63 Sharps

[Mike Brooks]

Anybody else here shooting these? I had my .54cal. 63 infantry by Shiloh (farmingdale) out for a short session yesterday and shot a 5 shot 1 7/8 group @ 100 yards off a rest. 435gr ringtail bullet with 50 gr (volume) Schuetzen. Just bullet and powder, nothing else. plenty room left for more powder but it just about blows me off the bench with a full load.
This is only my second session with this gun. Very pleased, and I'll say surprised with the fine results.[smilie=w:

[59sharps]

Due a search here. been covered alot. I'm using 39 of 2ffg Goex. in my shiloh w/ a bullet Made By Steve Brooks mod to fit Charlie Hahn's Tubes .. Charlies tubes and or rolled paper. Adding machine or hair perm.

[Mike Brooks]

I can never get what I'm looking for when I do a search here. Was trying to generate conversation on the percussion sharps, guess that was asking too much.

[Gellot Wilde]

I'm with you Mike, I can never find what I'm looking for using the search (well sometimes I can) just easier to start a new thread.

Picture would be nice...particulary of the frontsight blade! I have an original conversion in .50-70 Govt. and fancy changing the nearly flat blade but can't really seem to find a picture of what the original baled looked like.

Tried Shiloh, but drew a blank, they'd only sell me the whole thing, steel block and all...I gave up in the end.

[Hang Fire]

Anybody else here shooting these? I had my .54cal. 63 infantry by Shiloh (farmingdale) out for a short session yesterday and shot a 5 shot 1 7/8 group @ 100 yards off a rest. 435gr ringtail bullet with 50 gr (volume) Schuetzen. Just bullet and powder, nothing else. plenty room left for more powder but it just about blows me off the bench with a full load.
This is only my second session with this gun. Very pleased, and I'll say surprised with the fine results.[smilie=w:

That is some damn fine shooting with a percussion Sharps Mike. I could not even get close to that with my Sile 63, which was why i converted it to .45-70.

[Mike Brooks]

That is some damn fine shooting with a percussion Sharps Mike. I could not even get close to that with my Sile 63, which was why i converted it to .45-70.
I was surprised too. I had shot a few rounds with
the "trash can" bullet and a full chamber to start with and it nearly bowled me over.[smilie=l: Then I remembered I'd bougth a couple boxes of ringtails from TOTW a few years ago and decided to use them. I made an off handed decision to just use 50gr. I have read where Bill Goodman has had very good results with just bullet and powder, even with reduced charges he uses no filler. So I went for it and was pleased with the results.
After the paper target I took five shots at my silhouettes (6"X8") @ 100 yards and ran them.
Sights are tough to see. They will always hold the gun back in performance. I'm going to see how this gun will do at two hundred next.:bigsmyl2:

[Gellot Wilde]

So what bullet are you using Mike?

[SharpsShooter]

I have a 63 Farmingdale Shiloh sporting rifle :D Don't be too surprised at the accuracy. There are many who get under 4" at 200 yards. My own with the ringtail boolit and 100 grains will do 2" at 100 regularly. The stock shape makes recoil a bit painful but a butt cover from white leather works (a member here) is on order to ease my pain. My chamber will hold 120gr of FFg.

SS

[Mike Brooks]

So what bullet are you using Mike?

I can't give you a mold #. I got them from Track of the Wolf. They weigh 435gr and measure .547. and are ringtails. Wish I could tell you more.
I have a ringtail mold that came with the gun that is a Rapine, I hope they shoot as good as these TOTW bullets. This is an early Farmer BTW. serial number, 5XX. When do you suppose it was made?

[Mike Brooks]

I have a 63 Farmingdale Shiloh sporting rifle :D Don't be too surprised at the accuracy. There are many who get under 4" at 200 yards. My own with the ringtail boolit and 100 grains will do 2" at 100 regularly. The stock shape makes recoil a bit painful but a butt cover from white leather works (a member here) is on order to ease my pain. My chamber will hold 120gr of FFg.

SS

Yep, recoil ended my session. I have three disks that are bad in my neck so the big bullets take their toll pretty quick, still doesn't stop me from shooting them though!
120 gr is a heap of powder! anybody using a partially filled chamber as I am?

[59sharps]

I'm with you Mike, I can never find what I'm looking for using the search (well sometimes I can) just easier to start a new thread.

Picture would be nice...particulary of the frontsight blade! I have an original conversion in .50-70 Govt. and fancy changing the nearly flat blade but can't really seem to find a picture of what the original baled looked like.

Tried Shiloh, but drew a blank, they'd only sell me the whole thing, steel block and all...I gave up in the end.

try S & S firearms for the sight.
for more info go to or try posting on the N-SSA and Shiloh sites

[Hang Fire]

My ringtail mold I bought around 1878 is a Lyman #557489. Lyman doesn't make it anymore, but have heard that Pedersoli now make a similar ringtail mold for around 120 bucks.

[varsity07840]

My ringtail mold I bought around 1878 is a Lyman #557489. Lyman doesn't make it anymore, but have heard that Pedersoli now make a similar ringtail mold for around 120 bucks.

Pedersoli makes two styles of ringtails, a traditional xmas tree and a "modern"
style with much less taper beyond the top band. Both weigh around 535 gr. which is considerably heavier than the Rapine. I have the modern mould and it's very accurate with 50 gr of Swiss 3F in Charlie's tubes. The one drawback is that the ringtail base is too large for the tube. I thin the inside of the neck of the tube with a tapered grinding stone and make three vertical slits to open it up enough for the base to fit. You can also extend the tube a bit by gluing one wrap of paper around the neck and seating the bullet inside as with a paper cartridge and tying it off. The bullet will sit on top of the cardboard tube. It fits perfectly in the chamber of my Pedersoli .54 sporter using Charlie's 1.25" tube. You can also squeeze a bit more powder in the tube with that method. My rifle's chamber will hold 80 gr in traditional paper cartridge and that load using Swiss2F off the bench will get your attention. I wouldn't want to try 120gr. BTW, I also use the Rapine with good results and its base is a snap fit in a tube. I buy them precast from Rush Creek. I wanted a mould but Ray went out of business before I bought my rifle.

Duane

[Tatume]

Hi Folks,

Must these rifles be transferred through an FFL, or can they be purchased directly like a muzzlelozder?

Thanks, Tom

[59sharps]

Pedersoli makes two styles of ringtails, a traditional xmas tree and a "modern"
style with much less taper beyond the top band. Both weigh around 535 gr. which is considerably heavier than the Rapine. I have the modern mould and it's very accurate with 50 gr of Swiss 3F in Charlie's tubes. The one drawback is that the ringtail base is too large for the tube. I thin the inside of the neck of the tube with a tapered grinding stone and make three vertical slits to open it up enough for the base to fit. You can also extend the tube a bit by gluing one wrap of paper around the neck and seating the bullet inside as with a paper cartridge and tying it off. The bullet will sit on top of the cardboard tube. It fits perfectly in the chamber of my Pedersoli .54 sporter using Charlie's 1.25" tube. You can also squeeze a bit more powder in the tube with that method. My rifle's chamber will hold 80 gr in traditional paper cartridge and that load using Swiss2F off the bench will get your attention. I wouldn't want to try 120gr. BTW, I also use the Rapine with good results and its base is a snap fit in a tube. I buy them precast from Rush Creek. I wanted a mould but Ray went out of business before I bought my rifle.

Duane

Try moose mold, from what I understand they have taken over the Rapine operation. The N-SSA board has contact info for them.
I know they will be iv Va this coming week for the nationals so may be hard to contact right now.

[Mike Brooks]

What alloy should I use when I start pouring ringtails?

[59sharps]

What alloy should I use when I start pouring ringtails?

I'm using pure lead. was using not so pure do not know what alloy it was but it was not real hard. Both work the same for me.

[varsity07840]

Try moose mold, from what I understand they have taken over the Rapine operation. The N-SSA board has contact info for them.
I know they will be iv Va this coming week for the nationals so may be hard to contact right now.

I may do that. I saw mention of that non the n-ssa forum.

Duane

[Ed in North Texas]

Hi Folks,

Must these rifles be transferred through an FFL, or can they be purchased directly like a muzzlelozder?

Thanks, Tom

NO, they are classified as "antique firearms".

(I hope this doesn't duplicate, I just posted this, and it isn't showing).

From the statute, Section 921 - Definitions:

(16) The term "antique firearm" means --

(A) any firearm (including any firearm with a matchlock, flintlock,

percussion cap, or similar type of ignition system) manufactured in or

before 1898; and

(B) any replica of any firearm described in subparagraph (A) if such

replica --

(i) is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional

centerfire fixed ammunition, or

(ii) uses rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition which is

no longer manufactured in the United States and which is not readily

available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade.

[Tatume]

Thanks Ed.

[Nobade]

Not only that, but they are not subject to the 11% excise tax. That makes a bit of difference on a $2000 rifle.

[Tatume]

Hmmm. That's interesting. Several years ago I spoke to a dealer about purchasing a Shiloh 74 Sharps. He said he would do the transfer, but that he wouldn't negotiate with Shiloh. He explained that he got a gun for a customer, quoted the customer a price, and when the gun arrived there was 11% excise tax added to the price. The dealer explained to me that no other vendor does that, the price they quote includes the excise tax. He ended up losing money on the deal, because he had to sell to the customer at the quoted price.

Now, knowing that Shiloh also sells guns that don't incur the excise tax, I think is see why they don't quote the price with the tax included.

Take care, Tom

[Tatume]

Hi Folks,

I'm getting more and more interested in a percussion Sharps. One thing that worries me is the fact that I've always been told black powder must be loaded with no air space. If a percussion Sharps is loaded with loose powder, are less than full loads safe?

There are several models, like the 59 and the 63 Sharps. What are the differences among those that are currently produced by Shiloh and Pedersoli? (I'm not asking for a complete history of the Sharps company.) Do Shiloh and Pedersoli make several different actions, or do they use one action (each) and different wood and hardware arrangements?

I've heard good things about the Pedersoli 74 Sharps. Any feedback on the 63?

Thanks, Tom

[Tatume]

More questions: I found this document http://possibleshop.com/did-you-know/d-y-k-shooting-1859-sharps.html which I believe is a Pedersoli instruction sheet. It says 60 gr of FFg will fill the 45 chamber, and 80 gr will fill the 54 chamber. People on this list are reporting as much as 120 gr of powder being used. I'm confused. How much powder do these guns take?

[varsity07840]

More questions: I found this document http://possibleshop.com/did-you-know/d-y-k-shooting-1859-sharps.html which I believe is a Pedersoli instruction sheet. It says 60 gr of FFg will fill the 45 chamber, and 80 gr will fill the 54 chamber. People on this list are reporting as much as 120 gr of powder being used. I'm confused. How much powder do these guns take?

The Shiloh and Pedersoli Sharps have different methods of sealing the breech from gas leaks. According to Charlie Hann, the Sharps expert, all repro percussion Sharps have a gas leak issue to one degree or another with the Shiloh being the best. He does modifications to the breech block and chamber on all of them and they really make a difference. He worked on my Pedersoli .54 Sporter and it performs very well. I've never shot a Shiloh but my understanding is that most if not all of their various models will hold around 120 gr. My Perdersoli .54 will hold around 80 in a full length and width paper cartridge. There is no problem with air space in a percussion sharps. Loading loose charges present a danger when excess powder is allowed to accumulate within breechblock recesses or inside the forestock. Explosions or fires can happen. I saw a Shiloh at Charlie's booth at the N-SSA's range last year at the Fall Nationals that had forestock that was burned on the inside. There is a ton of info on percussion sharps on Shiloh's forum as well as the N-SSA's. Do a search on either one for Charlie Hann. He posts on both of them and you can find his email address. He's a very helpfull, forthcoming individual.

Duane

[Tatume]

Thank you Duane, I will take your advice. Take care, Tom

[59sharps]

Hi Folks,

I'm getting more and more interested in a percussion Sharps. One thing that worries me is the fact that I've always been told black powder must be loaded with no air space. If a percussion Sharps is loaded with loose powder, are less than full loads safe?

There are several models, like the 59 and the 63 Sharps. What are the differences among those that are currently produced by Shiloh and Pedersoli? (I'm not asking for a complete history of the Sharps company.) Do Shiloh and Pedersoli make several different actions, or do they use one action (each) and different wood and hardware arrangements?

I've heard good things about the Pedersoli 74 Sharps. Any feedback on the 63?

Thanks, Tom

diff between the 59 and 63 is the patch box on the 59.

[TommyT]

I had a Pedersoli 1859 Sharps that I shot in coompetition with the 111th OVI in the N-SSA for a few years. Used a Rapine 475 grain ringail and 40 grains of 3F Goex. got 2 inch groups at 100 yards with that load. I didn't have to have much work done to it before I could actually shoot it. Needed a aller front sight and had a new gas check plate made. I sold it off to a buddy on my team and decided to keep shooting my M1860 Gallagher instead.