Cast bullets for the 30-40 Krag?

[Rick the Librarian]

I'm a new rifle reloader and I have to say, "upfront" I'm not interested in doing my own casting for a multitude of reasons.

Any suggested manufacturers for .220 gr. cast "round nosed" bullets for the Krag?

How about other cast bullets, like 180, 165 and 150?

I admit I'm not looking for high grade stuff, just plinking type loads.

TIA!

[rintinglen]

I have not seen a commercial caster offer a 220 grain round nose ever, however, there are several sources for 165 grain .309 "Cowboy" boolits, which can easily be made to work in the 30-40. Although you didn't mention them, 100 grain .311 boolits are also available which may work very well for short range plinker or squirrel rounds. Graf and Sons carries the Missouri Bullet Company line of products and IIRC, list both of the above recommendations. Midsouth also carries a cast boolit line, as does Midway.
My own gun, A 1924 Winchester 1895, has shot a blistering total of 18 jacketed bullets since I bought it. It shoots the 311-291 better than anything, and will happily plunk boolit after boolit into nice round 3 inch groups. I can't do any better with iron sights than that.

[Hardcast416taylor]

Knowing your bore dia. is almost The first thing you should find out when going to use cast bullets. Once that is known you are better equipped with knowledge to select the correct dia. cast bullet to use. I`m kinda certain that you could obtain cast bullets, for trials, from other members on this board if you would make a request. By the way, WELCOME aboard.Robert

[ku4hx]

...I have to say, "upfront" I'm not interested in doing my own casting for a multitude of reasons.

I said pretty much the same thing sometime around 1970. Funny how that never really worked out.

[Throwback]

If you have an 1898 Krag, as most of us do, then you can be pretty sure the groove diameter will be pretty damn close to .308. Bore diameter will be pretty close to .300. It was the earlier Krags that were all over the place. Pope came in and ensured excellent consistency of bore sizes. I have had good results with bullets sized .309, but I usually use .310 unless I am not getting the results I am looking for.

[Char-Gar]

Welcome Rick... A guy with a Krag rifle is a friend of mine! I have an addiction for them! Here is a little Krag cast bullet primer.

1. Don't settle for just plinking stuff. It is easy to get a Krag to perform as well or better with cast than jacketed ammo.

2. As Hardcast said above, knowing the bore diameter (groove) is step one. Krag rifles had bore specs all over the map from .308 to as much as .316, with .3095 being the most common. This is the starting point. If slugging the bore is something new to you, do a search and you will find all kinds of help and instructions.

3. Lyman 311284 is a popular cast bullet in the 210-220 grain range for use in the Krag. There are others.

4. Other lighter cast bullets also work well in the 30-40 round.

5. Krag rifles have a very long and often very large barrel throat. Quite often bullet of size .313 or even .314 work very well, even is they are quite oversize for the bore. So, it good to consider a mold that will throw bullets that diameter. That may mean getting a bullet designed for the 303 British round.

6. Good old air cooled wheel weight is a good alloy.

7. Use a good lube and stay away from Lee tumble lube. Others will diagree, but that is my counsel.

8. Start with 16 grains of 2400 powder. That is a light load giving about 1,600 fps and if you have done everything else right, should deliver all the accuracy you can use.

9. As always clean all of the old metal fouling out of the barrel. Those Krag barrels are usually packed with this stuff. The foaming cleaner Wipe-Out will make this job easier for you. Don't skip this step.

10. I am not sanguine about being able to buy commercial cast bullets that will do well in the Krag rifle. If you don't want to take up casting, there are custom casters like Matt at mattsbullets.com, who will take your mold and cast with it if you don't want to. If you are dead set against casting your own, this may be the best way for you to go.

Start here and one you have the basic down and have the bug, we can move up to Krag Stage 2

[Char-Gar]

If you have an 1898 Krag, as most of us do, then you can be pretty sure the groove diameter will be pretty damn close to .308. Bore diameter will be pretty close to .300. It was the earlier Krags that were all over the place. Pope came in and ensured excellent consistency of bore sizes. I have had good results with bullets sized .309, but I usually use .310 unless I am not getting the results I am looking for.

Harry Pope was brought in to help develop a Palma Match rifle and had a conipcion fit over the barrel specs. Barrels did get better, but they did not get down to a regular .308 until just a year or two before production ended. I have a 1901 production Krag with a barrel of .310, another 1901 production Krag with a barrel of .308 and a 1895 production Krag with a barrel of .312.

Being the later 1898 Model does not guarantee you will get a barrel of .308.

[leadman]

Is this the same Rick the Librarian from the CMP forum? Welcome.
As stated the bore diameter is very important. If you slug the bore it helps, or you can get a variety of bore sizes and shoot them and see what happens.
It is an unusual WWII US rifle that won't shoot at least a .310" cast bullet (boolit). It is best to get a boolit that will fill the throat to prevent the gas blow-by that can cause leading.

If you PM me we can work something out to get you started loading.

[HORNET]

Rick, if you hunt around on here a bit we do have a few members that cast commercially and would probably be quite willing to assist you with cast, sized and lubed boolits in an alloy appropriate to your needs. Carolina Cast Bullets (also his forum username) and mattsbullets (forum member happy7) are a couple that come to mind right off and you can find others with a little effort. Try sending them a PM. The 311284 was designed for the .30-40 but a good deal will depend on your barrel's condition and dimensions. You might also take a look in the Cast for Military Rifles forum down the main index page a ways. Welcome to the fun.
Rick

(:wink:Now the hook is baited...)

[Rick the Librarian]

Thanks for the many useful comments, gentlemen! I plan to examine them in detail.

Just for the record, I have been reloading pistol for a little over a year and I just started on rifle - reloaded my first Krag cartridges - 180 SMK with 30 gr. of H335. I got lucky on the Match Kings, but don't want to use them for an ordinary trip to the range.

(I use cast bullets - usually Oregon Trail LC - for .45 ACP and .38 Special)

I'll warn you I am already looking at possible cast bullet suggestions to use for 7.5MM Swiss and .303!

(Some of you may know me from Jouster, GunBoards, CMP and other forums. My "specialty" is the M1903, but I have enough 30-06 to last for me for some time!)

[Kraschenbirn]

Rick...

My Krag 'NRA Sporter' really likes the Lee 309-200-1R, cast 'hard' and loaded over 37 gr of WW760. Off a 'field rest', will consistently hold sub-2" (iron sight) groups @ 100M...so long as I do my part.

So far as something for your Swiss rifle, the same boolit, loaded over 30 gr. of H4895, shoots equally well in both my G96/11 and my K31.

Bill

[Rick the Librarian]

I plan to slug my Krags (I have at least three rifles and a carbine I plan to use) and I'll keep your idea about "filling" up the bore.

What makes the best "slugging" materials? Obviously soft lead. I've had double OO buckshot and #3 lead fishing weights suggested, as well as a .311" bullet. Keep in mind I'm a "babe in the woods" at this, as yet!:mrgreen:

[Char-Gar]

I use some old soft waged 38 caliber handbullet bullets that I use. Some folks use fishing sinkers. Just make sure it is soft.

I use a rawhide mallet and drive the slug in flush with the muzzle. I then seat the bullet a couple of inches into the barrel with a brass rod. I then push on through with a cleaning rod. Do not use a wooden dowel pin!!!!

[Rick the Librarian]

A "wooden dowel" pin -- you mean to do the "pushing through" or for another purpose?

[Shiloh]

The Lyman 314299 works great for me. A .312 sizer just kisses the mold lines.
Mine drops at .312 with 50/50 WW/Range lead.

Most will be in the black on a military SR-1 100 target, with a cluster in the 9 and 10 ring.

A piece of .250 delrin rod cut in 4-5" sections will drive the bullet down the barrel by stacking the sections. They all fall through when the slug drops out.

Shiloh

[Rick the Librarian]

As I said, I have no plans to cast bullets - my need is to find a good source of bullets already cast.

[bradh]

Rick if you don't want to cast, look at www.westernbullet.com

[leadman]

For slugging the bore the fishing sinkers work, or a pistol boolit cast from pure lead. I use a brass rod from Ace Hardware and wrap tape around it to keep it centered, especially close to the slug.
Make sure the bore is clean and well oiled. Oil the slug also.
It is good to also drive a slug in from the chamber end and then back out to measure the throat. If the throat is say .313" and the bore is .310", you still want to use a .313" boolit as long as there is enough neck clearance in the chamber to release the boolit.
There are ways to get the rifles to shoot if you do not want to slug them all.

[shooting on a shoestring]

+1 for .314" diameter boolits. I use the Lee mould for the 303 Brit. In my Krag at least, they fill the throat, and have given me better results than I care to post lest I be considered an unbelievable braggart.

[Char-Gar]

Some folks get the bright idea to use a wooden dowel rod/pin instead of a rod to push the bullet through. Quite often they get stuck in the barrel and when they are stuck they are mega stuck. Don't do it.