Lyman 450 ube/sizer upgrade

[ncbearman]

I seem to remember someone mentioning in a post an upgrade available for my lube/sizer. I can't find reference to it anywhere. Even on Lyman site. Please help. Thanks.

[geargnasher]

Are you referring to the handle upgrade?

Gear

[ncbearman]

No, I beefed that up already, the "collar" that compresses the lube inside is brass, leaks and does not fit firmly in the neck so it sometimes rotates when I try to turn the wrench to lube a bullet.

[geargnasher]

You do not have a Lyman 450. You have a Lyman 45, totally different machine.

I believe the 450 has the same bore as a 45, and the piston from the 450 (double-O-ring type) will fit, but some of the pressure screws had different threads, not sure if they're all different but I know some people have had to change both the screw and the piston when upgrading to the 450-style piston. You might PM "JonB in Glencoe", he knows his stuff about these old sizers.

Gear

[utk]

I have "upgraded" my old Lyman #45. I replaced the leaky brass piston with the double O-ring type.
At least in my lubesizer, the threads were the same. Cheap upgrade!

[ncbearman]

You do not have a Lyman 450. You have a Lyman 45, totally different machine.

I believe the 450 has the same bore as a 45, and the piston from the 450 (double-O-ring type) will fit, but some of the pressure screws had different threads, not sure if they're all different but I know some people have had to change both the screw and the piston when upgrading to the 450-style piston. You might PM "JonB in Glencoe", he knows his stuff about these old sizers.

Gear

Then why does it say 450 on the side?

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/imagehosting/thum_238404fdb377d54ffa.jpg (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=5616)

[Echo]

Wow. It sounds like your 450 has a 45 piston - apparently someone in the past 'fixed' it! It's even money that a new 450 piston will 'fix' it again!

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

ncbearman,
sounds like you have an old style pressure nut.
here is Lyman's page for the parts you want...I think their site is tough to navigate.
http://www.lymanproducts.com/store/page151.html

second item in link
Replacement Parts 4500/450 - ( 2) Pressure Nut (with two o-rings) formerly 2990146
$5.00

ninth item in link
Replacement Parts 4500/450 - ( 9) Pressure Screw
$6.00

regarding the old style brass ringed pressure nuts,
there are two thread pitches, the oldest style is different
from the replacement o-ring style and also has a square top.
if your pressure screw has a hex top, I'm 99% sure it's the same.
BUT, just in case....if your pressure screw is different,
I'd recommend getting a new pressure screw as well.
if you don't need it, it is good to have one as a backup,
because the pressure screw is almost always the first thing
broken when too much pressure is applied when lube is cold.
I hope this helps,

Also, I actually like using the old style brass ringed pressure nuts,
as long as they aren't deformed, they don't leak very much, unless
I have applied alot of pressure. A good condition "old" presure nut
is like a pressure guage. I use soft lubes and I apply heat, the lube
leakage tells me the lube is too warm or I have applied too much pressure.
I also warm the boolits, that is obviously a factor as well.
I think the lube forms a "skin" much faster (as the boolit cools) than
if I lube with everything at room temp, making the boolits easier to
handle when loading/seating. Also, although I'm not an expert on this, it is said that lube adheres to warm boolits better than cool/cold boolits...it just makes sense to me.
Jon

PS. and if your pressure screw does have a square top,
I'd be interested in buying both your old pressure screw and old pressure nut.

[ncbearman]

ncbearman,
sounds like you have an old style pressure nut.
here is Lyman's page for the parts you want...I think their site is tough to navigate.
http://www.lymanproducts.com/store/page151.html

Thanks for the help. I think I will keep the old pressure nut as a way of telling me my lube is too cold. I like that way of thinking. Thanks.

[geargnasher]

ncbearman, I don't know where you got your sizer, but I've never seen a 450 with the old-style piston! I'm pretty sure the O-ring piston was one of the many "upgrades" to the new design. I'd say someone gave you what we call in Texas "The Chorizo Grande"!

I actually like the brass wiper ring. It leaves a few lube ribbons above the pressure piston but it never wears out.

Gear

[ncbearman]

ncbearman, I don't know where you got your sizer, but I've never seen a 450 with the old-style piston! I'm pretty sure the O-ring piston was one of the many "upgrades" to the new design. I'd say someone gave you what we call in Texas "The Chorizo Grande"!

I actually like the brass wiper ring. It leaves a few lube ribbons above the pressure piston but it never wears out.

Gear

Thanks. I think I may keep it in there and when I start to get a lot of ribbon I will heat/soften up.

So this is the newer style 450 correct? The guy before me used very hard lube for big bore.

[Shiloh]

I seem to remember someone mentioning in a post an upgrade available for my lube/sizer. I can't find reference to it anywhere. Even on Lyman site. Please help. Thanks.

The handle broke on my 450. The new one is a linkage arrangement.
I called Lyman. They said the old handle was discontinued and had a new set-up.
They knew exactly what I needed.

I see JonB posted a link.

Shiloh

[fryboy]

i cant tell from the foto but ... grey paint indicates ye olde style 450 , the newer ones ( before the 4500 came out ) were orange , while the brass ring could be a old stock original i'm much more inclined to agree with gar on the "chorizo grande" aspect , it also could be that some one in the past blew an o-ring and had none on hand and put in place the old style pressure nut from a model 45 to keep on lubing ( second guessing could go on forever btw ) the newer pressure nuts should fit fine ( order a couple of extra o-rings at the same time )

[Shiloh]

My 450 is wrinkle paint gray.

SHiloh

[snuffy]

Verrrry interesting! As Arte J would say. I bid for and got a Lyman 450 on fleabay. NEVER AGAIN! It came NOT as advertized, in need of repair and full of some funky, hard, black wax. The pressure screw was stripped, the piston was the old style brass ring design. The only thing that was useable was the top cap!

I boiled the entire press for about an hour to melt and float the lube out. Then I ordered all new guts, including a new bottom plate, "O" rings and pressure screw/piston.

By the time I got all the new stuff, I spent what I could have bought a new 4500 for. Lesson learned, went racing by the dollar to get at the dime!

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Verrrry interesting! As Arte J would say. I bid for and got a Lyman 450 on fleabay. NEVER AGAIN! It came NOT as advertized, in need of repair and full of some funky, hard, black wax. The pressure screw was stripped, the piston was the old style brass ring design. The only thing that was useable was the top cap!


that is interesting...another 450 with the old style brass ringed pressure nut.

Another "The Chorizo Grande" or did Lyman use that on some 450's ???
that is the question !

[Wally]

Are you referring to the handle upgrade?

Gear

Have an old 450 Lyman Lubesizer from 1980--the Operating handle (Part # 2990602) broke on me yesterday. I suppose a replacement is no longer offered and I have to buy the upgrade kit. I should not complain as it lasted 32 years...however it would appear that Lyman knew of the problem back in 1980 as they had come out with the new style 450 that uses different (better parts)...I may very well weld a plate to the old one just to se if it would work. In the meantime I have e-mailed Lyman for the cost of the handle upgrade kit.

I should have bought the RCBS model ...I doubt it would have broken on me...and if it did they'd give me the parts needed.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Wally,
from what I've read here, I'd strongly recommend upgrading the handle on your 450.
Disclaimer: I have never installed the upgrade kit for the 450 and have never used a 450 with the upgraded handle.
BUT, Twice I have bought a box of various lubsizer parts (mostly for the 45),
and from those two boxes, I have found two handles for the old style 450 that may work for you???
one is cracked and maybe easy to repair (see closeup),
the other has obviously been repaired.
they both are you's free if you pay the shipping.

http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/handles.jpg

http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/closeupofcrackedholes.jpg

[Wally]

Wally,
from what I've read here, I'd strongly recommend upgrading the handle on your 450.
Disclaimer: I have never installed the upgrade kit for the 450 and have never used a 450 with the upgraded handle.
BUT, Twice I have bought a box of various lubsizer parts (mostly for the 45),
and from those two boxes, I have found two handles for the old style 450 that may work for you???
one is cracked and maybe easy to repair (see closeup),
the other has obviously been repaired.
they both are you's free if you pay the shipping.

http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/handles.jpg

http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/closeupofcrackedholes.jpg

I thank you for the offer...I can probably fix mine by making two plates to replace the ends with the two bolt holes and welding it to the other end of the operating handle. Mine broke on one of at one of the bolt hole junctures--with use the botd holes ovaled out (wore) making a weak spot and the metal fatigued enough to cause it to break off. A very poor design...yet it did last 32 years. I have contacted Lyman, I may just upgrade it with the upgrade kit.

[Miata Mike]

that is interesting...another 450 with the old style brass ringed pressure nut.

Another "The Chorizo Grande" or did Lyman use that on some 450's ???
that is the question !

I have an old slate gray 450 that has the brass pusher too. Must be an old style thang. I haven't loaded it up with lube and sized any thing yet, but suspect it will be fine as is. If no, I will upgrade it with the 2 O-ring pusher.

[Wally]

Have an old 450 Lyman Lubesizer from 1980--the Operating handle (Part # 2990602) broke on me yesterday. I suppose a replacement is no longer offered and I have to buy the upgrade kit. I should not complain as it lasted 32 years...however it would appear that Lyman knew of the problem back in 1980 as they had come out with the new style 450 that uses different (better parts)...I may very well weld a plate to the old one just to se if it would work. In the meantime I have e-mailed Lyman for the cost of the handle upgrade kit.

I should have bought the RCBS model ...I doubt it would have broken on me...and if it did they'd give me the parts needed.

Update...

Contacted Lyman--they were prompt in their response and very helpful--the upgrade kit is $26 "out the door"... I have had issues with other Lyman products and they have always been good to me....I best stop my bitch'n and be grateful. In this case the 450 lasted 32 years and they have parts for it at a reasonable cost. Thank you Lyman!

[Freischütz]

My 450 (acquired new in 1973) also had the brass pressure nut.

This year the nut finally started to spin so turning the rachet didn't produce pressure. I replaced it with the new O ring type.

[rbuck351]

I bought my 450 new in the early 70s and it came with the brass ring which I have been using ever since. It does form some lube ribbons if I push it too hard but they just go back in the lube pot for the next melt and refill.

[trapper9260]

I have the 450 with the O rings but found that putting a heater on it helps alot to take some of the pressure off the handel. I got the heater from Midway it is one you cna use on any heater because the holes they got for different sizers set up .now I have a easyer time to use the sizer now .hope this will help some also .

[MN91311]

ncbearman, I don't know where you got your sizer, but I've never seen a 450 with the old-style piston! I'm pretty sure the O-ring piston was one of the many "upgrades" to the new design. I'd say someone gave you what we call in Texas "The Chorizo Grande"!

I actually like the brass wiper ring. It leaves a few lube ribbons above the pressure piston but it never wears out.

Gear

One of mine is the gray 450 with the old style red handle. It has a brass piston nut, but grey color. Age unknown. It might have been during a transition period at the factory when they were using up old parts before starting the new ones. Most multi-part devices have disclaimers about different parts during the production runs. Makes sense to use up all the old parts first. Any nickel saved goes in someones pocket.

[avogunner]

I use two 450's and two 45's and they have a mixture of the brass and the 'O' ring versions for the pressure nut. Both work just fine but I wholeheartedly agree with Trapper9260, adding just a bit of heat (as little as a light bulb) make things much easier and less messy. No need for a lot of pressure (that make lube ribbons), better lube groove fill out, and I find I can get a few boolits through the sizer before each crank of the ratchet.
Semper Fi

[uscra112]

I have three 450s. Never knew there was anything but the brass piston.

I never use a lubrisizer cold. Just a mechanics' drop lamp applied 20 minutes before I start a lubing session does me fine. Lay it aside when I start. If the lubrisizer cools off enough to need more warming, it's time to take a break anyway.