Trapdoor question

[Boz330]

I picked up a 73 Trapdoor made in 75' a couple weeks back and my old eyes can't even begin to see the sights. The front sight has a hood and I need to get that hood off before I can install a thicker sight that is easier to see. It appears to just be held by friction but it doesn't want move even tapping it with a wooden block. I don't want to force it if it might be soldered. Anybody have any insight in this situation. To be honest if I can't shoot it reasonably accurately, it is useless to me. I might want to put some food on the table with it.:bigsmyl2:

Bob

[Don McDowell]

There should be a single screw that goes near the bottom of the hood. It actually clamps the hood to the sight base.

[hydraulic]

If that is a honest to goodness 1873 Springfield made in 1875, I wouldn't even think of shooting it, let alone to start hammering on it. You had better check the gun auctions and learn what that rifle (carbine?) is worth.

[Boz330]

If that is a honest to goodness 1873 Springfield made in 1875, I wouldn't even think of shooting it, let alone to start hammering on it. You had better check the gun auctions and learn what that rifle (carbine?) is worth.

I learned a long time ago not to force things. It is a rifle not the carbine. 44XXX SN IIRC which puts it in the range for 75' made. I haven't priced it other than what I paid which I thought was a fair price.

Don, I'll look but I don't remember seeing a screw.

Bob

[varsity07840]

I learned a long time ago not to force things. It is a rifle not the carbine. 44XXX SN IIRC which puts it in the range for 75' made. I haven't priced it other than what I paid which I thought was a fair price.

Don, I'll look but I don't remember seeing a screw.

Bob

The ones with the set screw slide over the muzzle and the set screw holds tight to the front sight base. There's also a snap on which is a spring fit to the sight base.

Duane

[bob208]

ndoes it still have the high arch breachblock? if so use b-p only or change it out.

[Boz330]

ndoes it still have the high arch breachblock? if so use b-p only or change it out.

Is there anything else?????????????????:drinks:

Bob

[Ed in North Texas]

Is there anything else?????????????????:drinks:

Bob

Yeah - enjoy it!

:drinks:

Ed

[Boz330]

If that is a honest to goodness 1873 Springfield made in 1875, I wouldn't even think of shooting it, let alone to start hammering on it. You had better check the gun auctions and learn what that rifle (carbine?) is worth.

Here are some pics of the rifle. I'm a pretty green TD aficionado. This was in a local gun shop at what I considered a reasonable price ($799). The bore looks good 3 groove. Bluing is probably 75%. Stock has a number of dings but nothing too hateful for a 137 year old rifle. I bought it as a shooter and can't imagine that it is worth any more than I paid for it, the gun shop owner is pretty savvy. Having said that he does have exceptionally good prices compared to other shops.
I'm not sure how to tell the high arched breach block. In the research I haven't seen a comparison that I could find.

Bob

[varsity07840]

Here are some pics of the rifle. I'm a pretty green TD aficionado. This was in a local gun shop at what I considered a reasonable price ($799). The bore looks good 3 groove. Bluing is probably 75%. Stock has a number of dings but nothing too hateful for a 137 year old rifle. I bought it as a shooter and can't imagine that it is worth any more than I paid for it, the gun shop owner is pretty savvy. Having said that he does have exceptionally good prices compared to other shops.
I'm not sure how to tell the high arched breach block. In the research I haven't seen a comparison that I could find.

Bob

Given what your discription of the rifle, you did ok, but you didn't steal it. All TDs with the exception of a few "long range rifles" are 3 groove. Don't be surprised if the bore needs a real good cleaning, which could be a long process. If your rifle is an Model 1873, it should have a high arch breech block, which means the the interior upper part of the block has a profound radius. Later low arch blocks have flat interiors.
An 1873 should have the early high arch block since they are not interchangeable with the low arch ofr later models without grinding and hand fitting. They were not substituted by the armory, so if your rifle does have a low arch block it was done after the rifle left service. If it's got a low arch, I'd have it checked out by a gunsmith who's familiar with TD's.

Duane

[StrawHat]

My two favorite Springfield Single Shot Rifle sites.

http://www.trapdoorcollector.com/

and

http://www.trapdoors.com/

The first for finding information and the second for prices and parts.

I also have an 1873. With blackpowder and a 405 grain boolit, it is a good shooter. Enjoy yours, learn about it and enjoy it.

[Boz330]

Given what your discription of the rifle, you did ok, but you didn't steal it. All TDs with the exception of a few "long range rifles" are 3 groove. Don't be surprised if the bore needs a real good cleaning, which could be a long process. If your rifle is an Model 1873, it should have a high arch breech block, which means the the interior upper part of the block has a profound radius. Later low arch blocks have flat interiors.
An 1873 should have the early high arch block since they are not interchangeable with the low arch ofr later models without grinding and hand fitting. They were not substituted by the armory, so if your rifle does have a low arch block it was done after the rifle left service. If it's got a low arch, I'd have it checked out by a gunsmith who's familiar with TD's.

Duane

I bought it at a gun shop so I was pretty sure I didn't get a steal, but I didn't think it was a bad price. I have been keeping an eye out for one and this one came up and I had the cash.
In the store the sight didn't look too bad but on the range that puppy is tough to see. A friend has one with the Buffington sight which I might try before springing for one.
I'll check the breach block when I get home tonight, but this gun appears to be original. I already cleaned up the bore and it wasn't bad at all to do. I've got an LBT mold that was designed for a trapdoor and hunting. Even though it is undersize for my Martini it actually shoots quite well out of it.

Bob

[ambergrifleman]

Boz330 have you Fired your Trapdoor yet ? I Love my Trapdoors.

[Boz330]

Boz330 have you Fired your Trapdoor yet ? I Love my Trapdoors.

Yes but I had so much trouble with that tiny front blade and nonexistent rear notch that I gave up after several rounds. I'm thinking a thicker front blade and a Buffington rear might be the answer. I would like to try one first before I spring for the Buffington though.

Bob

[John in PA]

Use a Merit sight disc with adjustable aperture if you wear glasses. Suction cup attaches it to your eyeglass lens.
http://www.meritcorporation.com/products.html
Camera-type iris adjusts to sharpen picture for your eyes. Sharpens up both front and rear sights. Also, the sight hood ion the front sight is the spring-steel one. Just snaps off the barrel and sight by pulling upward firmly. There is another type that is milled from solid steel. That one has a screw to release.

[Tom Trevor]

Boz, From the shape of the block recess in the reciever[ rounded] not square your rifle was made well after 1875. Pull back the hammer and you WILL find another number there. 44XXXX is what you have also the sight is the M-1879 plus the grooved swept back trigger is not used until March of 1883.A 440000 serial would be in 1888. The wider stronger action than the early narrow reciever.

[Boz330]

Boz, From the shape of the block recess in the reciever[ rounded] not square your rifle was made well after 1875. Pull back the hammer and you WILL find another number there. 44XXXX is what you have also the sight is the M-1879 plus the grooved swept back trigger is not used until March of 1883.A 440000 serial would be in 1888. The wider stronger action than the early narrow reciever.

Tom, I will check for the number under the hammer but the number on the breach block is 5 digit not 6. It has the arched breach block as well. I guess that it could be a parts gun, but the things that I have found to check all indicated that it is in the 75 range. Again I am not that versed in the TDs and appreciate the help.

Bob

[13Echo]

Trapdoor Springfield serial numbers are located on the rear top flat of the receiver adjacent the hammer. The breechblock was never serial numbered. The trigger is definately later production and the sight does appear to be a 79 and the sight cover is the spring type, also later production and the cleaning rod is late production. All of these could have been upgraded during an arsenal or local rebuild but would not be original with an 1875 made rifle. It still looks like a nice rifle that should be perfect as a shooter.

Jerry Liles

[Boz330]

Trapdoor Springfield serial numbers are located on the rear top flat of the receiver adjacent the hammer. The breechblock was never serial numbered. The trigger is definately later production and the sight does appear to be a 79 and the sight cover is the spring type, also later production and the cleaning rod is late production. All of these could have been upgraded during an arsenal or local rebuild but would not be original with an 1875 made rifle. It still looks like a nice rifle that should be perfect as a shooter.

Jerry Liles

Well I sort of feel like a ******* here but I screwed up the number on this thing. It is a 6 digit number with the last digit hidden under the breach block release. I never looked at it with the block open. The date on the breach block is 1873, didn't have a magnifying glass to see if maybe it was miss struck.
Thanks guys for the info. As I said I bought it for a shooter but now my curiosity is getting aroused. Is there a particular book that would be of help without having to buy a library? Thanks!

Bob

[georgewxxx]

If you bought it as a shooter, the first thing you do is check and see of you've got strong rifling up to the muzzle tip. A big share of the ones sold cheap there's a reason. After too many sessions of using the steel cleaning rod, the soft steel those barrels were made from, gets worn down to the point were acceptable accuracy is impossible without using a hollow based boolit. Before you buy any book, check out this whole website and you gain a lot of insite as to when, and how your Springfield was made. http://www.trapdoorcollector.com/production.html

[13Echo]

An 1873 marked block is found on many much later production rifles as this was a model number, not necessarily a production date. Both low and high arch blocks are marked 1873 and blocks so marked were made and used up to 1886. The trigger your rifle has appeared about1883 and the cleaning rod was issued starting in 1882.

Does your stock still have its cartouches and date stamp?
Jerry Liles

[StrawHat]

If you don't have this book,

http://www.4570book.info/

It is another one I would recommend. Some of the information is outdated but you will learn a lot about making the Springfield Single Shot Rifle perform.

[Boz330]

An 1873 marked block is found on many much later production rifles as this was a model number, not necessarily a production date. Both low and high arch blocks are marked 1873 and blocks so marked were made and used up to 1886. The trigger your rifle has appeared about1883 and the cleaning rod was issued starting in 1882.

Does your stock still have its cartouches and date stamp?
Jerry Liles

Jerry, after checking the 6 digit SN against the info in a Dixie catalog it would appear that the rifle was manufactured in 1889. I can't find any cartouches on the stock. It doesn't appear to have been sanded but there are a number scratches and dings that could be making them hard to see. I need to get my magnifying hood and look at it closely.

Bob

[13Echo]

It would appear you likely have a correct set of parts then. It is possible the stock is a field replacement. Does it have a large P stamped behind the trigger on the stock wrist? The acceptance cartouche should be on the left side of the stock opposite the lock. If the wood stands just a bit above the lock plate the stock may not have been sanded and refinished.

My 1868 has a replacement stock that lacks the cartouces but is otherwise correct. This may be the case with your rifle too.

Jerry Liles

[Boz330]

It would appear you likely have a correct set of parts then. It is possible the stock is a field replacement. Does it have a large P stamped behind the trigger on the stock wrist? The acceptance cartouche should be on the left side of the stock opposite the lock. If the wood stands just a bit above the lock plate the stock may not have been sanded and refinished.

My 1868 has a replacement stock that lacks the cartouces but is otherwise correct. This may be the case with your rifle too.

Jerry Liles

Thanks Jerry, if I get out of here at a reasonable hour today I'll try and remember to check those things. Might be a good idea to take the magnifying visor home as well. I'm due an eye exam and some new lenses and I'm having more trouble reading lately so I guess I might as well bite the bullet and get it done. Man getting old sucks.

Bob

[StrawHat]

... Man getting old sucks... Bob

Inside every old man is a young guy saying, "What the %^&* happened??"

[Boz330]

Inside every old man is a young guy saying, "What the %^&* happened??"

I hear you. When I turned 50 I was running 4 miles a day. I went out to NM to guide hunters in the fall walking up and down the mountains from 7000ft up to near 10,000ft. Then my back started giving me problems and one knee and then the other needed arthroscopic surgery and now they are just about due replacement. Trying to hold off as long as possible on that. Hell if I'd of known I was going to live this long I'd have taken better care of myself.................. Naw probably not.


Jerry, I looked real close and couldn't find any cartouches. Lock plate is even with the stock. If it was sanded down it was a long time ago. The dents and dings look like what you would expect of a military rifle of this age.

Bob

[StrawHat]

(WARNING....THREAD DRIFT.......)


...one knee and then the other needed arthroscopic surgery and now they are just about due replacement. Trying to hold off as long as possible on that. ... Bob

Don't hold off so long that you do futher damage to the surronding bones. I nearly did that with a shoulder. After replacement, NO PAIN!!!! I should have done it years earlier.

When you get it done, do everything they tell you to at therapy and more. It is worth having done.

We now return you to the regular portion of the Trapdoor discussion.

[13Echo]

With everything taken together I think you have a complete and correct Trapdoor Springfield with a carefully refinished stock or, possibly, a field replacement stock. It looks like a very nice rifle and should make a fine shooter.

Jerry Liles

[Boz330]

It is getting into my slack time of year and the temperatures are moderating so hopefully I'll get some time out with all of my projects.

Bob