and would for a 24-25 cal's if i cast for them.
but 1 gr in 55 is a whole lot different than 1 in 190.

[Lizard333]

Rifle boolits have a greater need for consistency than pistols. A boolit being shot over a hundred yards needs to be more consistent than pistol shot out to 15 yards.

[Idaho Sharpshooter]

For many years Bullseye and NRA pistol matches were won, and near perfect scores shot by people shooting as cast, unsorted/weighed boolits cast using ten and twelve mold gang-style H&G molds.

My Para-Ordnance P-14 IPSC (45acp) will still group under 2" at 50 yds from a ransom rest with 200gr SWC boolits. For ten rounds. That is not exceptional.

I never did anything to them except drop them from the mold onto a folded towel.

My cast boolit Schuetzen rifles, my boltguns for CBA competition are an entirely different story.
Those boolits came from single cavity molds by Jerry Barnett or David Mos (Schuetzen), and the CBA 30 caliber was an Egan 3MX (iirc). THOSE boolits were inspected after dropping them on a towel. I picked them up with tweezers, looked at the sprue cut, and about half were immediately discarded. The acceptable ones went into the block nose down. All ladle poured, with a sprue that must have weighed a 1/4 pound.

One H.M. Pope made the statement that he cast his boolits and stood them up immediately in 50 round blocks in as cast order. I thought that a bit excessive, until I tried that one balmy, overcast afternoon. I made two 60-round blocks, and started casting. I cast sixty in each block, and then replenished the pot.

The first block full was cool to the touch by then, and I miked, then weighed each one, in order. They very gradually grew slightly in diameter and gained weight. At least, the first eight or ten did. Then, I had a run that varied (with a 214gr Schuetzen boolit) less than two-tenths of a grain (!!) for the next hundred and twenty.

I coaxed my lovely wife into easing them into Dillon Blue plastic 22 Hornet boxes of 100 as I cast, in rotation.

It took me about three hours (actual casting time) to make 300 match-grade boolits, either flavor.

I honed out a die that was .0005" oversize for the Egan, and a CBA Champion made me a straightline gas check seater. Neal Jones made me a set of arbor press dies for that Savage 12BV-SS .308 Win.

Everyone that is a serious cast boolit shooter should own a Savage single shot in .308 Win.
Stick a good 36X Leupold on it, do some quality load testing, and be able to sight down at the bench and consistently shoot 5-shot groups well under 1/2" at 100yds. They are so accurate, the Accu-Trigger models, that the CBA changed the Production Class rules.

Rich
Sua Sponte

[Goatwhiskers]

Yeah, Rich, my results are seemingly consistent with Pope's, do need to replicate his process. I start out making light ones, then progress up to the 192's where things seem to stay for a while till the mold starts getting too warm, then seems to be where I get the 193's. I'm gonna cast a group, probably 100, tomorrow and carefully keep everything in order after I get past the wrinkle stage. Most of what I cast are in the 192 range. As I said in the beginning I just kinda wonder sometimes what I oughta throw out and what not, but I suppose 1 or 2gr isn't very much out of 190. I'm kinda cranky about accuracy, but gotta learn how to get it working with cast, little different game than with the other kind of projectiles. GW

[41mag]

I have only been at this since early last year, so take this for what it cost.

I have for the most part only been pouring up revolver boolits to hunt with. This said I DO have some pretty stringent accuracy demands as I want to know for sure that when I settle the sight the boolit goes where I want it too.

Like you, I got to wondering about the weight differences and how one might keep the variable to the minimum side of things. After doing a couple of searches with similar results I came across this post on size/weight variations,
Analysis of cast boolit weight variences (http://www.castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=120938)

My initial desire to cast my own was to feed the appetite of my Raging Bull in 454, as such I started things off with the Lee 452-300RF in the 6 cavity version. I had boolits hitting the scale all over the place due to inexperience, and no thermometers what so ever. I invested in both one for the pot as well as one for the mold and things got quite a bit tighter. Once I made a few notes on pot temps and mold temps I can now easily set up and pour hundreds all within about a 2gr variance. IT is quite easy if your using the same alloy, at the same temp, an you keep your mold temp within a determined range.

This all said, even the ones I poured without a thermometer and with an up to 5gr difference all shot well enough that I could not distinguish which ones might be a flier due to the weight differences, or due to my own inability to hold the darned sights still. I do not own a ransom rest, and the majority f my rested shooting is simply done over the top of a wooden block with a piece of old boot leather laying on it. It isn't pretty but is effective enough to hold the barrel steady. Most times however I am about as good shooting offhand as I am from the rest, and when the boolits turn in groups like some of the ones posted on the link below my sig, I am simply tickled to death. This is a pic of my start to finish pour on one lot of boolits which I documented in the above link. As you can see they started off on the lighter side as well and finished up on the heavier side as the pot emptied and the alloy and mold got hotter. I have verified this since the initial post was done as it got me to thinking about it.

With the same mold and the same alloy used back then I can now keep the temps within a very narrow range using the PID controller on my pot and using a cooling pad for the mold. This has allowed me to really shrink the variance down to within about a 2gr or less spread on those 300's. do they shoot any better, not that I can really tell, but in the back of my mind I at least know if I my groups spread out like buck shot, I simply need to go do something else, cause it ain't the loads causing it.

[1Shirt]

Agree with Runfiverun! The smaller the more fussy you need to be. For 22's & 6MM's, discard ANY obvious defect, and on a digital scale weigh to exact for batch.
As you go up in cal it is less of an issue, unless you are loading for match accuracy, and then I would still go with weighing each up to and including 30 cals.
Talking about rifle of course. For handgun, if they look good, they are probably good.
1Shirt!:coffee:

[Goatwhiskers]

All is highly educational. Cast a few yesterday, first thing I let the mold warm for a longer period of time. First three were light, threw out. Next 15 were 191 range. Balance of 72 thrown were consistently 192.1-192.9. First time I stopped to put some in a block the next pour had one that had a poor base--rounded corners. After that when I stopped I left boolits in the mold and it held its temp, weights didn't change. I figure if I can keep them all in a one grain spread I can rule out boolits for accuracy and work on other factors. Can always remelt the ones I don't like. GW

[selmerfan]

I weight-sorted for the first time ever today. Boolits coming out of 6 cavity RD359-190-RF and GB 6 cavity copy of Lyman 358627. Defects in casting such as rounded bands or bases quickly showed up and pointed boolits that missed the visual inspection, especially with the 358627. However, I discovered that the TL design RD boolit was MUCH harder to visually discern imperfections, but the scale points out which ones didn't fill out quite perfectly. Also quickly discovered which casts I made with the handles not completely closed - MUCH heavier!
Now to check, lube, and do load development for my .357 Max on a Shilen blank for my Encore.

[reloader28]

I never weigh any pistol boolits.
The 223's I keep within .1-.2gr difference in the group of brass that I load.
30cal I sort to .5-.7gr in a load session.
243 I'll normally keep to .3-.5gr.
I'll weigh and sort boolits till I get enough in those tollerances to load my empties and if theres another weight group just above or below that group, I'll put them into a seperate container (since they are already sorted) and use them next time.

The few that are to heavy or light get thrown back in the pot to make em right. I'm just trying to keep everything as perfect as I can get it. But, I also turn the necks, rework the primer pocket and flash hole, anneal, neck size and trim so they're exactly the same more than most people.

I actually have very few rejects when I get into a rythem. Made a batch of about 350 180gr 30cal one night and all but ten were within .3gr of each other. I threw those 10 back.

I've been making 100gr ranch dog 380's lately and weigh one occasionally. Every one has been 103.1gr and thats over 3 casting sessions and 4000 boolits.[smilie=w:

[pdawg_shooter]

I am a hunter, not a target shooter so I allow + or - 1% of average weight. Works for me anyway.

[leadman]

For the average 30 cal boolits from 170gr to just over 200grs I weigh to plus or minus .5 grains. This will allow me to keep most groups, depending on the rifle, to around moa or less.

The 44gr 22 cal boolits i go to a .1gr plus or minus and it works well.

The 380, 9 X 18, and 9 X19 only get a visual sort now as I normally don't shoot these over 25 yards, usually 10 or 15 yards. For the 357, 41, 44 I do the .5gr thing.

[Bluehawk]

Several years ago I weighed several sizes and weights of J bullets after shooting one hole groups with several cals . and decided to see what the difference was . Some of the heavier bullets from SPEER and HORNADY varied as much as 20 grains from bullet to bullet and some of the smaller ( 145 grain Speer for 7mm ) varied as much as 5 grains per bullet STILL shooting one hole groups AS noted the smaller the bullet the more the variation matters . I don't do anything but weigh a few to get NOMINAL weight for loading pressure and powder weight issues then do nothing but VISUALLY inspect most bullets hand gun or rifle

[felix]

There are TWO equally important aspects: Mass and Acceleration. The elements which make each up MUST be considered to know the aspects of the projectile leaving the gun. Therefore, for the SAME impact of the projectile, the mass and acceleration of that projectile must compensate EXACTLY. ... felix

[Northerner]

Accuracy is consistency. Sort them by weight and call it good. I do this with my 45-70 with good results.