Ohaus 45-270 hp

[GLL]

Take a look at this potential Group Buy bullet design by 45 2.1 It will be a brass 4-cavity Cramer Hollow Point version of the old OHAUS 45-270.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=150111


45 2.1 Group Buy design
http://www.fototime.com/C4401E628C8C3B3/orig.jpg

OHAUS 45-270
http://www.fototime.com/E67AE6D4AE83C64/standard.jpg

Loaded in .45 AutoRim
http://www.fototime.com/C8B59A2D7049E8C/standard.jpg

Jerry

[220swiftfn]

Interesting! But what's the meplat to crimp groove measurement? I can see that tying up MANY actions......


Dan

[Dale53]

Jerry;
How does that bullet shoot in a .45 Auto Rim? My heavy bullet load has been the NOE Lyman 454424 (250 gr Keith) at 900+ fps.

I have a Mihec mould for the RCBS 45-270-SAA (it casts at 285 gr solid and 270 H.P.) but I have reserved this for my .45 Colt Bisley SS Blackhawk.

Dale53

[Dutch4122]

220swiftfn-

This boolit design was meant for the .45 Auto Rim. It will fit all of the S&W and Colt .45 AR revolvers. The OAL of the cartridge with this boolit design loaded in Starline .45 AR brass is 1.360" The length of the cylinder on my S&W 625-6 Mountain Gun is 1.540" This boolit design will also fit Ruger Blackhawk and OM Vaquero .45 Colt cylinders when loaded in .45 Colt brass. I do not know if it will fit the Taurus Tracker cylinders; which are reported to be shorter that the S&W and Colt cylinders.

Dale-

I have shot a lot of these slugs through my S&W 625-6 Mountain Gun in the years since I ran the original group buy (270 grn solid) through Lee Precision. The gun absolutely dotes on this boolit. My load is 6 grains of Hodgdon Universal Clays. I got the load from the .45 Auto Rim article by Brian Pierce in the August, 2008 issue of Handloader. He lists a 280 grain cast load for the RCBS 45-270-SAA boolit with Universal Clays; and a load range of 5.0 grains (738 fps) to 6.0 grains (921 fps). The test gun used was a S&W Model 625-6 with a 4 inch barrel.

This boolit is 10 grains lighter than the slug used by Pierce and takes up less case room due to the short length from base to crimp groove. Again, this slug was originally designed by Ohaus as a "heavyweight" specifically for the .45 Auto Rim; and I am of the opinion that they got it right. My gun also prefers boolits of this design to be hard. No less than 22 BHN, but not brittle. My best accuracy and no leading so far has been with an alloy consisting of 50% clip on Wheelweight and 50% pure lead with and additional 2.5% added Rotometals Nickle Bearing Babbit to get a very small percentage (less than 1% total) of copper blended into the mix. Boolits are water dropped from the mold into a 5 gallon bucket. These boolits are hard, but malleable. They do not shatter when struck by a hammer; but they do rivet. The gun stacks them at 25 yards. Further testing will be done to determine velocity, which I believe should be close to 900 fps; and accuracy at 50 yards from the bench.

***Note: I do not recommend that anybody reading this post use the higher end loads with the older WWI S&W and Colt 1917 revolvers. Not because I think you might blow the gun and yourself up; but becasue these higher pressure loads will be hard on the older (almost 100 year old) guns. I would personally stick to starting loads with this boolit in the 1917's. After all, it's 270 grains (solid) and will still penetrate just fine @700 fps.:twisted:

Hope this helps,

[Dutch4122]

Interesting! But what's the meplat to crimp groove measurement? I can see that tying up MANY actions......
Dan

Forgot to mention in my earlier post: meplat to crimp measurement is .460"

Hope this helps,:mrgreen:

[Dale53]

Dutch;
Thanks for the information. That is what I was hoping to hear.

That bullet ought to be the "berries" for hunting with the .45 Auto Rim in a modern revolver. I concur completely with you about the cautions regarding the 1917 revolvers - they are known to be a bit "tender" with heavy loads. Reports of split cylinders (including Skeeter Skelton) with heavy loads have surfaced.

Dale53

[Dutch4122]

Dale-

Thanks for the additional info. I had not heard of those reports.

To anybody interested in the alloy I mentioned in post #4:

As I said, the alloy is 50% wheelweight and 50% pure lead with 2.5% Rotometals "Nickle" babbit added. One thing I forgot to mention is that the alloy is water dropped from the mold.

Hope that this did not cause any confusion!:groner:

[tonyjones]

Dutch4122,

Is the Rotometals "Nickle" babbit that you referenced the same alloy that Rotometals catalogs as RotoNickel - 15% Monel; 0% Pb, 88-90%Sn, 7-8% Sb, 3-4% Cu?

Thanks,

Tony

[Dutch4122]

Dutch4122,
Is the Rotometals "Nickle" babbit that you referenced the same alloy that Rotometals catalogs as RotoNickel - 15% Monel; 0% Pb, 88-90%Sn, 7-8% Sb, 3-4% Cu?
Thanks,
Tony


Tony-

Yes it is! :bigsmyl2:

[tonyjones]

Thanks a bunch!

Regards,

Tony

[220swiftfn]

Forgot to mention in my earlier post: meplat to crimp measurement is .460"

Hope this helps,:mrgreen:

Well, I think that puts me out, that'd be about 1.745 in .45 Colt........ [smilie=1:



Dan

[Michael J. Spangler]

that looks like one sweet boolit for the .45 AR

[Cord]

I'm in on this one and plan to primarily use it for .45AR and 45acp with the
clear understanding that it is designed for use in those cartridges.

Now, I don't want to start up a brown hail storm here, but I think it might be
OK to remark about my own personal plans in regards to the OAL issue
and using this boolit in 45 Colt cases in a S&W 45 Colt.

I have used commercially swaged SWCs in .38spl with no crimp groove,
and HBWCs backwards without a crimp groove, and in each case put
a light crimp over the forward driving band, or over the end of the HBWC.

It works very well, and in fact Glen Fryxell has a great article on
the origins of the SWC boolit and the first ones, Ideal 360271 and 358345,
had no crimp groove and were used in just that way with very good results.

Since the body of this boolit is short, if seated deeply it will still not use
as much interior case volume as some other heavy boolits, so I do not expect
any pressure issues at reasonable (low) velocity loads in 45 Colt cases
if it is seated to the front band and given a light crimp.

With proper case tension, it will not move deeper into the case,
and with a proper crimp it should not move out under recoil.

I plan to use the crimp groove as a second lube groove and try this;
I may also try crimping directly into the middle of the front band to retain the
square profile of the forward edge of that first band.

If anyone wants to call me crazy or stupid I don't mind,
but please be polite about it so you don't offend someone else.
.

[Dutch4122]

Cord-

Those are interesting plans for this design. I'd love to hear of your results.:mrgreen:

Also, attached is a picture showing the relationship of this boolit design seated in .45 Colt brass when chambered in different make .45 Colt cylinders. As everyone can see, Cord's above method would be necessary to use this design in certain .45 Colt cylinders.

[Cord]

Dutch -
My thanks to you for getting this one going!
But my plans will have to wait till the mould is in hand.

I bought one of the original Lee GB moulds from Cayoot a couple years ago
but never used it and sold it off, then came very close to buying a like new
Ohaus single cav on eBay but passed; they were not what I really wanted.

I couldn't see converting the Lee to dropping HPs,
and the single cav Ohaus, if converted, would be too slow.

Now I know I did the right thing because this one will be the boolit mould
I really wanted to have, but thought would never happen without custom work;
a beautiful brass MP Cramer with a wonderful big HP cavity, maybe even Penta pins.

I would prefer it in a 2 cav as they are easier for me to control the pour, and
it also occurs to me more might sign up for a 2 cav, but I'm so glad to have a chance
to get one set up just the way I wanted that I will buy a 4 cav and be very grateful.

Thanks again for the picture; it seems clear from the diagram that seating deep
and crimping over the front band might allow the use of this boolit
in all three of the cylinders shown.

I'm thinking this will work.
.

[220swiftfn]

Cord-

Those are interesting plans for this design. I'd love to hear of your results.:mrgreen:

Also, attached is a picture showing the relationship of this boolit design seated in .45 Colt brass when chambered in different make .45 Colt cylinders. As everyone can see, Cord's above method would be necessary to use this design in certain .45 Colt cylinders.

Thanks for the comparison!!! That's what I was thinking would be the case with the SAA and clones..... IIRC, that GB 283 is the RCBS 45-270-saa isn't it?


Dan

[45 2.1]

Thanks for the comparison!!! That's what I was thinking would be the case with the SAA and clones..... IIRC, that GB 283 is the RCBS 45-270-saa isn't it?
Dan

The GB283 is not the RCBS 45-270-saa. It is from a GB ran by Catshooter a long time ago. The drawing is mine also.

[fredj338]

I had Erik @ HPMS mod a RCBS 270SA mold. I love the bullet, very accurate in my 45colt RBH & expands well. With diff pins, I get a bullet from 250gr to 285gr in one mold.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v703/fredj338/452-251.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v703/fredj338/452-268-1K.jpg

[GLL]

For photographic reference here is an old photo of the Catshooter Group Buy molds designed by 45 2.1 compared to the Ohaus 45-270. The three bullets match those in his drawing.

http://www.fototime.com/40C2F8BE086CD8E/standard.jpg

45 2.1 drawing of original Catshooter Group Buy molds + the Dutch4122 Ohaus 45 GB also by 45 2.1
http://www.fototime.com/272C7D1633A7D33/orig.jpg

Add the 454423 Group Buy mold to the above mix and you have some of the best Keith style bullets available !

45 2.1 454423 design
http://www.fototime.com/52F74072195ED6D/standard.jpg

Jerry

[Michael J. Spangler]

What weight would it be in HP form?

[MikeS]

One thing to mention, while this boolit is primarily designed for the 45AR, anyone that wants to shoot it from a 45LC revolver could easily load it into Schofield brass, it should clear the cylinders that way.