Deer Hunting

[white eagle]

which would you choose for deer hunting
a 357 magnum or a 44 magnum
I love both for woods long shots of 50 yds and under
the 357 cause it don't kick and the 44 cause its so darn versatile
whats yer pleasure [smilie=w:

[rexherring]

Both work just fine but I like the old saying "bigger is better". Still, shoot what you like to shoot best and are the most comfortable shooting.

[subsonic]

*I* would choose .44. That doesn't mean the .357 is the wrong choice.

[44deerslayer]

I shot a l lot of deer with my 29 -2. 4 inch

[Whitworth]

Personally I would opt for the .429 Magnum over the .357 -- not that the .357 won't do the job. I just prefer bigger holes in animals.

[MtGun44]

.44 for sure. Margins. It's all about margins for error. .357 will absolutely work, but
has much lower margin for error than a .44, esp a .44 HP.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/picture.php?albumid=161&pictureid=1127

Bill

[44man]

.44 all the way. It is my go to gun if I run out of larger.

[Larry Gibson]

I have both and use both but most often these days my "hunting" revover is the Ruger Bisley with 7 1/2" barrel in .41 Magnum. I prefer soft cast GC'd bullets of nominal wieght for caliber in all three that are HP'd. They kill deer quicker and also give all the penetration needed.

Larry Gibson

[429421Cowboy]

.44 for flat out do it all gun, not that plenty of critters don't die just as dead with the .357 i like that i can get the same performance out of my .44 at happy, easy shooting loads that take somewhat hotter .357 loads to reach. My father and grandfather shot plenty of deer with their Pythons when that was "the" magnum but they latched onto the .41 mag when it came out and didn't look back. Bigger is *usually* better, and the bigger the slug is the slower it can go to still do a good job.

[Lefty SRH]

I typically carry my .357 on my hip while my .44 .45 or .480 rides across my chest. Personally I'd choose my .44 for the hunt. I shoot it more accurately vs. my .357

[725]

Whichever you shoot most accurately. Use a big meplat boolit. FYI, check out the LBT site and read about their successes with a .357 mag boolit with their BIG meplat, in a Marlin lever action rifle.

[David LaPell]

Two years ago I would have said the .44 Magnum but when I got hurt I found that I could not shoot it as well, so I have back to the .357 (technically .38-44 Outdoorsman loads) which I can shoot very well. With the right bullets the .357 will take just about any 4 legged animal walking. The key is shot placement and picking the right bullet and load.

[Lloyd Smale]

ive killed many more deer with the 44mag and special then i have all the others combined. Never found it lacking in any way. Ive killed animals as big as a 1200lb bison with a 44 handgun.

[Shuz]

I've killed lots of deer with the .44 mag, and have never found it lacking.

[44man]

I have always said the problem with the .357 was to find the right bullet/boolit. Too many fail on animals.
The .41 is so close to the .44 it is great.
The .44 needs nothing special to work, no need for hollow points or anything, just a good meplat and harder lead can be used.
The .41 is the start and if you keep velocity the same and go up in caliber, results on animals goes up by leaps and bounds.
Deer hit with the .44 will run a trail with a huge blood trail. Hit them in the same place with a .475 or .500 and they run into trees and brush piles. The difference is stunning, yet the .44 will do all you need.
I have killed more deer with the .44 then anything else.
I will not go backwards to the .357 because I do not trust the bullets. Range is also decreased.

[sqlbullet]

Seriously guys?

The OP gave you the perfect chance at a caliber flame war and then you all go an agree? What is the internet coming too?

JK!

+1 for larger holes!

[44man]

Seriously guys?

The OP gave you the perfect chance at a caliber flame war and then you all go an agree? What is the internet coming too?

JK!

+1 for larger holes!
How can you argue with perfection? :mrgreen:

[Lonegun1894]

I personally see nothing wrong with either, but do have to admit I prefer the .357 just because I can shoot it better--which is probably because I have had them much longer. I have taken deer with the .357, and it worked just fine, but you need a decent bullet like has been said. I have used the Lee 158 RNFP and the Lee 158 SWCGC and both worked just fine. They worked better than jacketed I have used. Now this is all with handguns, I have not yet had a chance to compare the two when fired out of rifles, but would expect both to be even more effective--I know .357 is.

[Larry Gibson]

Lonegun1894 makes a very good point. There's lots of .44 magnums out there that get sold and traded or sit in a gunsafe because the owner bought a handgun he couldn't shoot well. Also the .44 in a DA frame can be downright painful to many, I'm one. The Anaconda fits my hand but the N frames are not pleasant for me to shoot at all. Conversley I can shoot full bore .44 Magnum loads (1400+ fps with 250 gr bullet) all day long with a single action frame. Just the way the recoil is dealt with. A lot of shooters would be much better off with the .357 or perhaps the .41 Magnums. Or with a SA frame instead of a DA fram for use with any of the magnum loads. Might not be what they "prefer" but it's what they could shoot better with and thus kill deer better with.

Larry Gibson

[44man]

I have never found recoil from any .44 bad except for the Bisley and my knuckle. Actual recoil in hand is nothing.
After going to larger calibers, the .44 is really a pip squeak. I have shot light .357's that are worse. Yeah, darn it, a .357 can hurt your hand while a .500 will not.

[white eagle]

the op said both were good and liked them both
no set up for a cal flame dance
asked what yer pleasure was

[MJR007]

I to bounced between the 357 and 44 mags till I got a AirLite PD 44mag 4". I don't go into the woods without now.

[Wolfer]

My only problem with the 357 is the noise. I can shoot a 429-421 to nearly 1100 fps before it starts ringing me bad and this is still a pretty deadly load.

I've learned a lot in the last few years about loading quieter loads. Enough so that I bought another 357 that should be here tomorrow. I'm anxious to see if I can load a reasonably quiet but still potent load for it.

[429421Cowboy]

I can shoot a 429-421 to nearly 1100 fps before it starts ringing me bad and this is still a pretty deadly load.

You sir, are a tougher man than I. The .357 does produce an ear splitting crack compared to a .44 but i still find even with my light .44 Spl's I need earplugs for more than two shots. Maybe i'm just a weenie but i don't care to shoot any gun without plugs, this is a subjective matter though, and almost anybody would agree that a .357 is more obnoxious than a .44, but that's kinda like asking weather a poke in the eye or a kick in the head is worse lol!

[Wolfer]

Cowboy
I too wear earplugs when I'm just shooting but I don't wear them when hunting and I rarely shoot more than one shot.
I've also considered that my ears are so bad anymore I may not be loading quieter loads it's just that I don't hear as good.
I've found powder selection to be very important. In my 44 spl and 45 colt unique is my quietest powder that still reaches my target velocity of 1000 fps. In my 45 acp and 45 ar clays is my quietest to get a 230 boolit to 850 fps.
Any load with blue dot or 2400 will ring my ears no matter how light I load it. The same goes for any jacketed bullet with any powder.

[429421Cowboy]

I too use Unique in almost all of our loads, i just don't think deer get any deader with my 2400 loads, i find i'm using less and less 2400 as we go, 9.5gr of U will punch through them with my 240's just fine anyways.
Back when i still shot alot of factory ammo i took a doe at about 40 yards through the shoulders with a 240 WWB SP, which i consider to be fairly hot factory and one of the highest levels of flash/concussion in any load i've ever run through my SBH, when i walked over to her she was still taking her last breaths so i fired once at her head and missed due to the close range so i fired again and those two shots in dense tree cover with a good blanket of snow left me with a horrifying flinch after that for days, that was the last box of them i ever bought, they worked great on deer for us but laid the daisies low, to the point where more than one shot without muffs was asking to cause trouble with trigger control. If Linebaugh says a 240-70 gr slug going 900-1000 fps when it hits,with the correct meplat, is what it takes to punch through a deer size critter thats all i need to hear. .41, .44, .45 all get there very politely with cast+Unique and are so dang fun to shoot, i don't see a reason to change anytime soon.

[missionary5155]

Good morning
In eastern Illinois the deer are big. Corn and bean fed. A caliber .357 mag will take down anyone of them with a well placed shot.
But having wrote that I have never had to help find a lost wounded deer popped with a magnun that starts with a 4. Those bigger, fatter #4 magnums normally exit thus leaving a trail most anyone can follow. I would rather down load a caliber 41 240 grainer to 950 fps than ever trust a caliber 357 158 grainer to exit a deer. Every lost deer I know about revolver shot was done with the .357 mag. My good friend in Perrysville, IN swore by the .357 mag for years. Told me constantly I did not need my caliber 41 mags. But then one year he lost numerous deer with no exit wounds. He now shoots a 44 downloaded with 240-250 grainers. They always exit. There is always a redtrail to follow.
If you have to use a .357 use 180 grainers and only shoot through the ribs or head or backbone. And you might consider finding someone with tracking dogs.
Mike in Peru

[Lloyd Smale]

heck a 22 will kill deer too if its all you have. But its kind of silly to use it if you have a better tool for the job and thats my thoughts on the 357 vs 44. I have an number of both but sure feel alot better in the deer woods with a 44. Why take out a gun that is marginal and may make the animal suffer a bit more when you dont have to.

[lbaize3]

I am for using the .357 Magnum on Monday, Wednesday and Friday. All other days I will use the 44 magnum.....:lovebooli

[David LaPell]

Well, you can argue semantics as much as you want, but as they say pics are worth 1,000 words.

Sasha Siemel and a Smith Registered Magnum

http://i561.photobucket.com/albums/ss57/Smith29-2/SmithTiger.jpg

http://i561.photobucket.com/albums/ss57/Smith29-2/Smithwalrus.jpg

[44man]

One time long ago in PA, I helped a man drag a little deer out. I doubt it weighed more then 80#.
He shot it and it dropped but got up and ran off. He tracked in the snow and dropped it again and again and again for 6 shots. I could cover all shots with my hand.
30-06 with 180 gr Silvertips that just poked holes. I told him he had the wrong bullets for little deer.
That is where I class the .357. It is bullet choice, not the power.
Long ago a survey was taken between the .357 and .44 on deer and the .357 had 50% losses while the .44 had 100% recovery.
You can bet the .357 users had the wrong bullets.
I did the same, losing 3 deer with the 45-70 BFR and those I recovered went 200 or more yards. I thought the hard WLN and WFN would work fast---not to be. The boolit needs to expand and slow in the deer. I went too far and destroyed half the deer.
It is not easy to chose a bullet/boolit. The .44 will work with a hard boolit until you get too slow, then a hollow point, softer boolit is best.
It is always bullet choice for the velocity and caliber.
I will never argue about caliber but I WILL over what you shoot from it.
Seems the .357 has many bullets for PEOPLE or to go through a car door yet little for hunting.
This is a doe shot with the 45-70 BFR using a boolit too soft after losing deer with hard boolits. This is over kill and I lost a whole shoulder.

[44man]

Lost picture again.

[Blammer]

for me it depends.

It depends on what one I have loaded ammo for!

[Wolfer]

I believe Sasha killed most of his jaguar with a spear. If this man would of had a truck it would have to be a 3/4 ton just to haul his gonads.

[Alan]

Never send a boy to do a man's job. .41 or .44 mag w/ Miha's beautiful Keith hollow points and 9-10 gr of Unique. If I want a bit more, 19 gr of 2400 will get you there in the .44. And my .41 5.5" Redhawk is a pussycat.

[TCTex]

Personally I would opt for the .429 Magnum over the .357 -- not that the .357 won't do the job. I just prefer bigger holes in animals.

I have to agree 103.141592654%, but I want to give you something else to think about at the same time.

The Gentleman’s name is Mr. Hollow Point (http://mrhollowpoint.com/ ) shoots big bullets at mild velocities and just hammers game. He also has several youtube clips of shooting good size hogs with air rifles.

Where am I going with this? If you don’t like the recoil of the 44 load up a big heavy 310 Lee bullet (or bigger) and shoot it at a mild 1000 fps and see what it will do. I am just saying… LOL

[TCTex]

Ps, you can shoot it with a 25, now what do YOU feel comfortable carrying??? LOL

http://www.handgunhunt.com/photopost/data/500/KGrHqF_ocE8Vt-g_QkBPSwfZH0cg_60_57.jpg

[44man]

Ps, you can shoot it with a 25, now what do YOU feel comfortable carrying??? LOL

http://www.handgunhunt.com/photopost/data/500/KGrHqF_ocE8Vt-g_QkBPSwfZH0cg_60_57.jpg
All I can ask is "would you carry a .25 for bear?" Where can I send flowers?
You might do anything with anything-----ONCE! The rest of time they pick up your bones.
I will be harsh again, if you can not handle more then a .357, go back to a rifle.

[Wolfer]

I've only shot a few 25s in my life. I'm sure they would kill a bear if it hit the right spot.
I just can't imagine how close it would have to be for me to get one in the right spot!

My best bet is if it were tranquilizer first!

[TCTex]

Don’t get your feathers all ruffled, you missed the point a little... LOL

Look at what is there. It is clearly an ad of propaganda, for Colt, trying to promote their handgun. Of course one could argue that I set you up for this because of the same banter that took place on another sight. Just take it at face value and there is a lesson to be learned. You can kill it with a 22, now what do you feel comfortable carrying.

http://www.handgunhunt.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/105287/page/1/fpart/1


Ps, there isn’t a single game animal on our planet that hasn’t been taken with the wonderful 357 Mag. But “I” wouldn’t take it on a moose hunt…


But again there is the point… what do YOU feel comfortable carrying…

http://www.handgunhunt.com/photopost/data/500/04-06-2012_03_11_20PM.JPG

[44man]

Back when the .357 came about it was hard to believe so much power could come from a revolver. It was nothing short of a revolution adding so much pressure to a cylinder. At that time it was the end all, nothing more could be done.
I had several and shooting a chuck in the head just had eyes bulge, no real external destruction to the head. Even a .44 cap and ball blew chucks down in a huge dust cloud.
Then the .44 mag came out and it just put the .357 on the back burner for me and I sold them off.
I have never been sold on the idea that a .357 can always do it all. I think a good .40 auto is better!
I would pick a .44 or .45 cap and ball over a .357 any day, I seen what the things do to deer, having shot many.

[Rick Hodges]

Like most I feel that the .357 is marginal on deer. Give me the .44 mag.

[ubetcha]

Not to hijack this thread,but I have a 310 Lee mold for my SBH and was wondering what powder people recommend and grains for a approx 800-950 fps velocity? Would a alloy of 50/50 ww-pb be a good choice?

[kenyerian]

Man I love those old adds. Having hunted with both I prefer the 44 Mag. my results with the 357 were less than stellar. However at the present time I am using a 45 colt in a TC for my Ohio Deer Gun.

[44man]

Not to hijack this thread,but I have a 310 Lee mold for my SBH and was wondering what powder people recommend and grains for a approx 800-950 fps velocity? Would a alloy of 50/50 ww-pb be a good choice?
Use water dropped WW metal, no expansion needed at all.
Don't shoot the boolit too slow, you need spin. Take the boolit just over 1300 fps.
I use 21.5 gr of 296 and a standard Fed 150 primer. Super accurate and it puts deer down fast.
Wonderful boolit lubed with Felix lube and can do an inch or less at 50 yards. Don't tumble lube.

[TCTex]

What is also funny is the simple fact of how anemic the 44 has become sense the larger rounds have come out. It kind of makes the question go full circle…

Can a 357 bring down a deer or hog… … … … 100% absolute. IMHO, it is an experts gun, very mush so like a 410 shotgun for birdhunting.

[44man]

Man I love those old adds. Having hunted with both I prefer the 44 Mag. my results with the 357 were less than stellar. However at the present time I am using a 45 colt in a TC for my Ohio Deer Gun.
Isn't the .45 great? Another super caliber that puts the .357 to shame. It will never die and even the old BP loads were deadly.

[Longwood]

The most popular deer poaching caliber, is 22 long rifle.

[44man]

What is also funny is the simple fact of how anemic the 44 has become sense the larger rounds have come out. It kind of makes the question go full circle…

Can a 357 bring down a deer or hog… … … … 100% absolute. IMHO, it is an experts gun, very mush so like a 410 shotgun for birdhunting.
Expert is a funny thing to say. One out of a thousand can hit exact. Maybe it is even worse.
Long ago I would not hunt pheasants alongside a friend. He shot every one in the back of the head with a .410 just as it got off the ground. I never seen anything like it but he was one in a million.
Unless you can shoot like him, I will not promote the .410. It was like shooting a rising pheasant in the head with a .22.
Give me a break, we are normal shooters. I might make the revolver shoot but don't expect miracles from me either.
There is one thing that turns a good hunter into a great hunter and that is the gun used.

[white eagle]

funny you should mention the 410 when we do trap I can usually hit more birds with the 410 than any other shotgun in the rack

[David LaPell]

This reminds me of an article I read not that long ago stating that the .30-30 was really not a good deer round, and how the .30-06 can put it to shame in all respects, now I have read in some places that the .30-06 is not all that it should be and the .300 Win Mag is the best overall. I can tell you that it seems more and more like cartridges that were successful are getting rewritten into something they are not, call it revisionist history. I have alot of old magazine articles from the 1930's on the .357 when Wesson and Elmer did their early write ups. Yes the original factory load was more powerful than what is out there now, but with the right bullet and handload it can get there with no problem. Is the .44 Magnum a better round, yes it is but not everyone can shoot the .44 Mag as well. I happen to like the .45 Colt over the .44 Magnum simply because I can shoot it better. I know even if I wanted to hunt with a handgun this year after my elbow surgery I'm taking my Outdoorsman, but I know what the gun can do and what I can do. If I could comfortably shoot a .44 Magnum one handed I would, but I have learned to really love the .357. I used to work with a guy who killed a deer every year with a scoped 686 Smith. He was also one of the best handgun shots I have ever seen. But he knew the gun, and he knew the load to use. I have spent over a year working on my loads, and I am still working on it. I cast my own bullets and I have hopefully got the best load for the job, we will see. But I would rather make a sure hit with a .357 that I know I can shoot well than a hit with a .44 that might be either too high or too far back on a deer.

[TCTex]

WOW, that was awesome! Yall called it exactly right.

My Dad was an alternate on the US skeet shooting team. His shotguns were a Win 101 with 20, 28, & 410 barrels and a Browning double O/U set bought in Belgium in 1954. I asked to shoot his 410 one day and, well, you can already figure on what response I got… I also laugh and chuckle when I hear of people that let their children start on 410’s… yes, I have really heard that…

In 2006 I read every article I could get my hands on about the 30-06. I was surprised at how many of the articles still acted like they had to defend the 06’s potency. It was interesting.

Well played gents!

Duane

[44man]

In our hunting country, the 30-30 in a rifle is KING. Yet many use a 7mm or .300 mag for 30 yard shots. OK up in the fields but not here in the thick.
But the revolver is different and bigger really is better but you can also go too far.
The .410 is the same, a great gun but distance is shortened for game because of such a small payload. Sure you can break clays but a big bird needs a certain amount of hits. A goose at 40 yards needs more and larger shot then a quail at 20 yards.
I shot many quail with a .410 but would never try to shoot pheasant at 40 or 50 yards and I would not hunt turkey or geese with it.
I rate the .410 with the .357. Small gun for close range.
You have to tell the truth, if you had a .357 and a .44 when a deer appears at 100 yards, which gun will you choose?
Expert shot or not, the toy can fail.
There is the 10 GA, 12 GA, 3"and 12 Ga, 3-1/2", I wonder why if the .410 is the best?????
Will I ever hunt deer with a .357? Naw, a .44 mag is the start. I hate to wound animals.
I want them dead real quick without turning them to a red smog. Three sides of the coin. Meat, mush or suffering.

[jwp475]

This reminds me of an article I read not that long ago stating that the .30-30 was really not a good deer round, and how the .30-06 can put it to shame in all respects, now I have read in some places that the .30-06 is not all that it should be and the .300 Win Mag is the best overall. I can tell you that it seems more and more like cartridges that were successful are getting rewritten into something they are not, call it revisionist history. I have alot of old magazine articles from the 1930's on the .357 when Wesson and Elmer did their early write ups. Yes the original factory load was more powerful than what is out there now, but with the right bullet and handload it can get there with no problem. Is the .44 Magnum a better round, yes it is but not everyone can shoot the .44 Mag as well. I happen to like the .45 Colt over the .44 Magnum simply because I can shoot it better. I know even if I wanted to hunt with a handgun this year after my elbow surgery I'm taking my Outdoorsman, but I know what the gun can do and what I can do. If I could comfortably shoot a .44 Magnum one handed I would, but I have learned to really love the .357. I used to work with a guy who killed a deer every year with a scoped 686 Smith. He was also one of the best handgun shots I have ever seen. But he knew the gun, and he knew the load to use. I have spent over a year working on my loads, and I am still working on it. I cast my own bullets and I have hopefully got the best load for the job, we will see. But I would rather make a sure hit with a .357 that I know I can shoot well than a hit with a .44 that might be either too high or too far back on a deer.



Spot on!!!

[44man]

Many have physical problems and can't handle some guns, it is OK. Just limit distance and choose the right bullet.
Don't shoot at deer at 300 yards with a 30-30, it is one of the best within it's range. I really wish all the hunters here would use it. The .35 Rem is also great. The .357 works too. Use it like you would a bow.
Bigger revolvers and heavier boolits do kill better and faster but in all truth, the best do not have a higher velocity, they all shoot the same speeds.
Sure a 30-06 works but notice the bullet choice matches the game and distance. The wrong bullet can lose a deer yet kill a moose and the other way around.
A .500 S&W on 30 yard deer is crazy and is better at 200 yards but stop and think about how may can hit anything at 200 yards without a rest and sight settings with a big scope. Most hunting is not TV shows from a house with rests. That is only shooting anyway, nothing to do with real hunting where off hand is needed.
How silly is a 4" .500 S&W with open sights?

[NSB]

I've taken well over fifty deer with handguns. Most were shot with the 357 and quite a few with a 44mag. The only deer I ever lost was with the 44mag and that was due to making a bad shot (sometimes you just miss what you're aiming at). Either one is deadly on a whitetail but shot placement is paramount. Gut shot big isn't as good as heart shot small. Just like archery, you've got to place your shot.

[Coffeecup]

I've used both a .357 and .44 on deer, but always seem to come back to the .41 mag.

[Wolfer]

I've used both a .357 and .44 on deer, but always seem to come back to the .41 mag.

I've always found a weak load in a good spot will trump a powerful load in a not so good a spot. That said my favorite is a 250 gr Keith with a small HP @ 1000 fps from a 45 colt. Easy to shoot well and very deadly in the right spot!

Sorry, I meant to quote NSB

[rexherring]

Seriously guys?

The OP gave you the perfect chance at a caliber flame war and then you all go an agree? What is the internet coming too?

JK!

+1 for larger holes!

Thanx, that just made me spit coffee........:-P

[44man]

Thanx, that just made me spit coffee........:-P
It was great!
I know the reason though. We know our limits and how to make things work. Nobody blows smoke!
Kill fast and clean.
It is easier to shoot a deer then for me to kill a farm animal. I could never kill tame rabbits and would not kill a lamb or goat that came up and nudged me. I had tame turkeys that followed me all over, chickens that jumped into my arms so I could pick beetles for them.
I am so stinking soft I would starve. I would run in front of a car to save a dog. I have squirrels in the yard, I like the meat but I go into the woods for them. It is a question of wild or tame.
Wild animals need the respect of a quick death, use what works best for you. Anything that fails and causes suffering, change quick.
I am soft and why I work so hard. A lost animal is a crisis I don't want to face. Since we kill to eat, destroying half the animal to show power and brag about your super mag also does not sit well.
The best hunter in the world is the one that can let an animal walk if death is not fast and if he does not blow it to red mist for some antlers or horns to let the meat rot.

[Grandpas50AE]

Very well stated 44man, I am 100% of the same mind for taking game - it should be as humane as possible.

As to the discussion of caliber, the caliber one can shoot the best with at the expected ranges under the expected field conditions is USUALLY an good edge to start with. Proper placement is paramount, then comes bullet selection. My best friend killed many, many deer with the .44 Mag. cast boolit loads I load up in 275 gr. Keith GC. Anywhere from close up (15 yards) to a ways out (150 yards) in a Smith 29. He also killed several with a Ruger .41 Mag. using 220 gr. Keith-style boolits. Both calibers ran at 1200 fps, had complete penetration (never recovered any of the boolits), and destroyed little meat. The deer didn't go very far either.

One of my other hunting friends has killed several deer with the .357, using my 173 gr. Keith-style boolits powered with 13.5 gr. of H110 over a mag primer. Never had a chance to chronograph them, but these were quick and humane kills, one shot.

In my observation, shot placement and boolit selection have more to do with quick, humane kills on deer than probably any other single factors, so long as the caliber is of legal size.

[44man]

Very well stated 44man, I am 100% of the same mind for taking game - it should be as humane as possible.

As to the discussion of caliber, the caliber one can shoot the best with at the expected ranges under the expected field conditions is USUALLY an good edge to start with. Proper placement is paramount, then comes bullet selection. My best friend killed many, many deer with the .44 Mag. cast boolit loads I load up in 275 gr. Keith GC. Anywhere from close up (15 yards) to a ways out (150 yards) in a Smith 29. He also killed several with a Ruger .41 Mag. using 220 gr. Keith-style boolits. Both calibers ran at 1200 fps, had complete penetration (never recovered any of the boolits), and destroyed little meat. The deer didn't go very far either.

One of my other hunting friends has killed several deer with the .357, using my 173 gr. Keith-style boolits powered with 13.5 gr. of H110 over a mag primer. Never had a chance to chronograph them, but these were quick and humane kills, one shot.

In my observation, shot placement and boolit selection have more to do with quick, humane kills on deer than probably any other single factors, so long as the caliber is of legal size.
You have it! Good post.

[white eagle]

[smilie=s:[smilie=s:
It was great!
I know the reason though. We know our limits and how to make things work. Nobody blows smoke!
Kill fast and clean.
It is easier to shoot a deer then for me to kill a farm animal. I could never kill tame rabbits and would not kill a lamb or goat that came up and nudged me. I had tame turkeys that followed me all over, chickens that jumped into my arms so I could pick beetles for them.
I am so stinking soft I would starve. I would run in front of a car to save a dog. I have squirrels in the yard, I like the meat but I go into the woods for them. It is a question of wild or tame.
Wild animals need the respect of a quick death, use what works best for you. Anything that fails and causes suffering, change quick.
I am soft and why I work so hard. A lost animal is a crisis I don't want to face. Since we kill to eat, destroying half the animal to show power and brag about your super mag also does not sit well.
The best hunter in the world is the one that can let an animal walk if death is not fast and if he does not blow it to red mist for some antlers or horns to let the meat rot.
[smilie=s:
here,here I am getting to be the same way
I could never stand bragging rite hunters(killers)from day one never sat well with me
:razz:

[bigboredad]

While I believe the .357 is enough gun I also believe your shot placement must be perfect every time I would also tend to believe you have to pass up shots that could be made with the .44mag. Such Breaking thru a bone to get to the vitals. But again even with the .44mag you need to be perfect every time I know there are several guys on here that can do it and have the kills to prove. I just don't happen to be one. I've been known to drop a shot push a shot jerk a shot or just plain f--- up. Hence the reason I have only one kill and it was .44mag 20gr h110 and nosler 300gr. sp I believe and was a bang flop. But I never tried it again as I got older I realized Mr. Eastwood was correct " a man's got to know his limitations"
but thats just me