What Have I Done Now?

[Mark85304]

In what may eventually prove out to be a momentary laps of good judgement, I acquired a new to me 14" contender barrel in 444 Marlin. I've already been in contact with SSK Industries with questions since they are recognized experts on hand cannons. There is no doubt in my mind that I will be downloading this cartridge as I do not wish to punish my hand and wrist any more that I already have with my big bore barrels.

This is going to be an interesting journey and one I'm sure from which I will learn many lessons.

Things to do: Just for starters

Find and read everything I can regarding the 444 Marlin in a pistol.

Research and select acceptable boolit(s).

Come up with reduced loads for this insanity.

Never ever fire factory ammunition!

Research muzzle brakes - LOL

[montana_charlie]

I do not wish to punish my hand and wrist any more that I already have with my big bore barrels.
Sounds like you are just continuing to do something that you already know you should stop doing.

I can't imagine what you want from us ...

CM

[Tatume]

Sounds like you are just continuing to do something that you already know you should stop doing.

I can't imagine what you want from us ...

CM

Conversation.

[Nobade]

I'd treat it like a skinny 45-70 for pressures. Same powders, roughly the same velocities, etc. The twist rate and throating will tell you what shape and what weight boolits to use. Since full power 44 mag ammo is fairly unpleasant to fire in a 14" Contender, you likely won't be wanting to go much faster than it does anyway. Keep things reasonable and you'll be safe, pretty much it'll be a slightly more powerful 44 mag that uses a whole lot more gun powder.

Were it mine, I think it would be fun shooting soft Keith boolits, lubed with BP lube, over a case full of FFg. Plenty power, and lots of noise and smoke for the enjoyment of the bystanders. (I used to do that with my 375 win. TC barrel at silhouette matches. It was quite the crowd pleaser and used to win occasionally too.)

[Jared]

The Speer 270 gr Gold Dot is great in the .444. I push it to 2200-2300 in a rifle and it hammers deer. Not the greatest penetrator load, but it works great.

[Nobade]

Jared,
The rifle type loads for the 444 are a quite different thing when used in a Contender. It is pretty well established that factory 444 ammo is too much for a Contender. The frame will stretch from the backthrust, if the barrel doesn't blow open first. There are some nasty looking pictures of blown up Contenders out there that have/had been rechambered to 444.

As long as it's used intelligently and loaded light it'll be fine but trying to get factory ballistics out of it is inviting disaster.

[Fishman]

Like Montana Charlie, I am bitter that you have acquired such a fun toy:)

In all seriousness, I have never loaded for the .444, but if I did, I think I would start with the 310 gr Lee I shoot in heavy .44 mag loads. It's gas checked and should stand up to reduced .444 loads.

[EDG]

Like it says above your twist rate should determine a lot.
I would tend to load it like loading cast bullets with smokeless in a BPCR rifle.
Keep velocity between 900 and 1200 FPS. You will probably be happy with 900 to 1000 fps like a 44 Special but using a heavier bullet. The problem is the size of the case invites double charges with a lot of powders.
BE very very careful with fast burning powders if you go that route. One of the most spectacular blow-ups seen when the net first got fast enough for photos was a .44 Mag barrel rechambered to .444 that was blown wide open in sort of a reverse banana peel starting at the chamber and going forward. Now a normal muszzle first banana peel runing only the barrel. This one ruined the Contender frame and destroyed a nice scope and mount too.
The slower powders like SR4759 and 5744 should work well but may produce a lot of recoil at the load levels recommended.
If you have gotten into this for cheap thrills you will not get much use out of the barrel.
If it is loaded for comfort it will be fun to shoot but velocities will be low.
Muzzle brakes do nothing for the fun level. The make any normally loud round almost unbearable to shoot. Even weating both plugs and muffs the report with be very sharp. All of that just to reduce recoil. I would prefer light loads or getting rid of the thing.

[Skipper]

Get one of these:

http://www.braceshop.com/productcart/pc/catalog/images_breg/small/wristpro10s.jpg

One of these:

http://www.braceshop.com/productcart/pc/catalog/images_donjoy/small/elbowsupports.jpg

and some of these:


http://www.advil.com/sites/www.advil.com/files/images/products/B_03_Advil_Pain_Tab_Boxes.jpg

[Skipper]

Here's a good site for low velocity loads. Scroll down on the left:


http://www.gmdr.com/lever/lowveldata.htm

[Mark85304]

@Nobade, I had not thought about loading BP. That's an interesting concept.

I appreciate all the feedback

Does anyone have an opinion about TrailBoss powder in the 444 Marlin?

[omgb]

I'd be willing to bet that you can work up some fun cast loads using either 777 or 5744. Both are good at low pressure loads in big cases.

[Skipper]

Does anyone have an opinion about TrailBoss powder in the 444 Marlin

I've used it in the 45-70 and it's great!

Also, I was serious about the elbow thing; I shot a friend's 45-70 pistol while my elbow was touching the shooting bench..........goodbye skin!

[x101airborne]

Man, I would follow up the advil with a good dose of a high quality scotch. OOF!

I would just like to see the look on peoples faces when you drop a 444 cartrige in that pistol.

I bet the guy from the pictures of that blown up weapon had a serious pucker thing going on.

[Nazgul]

I have had 2 muzzle brakes installed on Encore barrels at SSK. Outstanding people to work with. Last one took awhile, so I called them. They said the bluing wasn't right so it went back out for a redo. Sent me a t shirt as comp.

Don

[Mark85304]

I've used it in the 45-70 and it's great!

Also, I was serious about the elbow thing; I shot a friend's 45-70 pistol while my elbow was touching the shooting bench..........goodbye skin!

Since my days shooting Pistol Silhouette in the 80s, I use an elbow pad. Standard equipment since then.

[dale2242]

I am shooting a G1 Contender 14" 44 Mag barrel rechambered to 444.
With full power loads this handgun is not for the faint of heart.
I am not recoil shy but, Tenders aren`t the most fun to shoot with heavy recoiling calibers.
My hunting load is a Seaco #232 265 gr RNGC boolit in front of 42gr of IMR4198.
With slower powders in the 14" barrel, the 444 will create some spectacular muzzle blast and flash.
I`m working on some lighter Unique loads with 240-245gr SWC boolits but haven`t gotten the accuracy I`m looking for yet
.....dale

[Mark85304]

I am shooting a G1 Contender 14" 44 Mag barrel rechambered to 444.
With full power loads this handgun is not for the faint of heart.
I am not recoil shy but, Tenders aren`t the most fun to shoot with heavy recoiling calibers.


So how long have you been shooting full power loads in the Tender? I sent SSK an email asking about factory ammo and damage to the G1 frames. Their responses was that as long as the barrel lug has a "step" in it, not to worry about it. Their opinion is that the Tenders are quite capable of the 444 Marlin and cartridges based off of it (lots of the SSK chamgerings are based off the 444 Marlin so they should know of what they advise).

[dale2242]

I have never shot a factory load in my G1 Contender in 444.
I have shot 300-400 heavy loads in the barrel. The guy I got it from shot a lot of 320 gr boolits in it with heavy loads of 4895.
Not many loads that I would consider MAX have been shot in this barrel by me. Just not that much fun with Max or near Max loads.
I have sent 2 worn G1 frame back to TC and they rebuilt one and replaced one. No charge.
I used them for IHMSA silhouette, so they had thousands of rounds each fired through them......dale

[Mark85304]

I used them for IHMSA silhouette, so they had thousands of rounds each fired through them

KEWL! That's what I thought I'd use it for. Don't expect to win like with my .30 Herrett in NRA matches, but a kick on the line none the less.

[dale2242]

Try shooting a GC 170-180 gr boolit in the 30 Herrett for silhouette with full power loads. If you can find an accurate load you should be very competitive.
I have been shooting a 14" scoped 30-30 barrel with 2 different cast loads.
Both are with the Lyman 311291 boolit.
The lighter load is 10 gr Unique and the heavy is with 32 gr BL-C2.
Both are very accurate. The heavier load would make an excellent silhouette load with plenty of power for rams.
The old standard 30 cal cast load of 10 gr Unique is accurate enought to hit empty 12 ga shotshells at 100 yds 75% of the time.....dale

[Mark85304]

I routinely used 150 grn bullets for rams with my .30 Herrett and never left one standing. I love the .30 Herrett! BL-C(2) is my favorite powder. It develops plenty of power and, at least with my 7mm TCU, generates an impressive fireball when fired. :lol:

I'm still researching loads for the 444 Marlin in the Contender. I got a new boolit mould yesterday than may be fun to shoot, PB 265 grn HP, or PB 275 grn FP. Trail Boss still interests me as I think I can get a lower velocity/pressure load that will be fun to shoot. This one will be a fun one to work up loads for.

[Olevern]

I have had a 45-70 barrel for the contender for over twenty years. Using 300 grain cast or jacketed bullets and level one loads (trapdoor level) it is not harsh to shoot and I enjoy mounting it on one of my frames and playing with it on occasion.

When you pull it out at the range it sure impresses the guys at the tables next to you. I always take extra ammo when I take it to the range 'cause after they see me shoot it someone always wants to try it.

A friend borrowed the barrel for his frame once to take to maine as a primary gun for black bear, but he didn't get a shot offered close enough that he felt comfortable taking.

Load your 444 reasonably, shoot it often and enjoy. That's the beauty of reloading, any caliber can be loaded for any level according to your needs.

[leadman]

I had a 444 Marlin barrel. I shot full power loads most of the time with IMR4198 and the Hornady 265gr bullet. It was very accurate and obtained about 2,100 fps in a 14" barrel.
I did have a good load with Unique and a 225gr RCBS SWC GC. If I can find the exact amount I will post it.

Do make sure the path of the barrel is off to the side of your head when it recoils. Even with a 2 1/2" muzzle brake on the end of the 14" barrel it would stop about even with the back of my ear. The Brake was made by Gary Reeder with the normal small holes around it.
One of the "Shark Gill" style brakes would be much more effective. I replaced 2 other Gary Reeder brakes with shark gill brakes made by Ross Schuler and the are much better at controlling recoil but are not as pretty. Ross is on Speciality Pistols website.

I shot the Lee 310gr RFN GC boolit with 4198 to over 1,800 fps which was about the limit for the boolit. It was accurate for 3 to 5 shots then the barrel had to be brushed.

Wear shooting gloves and albow pads. Have fun!

[uscra112]

I am shooting a G1 Contender 14" 44 Mag barrel rechambered to 444.
With full power loads this handgun is not for the faint of heart.
I am not recoil shy but, Tenders aren`t the most fun to shoot with heavy recoiling calibers.
My hunting load is a Seaco #232 265 gr RNGC boolit in front of 42gr of IMR4198.
With slower powders in the 14" barrel, the 444 will create some spectacular muzzle blast and flash.
I`m working on some lighter Unique loads with 240-245gr SWC boolits but haven`t gotten the accuracy I`m looking for yet
.....dale

Gee, and I thought the .357 Max was overstressing my Gen 1. Much nicer with the .22 K-Hornet barrel on it, although I do put the Max barrel back on come deer season.