Poor man's canalure tool

[Rangefinder]

It was a 50/50 whether to put this here or in "Special Projects"... Figured it would get more views here.

This is the result of my other recent project in Swaging 5.7 brass into .30 cal bullets. The radio version is that through a bolt gun they're great, but through the AK I'm concerned about set-back on chambering, thus I have a sudden need to be able to put a canalure on a FL GC bullet. The thread detailing thatparticular project is here...

http://www.castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=156716

On to the brainstorming...

So I was thinking tonight at work, putting together all manner of complex mechanical things that would over-complicate any and all projects... And then it hit me---K-I-S-S... Keep It Simple Stupid. I use a pipe cutter to initially cut the shoulder off the 5.7 brass before I trim and seat whatever core I'm using. The first twist with the pipe/tubing cutter pushes a groove all the way around the soon-to-be jacket before I tighten it again and continue cutting. Problem solved! Intentionally dull the cutter wheel of a tubing cutter so it will "dent" but not cut, even notch it if you will, thread a stop-nut onto the tightening handle so it only squeezes so far, and... BINGO!! A poor man's canalure tool!

No photos to share yet because I haven't made it out to the shop yet since getting off work... BUT, they're coming as soon as possible.

Just sharing the thought!

Jim

[Chicken Thief]

My initial thought was something along the toothed wheel on a canopener.

[Hardcast416taylor]

Neat idea for using the tubing cutter. However, I can hear the rumble of hundreds of deceased plumbers turning over in their graves!:bigsmyl2:Robert

[EMC45]

I saw one years back that was made with a wheel from a disposable butane lighter. It was cut so one of the taller edges was left and then it was rigged up on a hand cranked spinner. The spinner in turn knurled bullets that were in a corresponding cradle next to the wheel.

[Reg]

I must have had "that" look in my eye as I just looked at the wife's hand crank can opener. Was promptly ran out of the kitchen with my head and tail both held low.
I don't think a hand cranker will work-- too course. Need to check out a electric model.
Think you are on to something.

[smilie=1:

[Rangefinder]

Reg---I know the look you're talking about. So does my wife :D I also know the few phrases that look generates--those all mean "bad idea". Simply rolling eyes and shaking her head tend to mean "whatever, but I don't want to know any details or trips to the ER..." Some of those turn out pretty well. :P

[Hamish]

In the last few day's I read a thread where some smart guy took a mec super sizer and used inserts to smash the rims on .22 brass.

Does this make the little light bulb appear above anyone's head?

[Rangefinder]

With a little tinkering I have a canalure tool now. ;)

I took the rotary blade out, spun it with a belt sander till it had a nice flat edge. Then took the tubing cutter to the drill press. A quick hole, tap, screw, and a couple nylon bushings with lock washers sanded to make the depth I wanted, and BINGO. Works like a charm.

http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l259/hillsjim/DSCF1387.jpg

How does it look after finished? Like this:
http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l259/hillsjim/DSCF1386.jpg

[Catshooter]

That is one funny lookin' bullet.

But a dang smart way to cannelure. Good thinking.


Cat

[Longwood]

With a little tinkering I have a canalure tool now. ;)

I took the rotary blade out, spun it with a belt sander till it had a nice flat edge. Then took the tubing cutter to the drill press. A quick hole, tap, screw, and a couple nylon bushings with lock washers sanded to make the depth I wanted, and BINGO. Works like a charm.
How does it look after finished? Like this:


Looks nice.
How do you turn the bullet?
Would a Lee collet crimper do that?

[Rangefinder]

Looks nice.
How do you turn the bullet?
Would a Lee collet crimper do that?

Not sure a collet crimper would do it--might, just haven't got one handy to tinker with at the moment.

For turning the bullet I took a cheap pair of pliars, epoxied a leather tab on both sides of the jaw, and grip the base. It doesn't take much squeeze, so no deforming possible, and the leather keeps from marring anything up.

[mold maker]

You guys always find the cheap solution after I spend the big bucks.
I'll still copy the little tubing cutter design, and keep it handy. The Corbin tool takes up lots of bench top, and is usually stored, in it's own 50 cal can.

[Sasquatch-1]

How about using the Lee lock stud and shell holder from their case trimming set to hold and spin the bullet. You could even chuck it up in an electric screwdriver or drill to spin it.

[Rangefinder]

One thing I noticed with this little tool though is that it's going to be a PITA to do short bullets because they won't stick out far enough to grip. The solution I came up with makes it easier all the way around. I need to make a blade for it with a key-way instead of just a round hole for free-spinning. Then put a knob handle on it. That way the blade is pressing the canalure AND handling the turning all in one--if that NASA-style description makes sense to anyone besides myself. :D

[Longwood]

One thing I noticed with this little tool though is that it's going to be a PITA to do short bullets because they won't stick out far enough to grip. The solution I came up with makes it easier all the way around. I need to make a blade for it with a key-way instead of just a round hole for free-spinning. Then put a knob handle on it. That way the blade is pressing the canalure AND handling the turning all in one--if that NASA-style description makes sense to anyone besides myself. :D

Your idea is great.
Now that you know how to do it, instead of working with something that will work but is not only pretty ugly but does not work very well.
Why not think about ways to do it then start from scratch and make one that works much better and/or easier.
Modifying something to try to make it work, is sometimes way more trouble than starting from scratch.
The ugly part was not a dig, it is how a lot of my first attempts look.
OK,,, some of the "That will work" ones are too.:D

[Rangefinder]

Longwood>> LOL, I know exactly what you mean ;).

However--I have an even better idea in process already. I have preliminary sketches drawn, uploaded, and sent to LEE to mull over. Rather than do it all myself, I'm talking with someone much more capable of handling the fabrication and possible marketing of the thing. If they can produce it and sell it for 1/4 the cost of what's currently out there, it's a win-win. This would also work for knurling lead boolits for smoke-poles and paper-patching--so there's a good possibility of a broader range market beyond us crazy swagers.

[Longwood]

Longwood>> LOL, I know exactly what you mean ;).

However--I have an even better idea in process already. I have preliminary sketches drawn, uploaded, and sent to LEE to mull over. Rather than do it all myself, I'm talking with someone much more capable of handling the fabrication and possible marketing of the thing. If they can produce it and sell it for 1/4 the cost of what's currently out there, it's a win-win. This would also work for knurling lead boolits for smoke-poles and paper-patching--so there's a good possibility of a broader range market beyond us crazy swagers.

I hope you are not talking about the Lee that takes great ideas and messes them up.
Maybe someone like Buckshot or Goodsteel would be interested.
At least they would make a useable tool.

[Longwood]

If it was my goal, I would experiment with a collet type setup that would work in a press, sqoozing the bullet rather than turning it.
Have you done any research with the swaging people?

[Dave Bulla]

I like youir idea of making the cannelure also the "drive" wheel. You'll need some pretty good rollers and bearings for the bullet to ride against with low friction to avoid distortion.

I'm also picturing a setup where you have a mechanical stop for the depth of the bullet in the tool and handles so you can open and close it effortlessly like a bullet mold. Picture the tool sideways with the bullet standing nose up. An adjustable stop is under it so you can just drop the bullet in and it rests on the stop. Squeeze the handles (a stop screw like you mentioned allows exact repeatability) and give a turn or two on the "drive knob" connected to the cannelure wheel. Release the handles and out pops a cannelured bullet.

[Reg]

Trying to picture something that Herters came out with many years back. Imagine a flat plate with two bearings close together at the back. These are slave rollers or idlers. They are fixed in position. The knurling wheel is attached to a lever arm ( pivoted off to one side)that when swung closed centers itself between the two idlers, the knurling wheel is driven with a hand crank. Depth is controlled with a simple adjustable stop. I think the original setup relied on the lever arm being simply pressed over and held to the stop to get depth, to improve it, another arm fixed to the base would allow you to "clamp" the two ( fixed and pivoted ) between your thumb and forefingers. Height of the knurl or cannular could be held again with another simple adjustable vertical stop.
Does any of this make any sense ????

:?

[Longwood]

One thing to keep in mind is that levers and wheels and parts with hardware that need to be machined then assembled into a product, get very expensive to make.
That is why so much stuff is designed so it can be made by sintering, or worse, with plastic.
A collet type die similar to the ones a certain co already make for crimping the rifle cases, may be far simpler and cheaper to make because it can be made on fewer machines that now days are usually automated, they may already have, will run 24-7 with no breaks, can be operated by unskilled and low payed help, don't screw up product, don't call in sick or show up late, don't get sick time or insurance and make the owners super rich.

His taking the idea to a big manufacturer may be a good idea that could make him some money, unless they decide to steal it. Of course we all know that big companies rarely do that.

[Reg]

Most of the guys on this site are handy to one degree or another and its amazing how many ways they come up with to attack such a problem.
My thought is to come up with something simple to make that will work.
Been around industry too much myself. Yup. Show them something and they will tell you how bad a idea it is then come out with it in next years catalog.
Have a couple of other projects to get out of the way then think I will tackle this one for sure.

:Fire::drinks::Fire:

[dpaultx]

Trying to picture something that Herters came out with many years back. Imagine a flat plate with two bearings close together . . .

Not Herters, and not exactly a poor-mans tool, but probably something similar to this one (http://www.ch4d.com/catalog/bullet/12000) from CH4D . . .

http://www.ch4d.com/media/images/catalog/12000.png

Didn't RCBS make something similar at one time.

Doug

[Sasquatch-1]

I have one of the C&H cannulers and it works great. Considering the cost of swaging equipment $70.00 is not that much. The trouble is everything adds up.

I actually tried "Rangefinders" idea when I was first getting started and found that with a slug for a 44, I could not get hold of the bullet and turn it. I hope you work out a good design at a reasonable price.