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MSGO-Hammer
04-30-2012, 09:10 PM
Is there a real benefit to water dropping? My alloy is mostly straight WW being used in a 9mm and 45acp. I understand it should raise the hardness a bit. Is it really that beneficial?

MtGun44
04-30-2012, 09:26 PM
Not. It makes the boolits harder. IME, unnecessary with any pistol load, let alone a
really forgiving cartridge like .45 ACP.

Stretching hard to find a real reason for harder boolits, there are a few .45 ACP revolvers
with exeptionally shallow rifling where harder alloy has been reported to help
accy. I've never seen it, but won't call them wrong. 9mm seems to have a few
examples that might be the same issue, unusually shallow rifling. I have had
excellent results in everything, including the magnums at full power with AC wwts or
even significantly softer alloys.

IME, if you have good fit and a good design, and a good lube, hardness drops almost
into the irrelevant category.

I don't like the mess and hassle of water dropping, but there are those that claim
"it's simpler" - which baffles me. How can getting a container of water, making some
sort of antisplash system, then fishing out the boolits and drying them be simpler than
dropping them on a folded towel and then boxing them up in 15 minutes?

Bill

rockrat
04-30-2012, 09:30 PM
Not unless you are going to run the boolits at 1600-2000fps, then it would be beneficial. What you are doing, might do more harm than good

runfiverun
04-30-2012, 09:59 PM
waterdropping is a tool if you don't need to fix something don't get the box out and start working on things.

MSGO-Hammer
04-30-2012, 10:21 PM
I Dont currently water drop. I may water drop if i cast for my 308 or 3006. I have linotype and mootype to add in for hardness on those tho.

HARRYMPOPE
04-30-2012, 10:25 PM
I do it when i cast in the PM and shot in the AM.It lets me process them sooner.I have seen no ill effects on the target with WW or Linotype.
its a simple process that doesn't take much time at all.I have been doing it over 20 years without a mishap.


George

Bushrat
04-30-2012, 10:29 PM
The RCBS Cast bullit book do not recommend water dropping if you are going to size afterward. If you are not sizin git should be fine.

HARRYMPOPE
04-30-2012, 10:36 PM
I am not trying to be contrary Bushrat but-

i have sized bullets .002-003 after dropping and they still shot well at 2000 fps in a 30 BR 4 hours later.I never found their statement to be true.

Frank
05-01-2012, 12:34 AM
HARRYMPOPE:

I do it when i cast in the PM and shot in the AM.It lets me process them sooner.I have seen no ill effects on the target with WW or Linotype.
its a simple process that doesn't take much time at all.I have been doing it over 20 years without a mishap.

Exactly. Quicker loading. Cast today, load tomorrow.

HARRYMPOPE:

i have sized bullets .002-003 after dropping and they still shot well at 2000 fps in a 30 BR 4 hours later.I never found their statement to be true.
Four hours! Wow! It even does that? Great! Good info. :wink:

emrah
05-01-2012, 12:42 AM
I'm one of the ones that DOES find water dropping more convenient. I find the damp towel doesn't stay damp long enough so the boolits sizzle and burn into the towel fibers. I find it much easier to dump out the water and collect the boolits from the bucket. To each their own.

Emrah

MtGun44
05-01-2012, 02:03 AM
Why a damp towel? A dry cotton towel works just fine and does NOT burn. I just
can't fathom some of the strange explanations that come about why water dropping
is "easier". A useful tool sometimes, of course, no doubt, but easier?????? Please.

Anybody else burn a towel? I've been doing this for 40+ yrs and nary a burn on
the towels.

Bill

muskeg13
05-01-2012, 03:52 AM
If anyone drops fresh cast boolits onto a cloth, and they burn the fibers, the cloth isn't 100% cotton. Only man-made materials melt and burn like that. By the way, all casters should also be wearing 100% cotton or wool clothing, including your underwear and socks. If you are so ignorant as to not be wearing a long sleeves, long pants, a hat, goggles, leather gloves and shoes, then you should just forget boolit casting and buy all of your ammunition...don't even try to reload. It's too dangerous for you.

The biggest myth in boolit casting ever perpetrated is one or another variation of the "hard cast" boolits are required myth. I blame all of the lazy gun magazine writers for flim-flamming gullible readers over the last 30 years.

I never water quench and routinely push ac ww rifle boolits to 2000+ fps without leading. A careful match of boolit to groove size and adequate (type) and sufficient (quanity) lube is all that is needed for any lead load within reason, with an average barrel. I push .405 Win ww Boolits to nearly 2400 fps with no special voodoo except I coat Alox lubed and sized gas checked boolits with a second application of Lee Liquid Lube before seating the boolits. I don't need linotype or monotype alloy either.

How could rock-hard boolits ever do well on game?

Maybe barring really shallow rifling, there is absolutely no benefit to water quenching pistol boolits.

Shiloh
05-01-2012, 04:47 AM
Water dropped, wet boolits don't burn me. Been burned before by boolts I thought were cool enough.

Shiloh

Plinkster
05-01-2012, 05:21 AM
When I do water drop (for my 35 Whelen @ 2200fps+) I have a plastic folgers can that I cut all but the outside rim of the lid from. Drape a paper towel over the top with one edge hanging into the can so the boolits can roll off and into it and then snap on the lid ring and fill with water. Near zero splash and it fits on the bench close to the pot.

303Guy
05-01-2012, 05:33 AM
Water dropped, wet boolits don't burn me. Been burned before by boolts I thought were cool enough.Can't argue with that one! But isn't the idea water dropping to get 50-50 WW-pure back to ACWW hardness?

I want harder boolits to prevent nose slump and base deformation in a rifle. But I think I want a fairly malleable alloy for expansion and hold together. Even there I'm being told harder and a flat nose is better so maybe I'll start heat treating but not water dropping. My casting system doesn't lend itself to that so well. I don't do bulk casting anyway.

Bret4207
05-01-2012, 06:04 AM
If you are so ignorant as to not be wearing a long sleeves, long pants, a hat, goggles, leather gloves and shoes, then you should just forget boolit casting and buy all of your ammunition...don't even try to reload. It's too dangerous for you.



I find it generally useless to try and change peoples minds by calling them stupid and ignorant.

excess650
05-01-2012, 07:21 AM
Can't argue with that one! But isn't the idea water dropping to get 50-50 WW-pure back to ACWW hardness?

I want harder boolits to prevent nose slump and base deformation in a rifle. But I think I want a fairly malleable alloy for expansion and hold together.<snip>

Works for me! I try to keep my mix low on antimony so as to be malleable rather than brittle. Too, my mix contains recycled range lead, WW, soft lead, and tin. Generally I make it up in 100# batches, and 2-4 batches in a session so as to have a quantity of similar metal on hand for casting.

My casting pot is on a 36" high bench and I use a 10 quart bucket 3/4 full of water with a hand towell across the top of the bucket to catch the boolits. The bucket is placed to my side about 18" in height. I ladle pour the alloy, cut the sprue back into the pot or into a box to my right, and then drop the boolits into the bucket. They are instantly cooled. Typically they are around 12bhn and harden to around 18bhn in 3-5 days. Boolits are removed from water and rough dried with a towell, and then go into a small cardboard box to be heated with a blow dryer.

I've sized and lubed some of these boolits that had been cast for 10 years or more and saw no detriment to sizing after hardening.

If I'm purposely trying to keep the boolits soft I'll drop on a towell or switch to a lead-tin mix.

My water dropped boolits are typically for 30cal and 8mm rifle, and they get pushed pretty hard. I also cast 357s for microgroove Marlins and push those as well.

Do what works for you.

btroj
05-01-2012, 07:52 AM
I water drop just because I do. I don't expect others to find my way easier or better, I just do what works for me.
I use low Sb alloys so extreme hardness isn't an issue.
My bullets and methods seem to make my guns happy, that is far more important than making other members here happy.

Calamity Jake
05-01-2012, 09:09 AM
Don't WD, never have never will, if I want them harder than as cast I oven heat treat.

dnotarianni
05-01-2012, 09:18 AM
I waterdrop everything for 45 and 500S&W My mix is 4 parts lead and 1 WW Water drop gives me 10-12 that day and 14-15 in a week. No leading in the 45 with a PB and no leading in the 500 with a GC. Whatever I cast I size that same session so they are ready to shoot when I need them

Dave

williamwaco
05-01-2012, 09:20 AM
Burning your fingers aside.
(I don't pick them up with my fingers.)

1) Water dropping makes them harder for a while.
2) They don't need to be harder than than air cooled WW.
3) Air cooled bullets are cool enough to handle and ready to size
in about 30 minutes or less at 80 degrees with no fan.
4) If you enjoy messing with the water and buckets and hearing the sizzle, do it.
5) If you don't enjoy messing with the water and buckets and hearing the sizzle, don't do it.

6) Either way, keep casting.

snuffy
05-01-2012, 10:07 AM
About a year ago, I bought a CZ-75B in 9mm. I spent the last 9 months trying to get a cast boolit to shoot accurately WITHOUT leading. Not that any of the loads WERE accurate, I could have accepted accuracy with frequent cleaning, as the leading was not severe.

Not long ago, a thread like this was on CB.com, after reading the different thoughts, I decided to try water-dropping. The alloy is range lead from an indoor range, which runs 10-12 BHN air cooled, with some gain in hardness after aging. I wanted the lee 124 2R boolit for IPSC and IDPA shooting. So I cast some, water dropped them into a 5 gallon bucket 1/3 full of cold tap water. Checking with the lee tester, they ran 18-20 BHN!

Loading them with WW-231, they shot most excellently. Groups were better than any other cast, and nearly as good as the best J-word and plated bullets have done in that pistol. AND NO LEADING,NONE!

I would not do that for any 45 acp boolits. Nor most .357's. There's one I will try WD for though, the 357 sig with the 125 TC boolit, that one needs the hardness, it's a very high velocity round.

NPBullets
05-01-2012, 10:31 AM
I WD my bullets.

newton
05-01-2012, 11:17 AM
I find it easier to water drop than not. I like my boolits harder than most though. But I like to look at them after I cast some and can easily pick them up without having to worry about getting burned.

ku4hx
05-01-2012, 12:09 PM
I stopped water dropping somewhere around 1990. For my shooting (mostly semi auto pistol) there was just no significant benefit.

45-70 Chevroner
05-01-2012, 12:25 PM
Why a damp towel? A dry cotton towel works just fine and does NOT burn. I just
can't fathom some of the strange explanations that come about why water dropping
is "easier". A useful tool sometimes, of course, no doubt, but easier?????? Please.

Anybody else burn a towel? I've been doing this for 40+ yrs and nary a burn on
the towels.

Bill

+ 1 for MtGun44. He must be using a synthetic fiber towel. Cotton towels work great, and + 1 for water dropping, I used to water drop everything and had more problems with leading than I want to talk about. I have found that air dry works for everything.

mdi
05-01-2012, 12:34 PM
I don't water drop. I cast and shot over 12 years before I looked into BHN values (funny but I had worked out leading problems years before getting a hardness tester). If I want harder bullets, I alloy for harder bullets. Some casters have a use for hardened bullets (as in specific rifle applications), but for the majority it's not necessary.

But reading the above answers, I'd say the majority of casters believe it's purely a personal preference, or method used while casting. Yep it'll make bullets harder, but no real need for harder bullets. Some don't want hot objects around them (air cooling bullets laying on a towel), but I only picked up a hot bullet once and learned that pain hurts. And some may try to improve the bullet's preformance, and some may do it because that's the way they've been doing it for years.

I use common sense when I cast and rarely have any problems (I won't wear anything thay interfers with my movement or feel of the tools I'm using, or make me uncomfortable/sweat; no welders gloves, leather apron, boots, resperator, full face shield, and/or leather welder's cap). Working with hot lead is only as unsafe as you are...

emrah
05-01-2012, 01:13 PM
Why a damp towel? A dry cotton towel works just fine and does NOT burn. I just
can't fathom some of the strange explanations that come about why water dropping
is "easier". A useful tool sometimes, of course, no doubt, but easier?????? Please.

Anybody else burn a towel? I've been doing this for 40+ yrs and nary a burn on
the towels.

Bill

I'll try the cotton towel thing, but aside from that, please don't insult me or anyone else because WE find it easier to do one method versus another. I don't tell you that your way sucks and that "...it's harder and can't "fathom" how you could possibly do it that way..." I somehow manage to figure out the incredibly complicated logistics of water dropping (without a lead explosion), draining, collecting and sorting just fine thanks.

Emrah

Frozone
05-01-2012, 01:42 PM
The only real problem with water dropping is drying and storage, if you don't get em real dry they 'white' up in the box.
I can just dump a towel full of air dropped in the box and forget em till I need em.

I only air drop as a rule, the exception being AR15 destined
If I need harder, I heat treat. To much trouble to heat treat all those .22s though.

mpmarty
05-01-2012, 01:56 PM
I've got cast boolets that are near a year old. I don't think they would be any harder if they had been water dropped. ACWW is all I use with a bit of monotype added to the melt for tin and antimony.

fatelk
05-01-2012, 02:43 PM
Quote:

Originally Posted by muskeg13 View Post
If you are so ignorant as to not be wearing a long sleeves, long pants, a hat, goggles, leather gloves and shoes, then you should just forget boolit casting and buy all of your ammunition...don't even try to reload. It's too dangerous for you.
I find it generally useless to try and change peoples minds by calling them stupid and ignorant.
Good post Bret; I agree. All I can figure is that inflammatory statements make some folks feel superior.

As to water dropping; I never water dropped for my first couple decades of casting, then water dropped most everything the last couple years as I learned more of the science and art of casting.

I personally don't find water to me much of a hassle, but can't say whether it really helps much either. I have had good success with water dropped, range lead/WW bullets in my .40 Glock. I am still learning though.

MtGun44
05-01-2012, 08:18 PM
And who called anyone stupid or ignorant? I certainly did not, ever.
Some people seem to get quite agitated by a mild expression of a
different point of view.

Bill

emrah
05-01-2012, 08:32 PM
I often get told it's not what I say but how I say it. So yes, I can relate. Perhaps I was just a little PMS-y and sensitive this morning.

Emrah

quasi
05-01-2012, 09:23 PM
If I want harder boolits, I toaster oven them and water drop them after sizing...

captaint
05-01-2012, 09:26 PM
When my casting career began, after reading here for some time, I decided I had to water drop. So I did for the first couple of sessions. Then, I asked myself, so, why am I doing this ?? I was just casting for 45ACP, so I stopped the water ritual. Haven't done it since, for multiple calibers.

Now, I am beginning to cast (tonight) and load for 9mm. I'm hoping I don't find the need to water drop for the 9. I do have a boatload of monotype, though. enjoy Mike

Lizard333
05-01-2012, 10:55 PM
I water drop because it is easier for ME. I don't like to have all of those boolits on a table to burn the heck out myself. I've done it since the beginning of casting and have never had a problem.

I can cast 20 pounds of lead into one bucket and empty it once at the end of my session. I dump the boolits onto a dry towel and look for mess ups. After sorting out the different types of boolits, they are dry and I move on. Living in a high desert might have something to do with not having problems with wet boolits.

The added benefits of added hardness using softer lead mixed with WW's is just a bonus. In addition I can cast today and shoot tomorrow.

Oh, I were shorts, shorts sleeves, no safety glasses or shield, no gloves, flip flops while casting, and RELOAD, guess I'm REALLY dangerous. Who knows how I have made it reloading 12 years without an accident.

Should I start buying factory ammo now?

Norbrat
05-01-2012, 11:04 PM
Oh, I were shorts, shorts sleeves, no safety glasses or shield, no gloves, flip flops while casting, and RELOAD, guess I'm REALLY dangerous. Who knows how I have made it reloading 12 years without an accident.

Should I start buying factory ammo now?

Your call, but I wouldn't go near a hot pot of lead without safety glasses. Burns on your flesh will hurt and scar, but you will heal. Molten lead in your eye and you will have permanent damage, right up to total blindness.

I run gun safety classes at my club, and I am constantly amazed how many folks will sit there like stunned mullets and just don't seem to get it when I try to make them understand that glasses are the single most important personal protection device when shooting (and for our casting affliction.) As I tell them, shrapnel can be picked out of you face, bones can be reset, lacerations stitched, but once the eyeball is penetrated, there is nothing which can be done.

But, as I said, your call.

fatelk
05-01-2012, 11:35 PM
And who called anyone stupid or ignorant? I certainly did not, ever.
Some people seem to get quite agitated by a mild expression of a
different point of view.
Bill, I don't think it was pointed at you, at least my comment wasn't. I was just agreeing with Bret that the post slamming unsafe casters was a bit over the top, in tone at least if not substance.

I admit I don't wear all the PPE some deem necessary, but I certainly understand Norbrat's message about eye protection. I need to get better about wearing safety glasses myself.

MtGun44
05-02-2012, 12:39 AM
I finally found the "ignorant" comment, and now I see who exactly wrote it.

I try VERY hard to make sure that if I disagree with someone, I do it without being
disagreeable, so I was a bit surprised - and now I think it was not aimed at me, so
no problems, I think I misunderstood.

As to water dropping - I think quasi makes a good point in his post.

However - I will always make sure that everyone understands that I know it is a
free country (well, to some extent) and please do what seems best for you.

As to the lack of personal protective equipment - well, that is a personal choice too,
and I'm sure I have done a few knuckleheaded things in my time - but I have
slowly learned that wearing protective equipment can be a really good thing. I
eventually figured out that I was not immune to injury. At 19 years of age, I got
in a bad motorcycle crash (with helmet) and spent 90 days in traction, then 90 days
in a cast and then a few months on crutches. I kinda got past my "invulnerable"
period and am a big believer in seat belts, helmets, safety glasses, gloves and
steel toes shoes - etc.

Do what you want, I hope you all stay safe.

Bill

Plinkster
05-02-2012, 12:57 AM
If you wear prescription eyeglasses as I do you may want to inquire about safety glass frames the next time you're at the eye doctors. I am lucky enough to have an employer that foots the bill for my safety lenses but after having found my last pair (Wiley X) I wear them all the time whether at work or not. Being involved in the shooting/casting/reloading hobby presents many good reasons for wearing safety glasses and I find myself never without cuz if I am I can't see anyway!

Norbrat
05-02-2012, 03:35 AM
Like MtGun44. I'm also well past my invulnerable stage of life.

In fact, now that presbyopia (old farts shortsightedness) has well and truly taken hold, I rarely do anything in the workshop without wearing my bifocal safety glasses, whether I need them for "safety" or not.

Ebay has them for as little as $6.75 plus postage, although the slightly more expensive ones with a better frame last longer.

I get lots of 5 sent to Australia, as here the same glasses are at least $25 ea.

Another option is to get stick in bifocal lenses from OPTX; I have these in my sunglasses and shooting glasses, so I can see the front sight.

Sorry, thread hijacked! :smile:

mdi
05-02-2012, 11:58 AM
If you wear prescription eyeglasses as I do you may want to inquire about safety glass frames the next time you're at the eye doctors. I am lucky enough to have an employer that foots the bill for my safety lenses but after having found my last pair (Wiley X) I wear them all the time whether at work or not. Being involved in the shooting/casting/reloading hobby presents many good reasons for wearing safety glasses and I find myself never without cuz if I am I can't see anyway!
Yep, me too. I've got a small, mebbe 1/16" dot on the right lens of my safety glasses, right in front of my pupil. I dropped one sprue back into the pot, and this tiny, itty-bitty drop of melted lead (too small to see in flight) was headed for my eyeball, stopped by my safety glasses. I normally stand when I dump sprues/culls back in the pot and do so carefully to avoid splashes, but this ONE time I was sitting in front of the pot (normal casting posture), I dropped ONE sprue back in the pot and got ONE drop that would have blinded my right eye (and that's my good eye too!). I keep that pair of glasses near my bench to remind me...

Lizard333
05-02-2012, 05:32 PM
Norbrat,

I guess I made that comment while I was a little hot. Having others say what you should or shouldn't do, got my goat. I do use precautions when casting, but I was ticked off with the previous comment.

People do stupid stuff all the time. Chances are good they will learn and not make the same mistake again.

I agree with you about the safety glasses. I always were mine. It's a good practice to get into.

Now the statement about the flip flops might have been true ;)

tuckerdog
05-02-2012, 06:43 PM
when water dropping you are in essence case hardening, if you size after water dropping you are removing the case hardened surface. those of you that are getting good results after waterdropping try shooting those boolits sized w/o water dropping i've never found water dropping nesassary when lead tin antimony are alloyed to the PRESSURE in question.

BAGTIC
05-02-2012, 07:04 PM
I oven heat treat. I believe it achieves more uniformity. I tried water dropping but sometimes a bullet would hang in the mould and I was never sure whether to drop it after it had cooled or to recast. Also water dropping causes splashes something that might be messy, slippery around the bench and could conceivable splash into the pot.

If you decide to water drop I found it helps to put water in a bucket or pail and tie a piece of cloth over the top with a slit cut in it. The dropped bullets will roll through the slit and the cover will stop most of the splashes.i

bamacisa
05-02-2012, 08:52 PM
I wd because it works for me. It makes harder bullets and is easier to get good bullets. My suggestion is do what works for you. I have been casting bullets since 1975 and have never had a problem with wd.

45-70 Chevroner
05-02-2012, 11:51 PM
I water drop because it is easier for ME. I don't like to have all of those boolits on a table to burn the heck out myself. I've done it since the beginning of casting and have never had a problem.

I can cast 20 pounds of lead into one bucket and empty it once at the end of my session. I dump the boolits onto a dry towel and look for mess ups. After sorting out the different types of boolits, they are dry and I move on. Living in a high desert might have something to do with not having problems with wet boolits.

The added benefits of added hardness using softer lead mixed with WW's is just a bonus. In addition I can cast today and shoot tomorrow.

Oh, I were shorts, shorts sleeves, no safety glasses or shield, no gloves, flip flops while casting, and RELOAD, guess I'm REALLY dangerous. Who knows how I have made it reloading 12 years without an accident.

Should I start buying factory ammo now?

I hope you are not serious about the out fit you ware. It only takes a second for something to go wrong and you can have a face full of hot lead and god forbid an eye with even the smallest amount of hot lead and you could lose an eye. My older brother found out the hard way. He at least had safety glasses on. For what ever reason the pot erupted and he had burns on his face, arms, legs and the lead even went down into one of his shoes. He had second and third degree burns, and it took a long time for him to heal. This is not to infer that you are stupid or dump, but you are putting your self in serious jeopardy.

Lizard333
05-03-2012, 12:04 AM
Post #43 I made it clear I was only kidding. Safety glasses are a must for my casting setup.

BulletFactory
05-03-2012, 12:40 AM
Try it both ways. let the WD sit for a week first, or you have wasted your time.

In my .40, the water dropping is one of the necessary steps to successful reloading.

45-70 Chevroner
05-03-2012, 08:50 AM
Post #43 I made it clear I was only kidding. Safety glasses are a must for my casting setup.
Sorry about that, I missed #43. I got in such a hurry because I thought you were serious.

milprileb
05-03-2012, 09:37 AM
With pure linotype mixed with wheel weights: 1:4 ratio, water dropped, I had really hard accurate 45 acp bullets and same accuracy with air cooled. Never had leading but the alloy is hard so that may be the variable that keeps results constant. For 44 Magnum, air cooled bullets were fine with pure linotype.

I know this AC vs WC thing is a MAJOR DISAGREEMENT with this site membership with few bridges of understanding being built. WIth the experience of all membership, I am convinced the mixed results in opinion is alloy driven and bullet size to bore driven. So many variables and when one member finds a result that works, he goes with it.

There are some mysteries in this for me. While I think AC works for 45 acp, I find that AC or WC don't work for 50 50 alloy (50% Wheel Wt to 50 % range lead) in my 9mm... I get leading.
But if I boost it to 80 20 (80% WW to 20% range lead), WC bullets will not lead in my 9mm. Never tried to AC these bullets with 80 20 alloy

What I think: My 9mm Taurus 1911 barrel is the issue. Does not make any difference if I use WL lubes or LBT, size .356, 357 or 358.... if I use 50 % lead to 50% WW alloy... going to get leading.

Some of you cast a few bullets and go test them and can do a qualitative analysis. For me, I cast in day long blitz sessions with 6 cavity 45acp and 9mm molds. If I cast a bunch of bullets and find them soft for not water cooling them, I just lost a days effort so in avoidance of leading issues, I water cool so my production effort is not for naught.

However , you Air Cool guys have finally convinced me to do a test and since I have plans to cast rifle bullets and will be doing a one pot run of them, I will AC half and WC half and see if there is any LOVE difference. That may indeed give me the insight on whether to never water cool pistol bullets again or not.

I am going to weigh each bullet (AC OR WC) after sizing before Gas checking them so the test is consistent for determining accuracy. Same weight bullet shot, be it AC or WC. Being shot from a Lead Sled at 100 yds, with a very accurate 30 caliber rifle. Hand measured / weighted powder charges. Will report back out.

On closing, would anyone want to comment why 50 50 lead to WW alloy Water Cooled and shot in 9mm pistol leads my barrel ? Is there something with pressure spike that causes this and not with a harder alloy ? Thank you in advance.

Colorado4wheel
05-03-2012, 11:25 AM
In my gun with my load it makes a huge difference.

9mm KKM Barrel. SOLO 1000, 3.8 grs, 1.080 OAL.
140gr range scrap bullet with just enough WW to make them a little harder. Sized .357"

With water dropping, barrel is clean, clean, clean. Cleaner then FMJ loads.
With out water dropping it leads horribly.

I tried everything. Started with .356" sized bullets and worked up. Things got a lot better at .357". BUT with my charge of a FAST powder my gun needs them water dropped. They are accurate as well. I could probably use a slower powder and not water drop them but I like my Solo.

milprileb
05-03-2012, 12:32 PM
Colorado4wheel:

I failed to state this: My results is not using a fast powder like BE. I went from Bulls Eye to WW 231 and had the same issue with 50 50 alloy , then I went too Blue Dot which is way way slower (per sage advice given by members of this board) and I can make BD work if I don't use 50 50 but use water cooled 20 PB to 80% WW. The leading decreased with slower powders but I never reached a decent result with 50 50. I might add: I was getting leading with 20 PB to 80WW, water quenched with BE and WW231.

These results even when I got a M die and sized bullets to .358 and retested powders and alloys.

Bottom line: Going to a slower powder never changed the leading characteristics of 50%Lead
to 50% WW alloy water quenched. But BD with 20% PB to 80% WW, water quenched, sized .358 with use of M die got me accuracy and no leading.

Is there a value to slower powder, I think so but with my barrel, there must have been other issues going on that made 50% lead work so terribly.

Before any one says it: Yes....I tried all bullet seating depths and 50% lead remained a alloy that leads this barrel.

rond
05-03-2012, 04:03 PM
I started out dropping onto a towel but had a lot of boolits deform slightly when dropping onto the ones already there, don't have that problem with water dropping.

abunaitoo
05-03-2012, 04:09 PM
I water drop so I don't get burned when I make a mistake and pick-up a hot boolet.
It use to happen more than I would ever admit.

dakotashooter2
05-03-2012, 04:46 PM
I often do it for batch to batch consistency. I may cast bullets when it is 35 degrees in the garage or 100 degrees in the garage. The water is an easy way to get consitent cooling temps from batch to batch. I have a 6 gal bucket and a 4 gal with holes in it that fits in the 6 gal. Fill with water, throw in ice if needed. A wet cloth funnel eliminates the splash. Pull the 4 gal bucket from the 6 gal bucket and dump on a towel to finish drying.

Char-Gar
05-03-2012, 05:55 PM
I would not "water drop" such bullets and therefore I do not.

williamwaco
05-06-2012, 03:50 PM
I like diet doctor Pepper.

Wanna fight?



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