Big Chief Buffalo Nickel

[Good Cheer]

This is an Armisport .69 Fremont Model 1847 musket, pretty much the same as the 1842 but with a shorter 33" barrel. To the nearest thousandth the bore is 0.696" and the groove diameter is 0.703".

http://i791.photobucket.com/albums/yy192/SNARGLEFLERK/69Fremont.jpg

Available minie molds didn't work out so it was Erik to the rescue. This was an old Lyman 57730 that didn't have a base plug. Modified to be a straight sided minie with a couple of adjustable length base plugs.

http://i791.photobucket.com/albums/yy192/SNARGLEFLERK/BigChiefBuffaloNickel.jpg

For some reason I just never could get consistent performance. Finally figured it out. The three groove shallow rifling doesn't cut the patches. So, before you stuff it just whip out the pocket knife and put slits in the front of the jacket. Tomorrow will hopefully let me determine how much Jacks Battle it likes best. Stepping up from 60 to 70 grains made things gel today. Will run it on up and see how she goes.
That's two layers of Big Chief tablet wrapped around it.

[Good Cheer]

:rolleyes:
Filled up a five tire stack bullet catcher yesterday to stop these babies and today it's raining. Oh well.

[Rick Hodges]

What a pretty rifle! Very nice. Do they make a .58 replica with similar lines?

[405]

Don't know about Armi Sport but here's some repro choices:
http://www.dixiegunworks.com/default.php?cPath=22_92_186_191

The Musketoons are usually fairly short. The Zouave is about medium length and the rifled muskets tend toward long. The Enfields are also interesting designs and shouldn't be overlooked nor should the M1841 Mississippi. I drool over high condition original Mississippis but they are rare and steep.

[Finster101]

I heard he lives way out on the wind swept desert. :p

[gandydancer]

what is that rifle costing in today's dollars? I have a 58 cal I'm thinking of selling has had about 12 rounds through it, GD

[Good Cheer]

Gandydancer, the last time I looked the price was obscene.

Just punched up Cabelas. It's listed at $949.99.

[gandydancer]

Gandydancer, the last time I looked the price was obscene.

Just punched up Cabelas. It's listed at $949.99.
Thanks good cheer. mine is a euro arms 58 caliber with a 33" bbl two band. I would let go for $425.00 with shipping to the lower 48 where sales are allowed. any interest ask for photo's. GD

[Good Cheer]

Well, slitting the front of the patches doesn't work all the time. There's another malfunction at work somewhere. Also tried lubing the paper at loading with a beeswax / graphite thin paste lube to see if friction was the problem. Still have inconsistencies. Some of the time the minie is going a little bit off, trying to keyhole. Ever once in a while it just jumps way out of the group. It's possible that even this tight of a fit to the bore isn't tight enough by virtue of how much the wall of the minie has to expand to compress the double wrap paper patch. These haven't been patched and then compressed by sizing down.
The high point of the session was a cotton tail that came over to see what was going on. It came down the mowed path from the target, sat by the door of the shop and watched me pop a couple caps through the nipple to get ready to reload. How can a bunny not mind musket caps popping with ears that big?
Any way, there's something still amiss with this minie. But I'm in no hurry and .680 round ball works good with a thin patch and fiber wad under it.

[405]

Why that's the range rabbit of course! Probably thought it was safer close to the .69 than with the owls, foxes, coyotes and bobcats. :) It's the little things like the rabbit story that make it all worth while. Keep us posted on the progress. Those .69s are just odd ducks. Not nearly the choices there are for 58s.

I've paper patched 58s with good success but it's been awhile so CRS is in effect. I know I used a Lee regular minie cast with near dead soft lead and IIRC kinda did a sloppy once-wrapped paper patch with cotton paper and put a dab of crisco in the base. Used something like a mid load... maybe 55 gr FF. Very good accuracy. Kind of tedious. Haven't done it in a few years since finding accuracy with a .584 N-S minie.

[Good Cheer]

Thanks for the info. This is one of those things that I know should be working and I haven't caught the gremlin. I really don't think casting quality is the problem. I went to the Big Chief tablet because the regular onion skin wasn't quite thick enough to make a snug bore fit. But looking at patch pieces on the ground make me wonder if the paper is failing where compressed the hardest against the bore. Oh well, one thing for sure is the paper patches are turning the bore into an even brighter mirror.

[Dan Cash]

Thanks for the info. This is one of those things that I know should be working and I haven't caught the gremlin. I really don't think casting quality is the problem. I went to the Big Chief tablet because the regular onion skin wasn't quite thick enough to make a snug bore fit. But looking at patch pieces on the ground make me wonder if the paper is failing where compressed the hardest against the bore. Oh well, one thing for sure is the paper patches are turning the bore into an even brighter mirror.

Where do you get the non PC Big Chief tablet these days?
Dan

[Good Cheer]

It was from a dollar store? Maybe... my best guess.

[405]

Ya, I can see the issue with finding the best minie size/design (especially for the .69 caliber) and the paper not shucking cleanly and completely as the bullet leaves the muzzle. Those minies in slow twist bores are barely stablilized as it is- with some coming from rotation and some coming from aerodynamic forces. The shallow grooves probably don't help and I don't know how the 3 groove design fits in the equation either. Most of my experience has been with a 7 groove 58 rifled musket. I know that paper patching a minie can work very well-- when it works. Just a matter of finding the right combination.

One thing comes to mind and wouldn't hurt to test. I tried it and it did as well as a full length patching. I patched the upper half of the bullet shank and left the rear part bare (where most of the thin skirt area is). Theory.... When fired I think the rear (bare part) filled the grooves as normal and the front (patched) part of the bullet was simply held aligned to bore axis as the minie was sent on its way.

[curator]

I spent about 20 years banging my head against the wall trying to get my repro-1861 ArmiSport Springfield to shoot minnie balls accurately. With a groove diameter of .595 no commercially available mould made bullets that fit. Paper patching seemed to be the answer but like you I had problems with fliers when the paper didn't come off cleanly at the muzzle. Veral Smith of LBT to the rescue! He suggested I add some Elmer's glue to the water I was wetting my paper patches with and glue the patching onto the bullet. Patches dried on hard and tight. The three shallow grooves did not cut through the paper and the glued-on patching stayed on the bullet all the way to the target. While not a match rifle, I can now get 6" groups at 50 yards where before I couldn't hit the 3'X4' target but once out of five tries. Recovered bullets assured me the patches stay put. Paper patch-wetting formula: 1 TBSP Elmer's glue, 4 Oz tap water. Dip, roll, twist and push into hollow base, let dry. Usually I don't use any lube on this but if shooting several times without wiping I will fill the hollow base with Crisco or black powder lube to keep the fouling soft

[Good Cheer]

Wow Curator, what's the bore diameter on that Armisport?