bore conditioning

[Beekeeper]

I Know, it has been beat to death, but I need some info and help.

I have read all the posts I could find about it and maybe I am just confused (most likely).
I shoot old (50 years or more) guns ( read junk).I am anal about cleaning and do not stop after a range trip until the bore is as squeeky clean as I can get it.
After cleaning I always run a wet patch with Kroil on it through the barrel.

If I read the posts right I should not be doing this and only give it a cursery clean unless I am putting it in storage for long term.

Old Military habits die hard , so I am looking for answers.

I have a couple of Isralli Mausers that I am shooting and I might as well be shooting an Asperly Aimless as I have yet to hit the inside of the barn.
Bores have been slugged and the proper boolit used (size wise)
Am using load data for said boolit gleaned from the Lyman cast boolit load manual.

All info gladly accepted pro or con.



beekeeper

[ShooterAZ]

Try just swabbing the bore with Hoppe's and not brushing it out. Let it soak, and swab right before shooting again.

[Dan Cash]

I too shoot old guns but mine are a bit older (black powder) but the bore question, I think, is the same. I clean until the gun is clean lest rust destroy a fairly spendy weapon. I do shoot a good bit of .30-30 and .35 Rem with cast and admit that I don't spend the effort after shooting that I do with the BP guns. This negligence comes after loads have been developed that do not lead. If lead fouling is not present, there never seemed to be much if any difference in the accuracy of the rifle whether cleaned or not. I grant that my platform, a Marlin 36 and 336, is not sub minute capable but clean or dirty (as long as there is no lead in bore), these rifles will produce consistent 1" to 1.25" groups at 100 yards.

I am not recommending you neglect your guns but be careful you don't damage the bore through over zealous use of rod, brush and swab.

[geargnasher]

BK, humor me a minute, this works for me. Use just one of your guns to test this. Make some Ed's Red, no lanolin, small batch. Next time you go to the range, plan on shooting at least 50 rounds through that gun with your favorite load. When finished, run two patches dampened with Ed's through the barrel, followed by two or three clean patches. Do not strive for squeaky-clean, you only want to to get the loose powder fouling and soot out of it. Clean the action as you nomally would. Next session, one wet patch and one dry patch with Ed's before shooting, and shoot a long string. Things should start improving rapidly. Keep this same routine for a while, providing you don't store the gun for a long time. If you do, wipe a light coat of non-solvent oil, like straight 30-weight, non-detergent small-engine crankcase oil, through the barrel to prevent rust.

This is all assuming you're using a traditional lube and not a tumble-lube. This technique works really well with beeswax-based lubes like Felix and NRA 50/50 blends.

Gear

[Moondawg]

Benchrest shooters are very compulsive about cleaning their bores squeeky clean every 10-15 rounds. Most put a very light coat of oil in the bore after cleaning. Generally speaking they never try to shoot a totally dry bore. They also get extreme accuracy out of their rifles.

National Match shooters usually do a good cleaning after 60 or so rounds. They also get good accuracy, but not as good as the BR Boys.

Some barrels shoot better squeeky clean and some barrels like a little fouling. It depends on the individual barrel. I have to say, I would never put a rifle away with a dirty bore. At the very least I woud put two or three patchs soaked in my favorite bore cleaner, let it set for 15 minutes and follow up with a couple dry patches and an oily patch.

[tomme boy]

I would have to say that the muzzle is larger than the rest of the barrel. Every Isreali mauser I have seen had a lot of wear. Try slugging the last inch of the barrel an see what it is.

[Beekeeper]

thanks Gear!
Will give it a try.
Like I said old Military habits are hard to break, especially since they were taught with a size 10 shoe in the backside.
No a gummers mate but one of my best friends was so between early age training and his boot
the habit of squeeky clean is hard to break!


beekeeper

[303Guy]

I used to rely on Hoppes in the bore as suggested by ShooterAZ but got a little shock when I found my prize mint bore with rust in it! I used to live in a warm and mostly dry place but even in the wet and humid climate the Hoppes worked just fine until recently. Maybe it was residue from another bore cleaner on the brush. I don't know. Hoppes does stop bluing salts rusting - go figure!

[runfiverun]

gears method works pretty well.
i have done similar for some of my bolt guns,mainly the ones i use for hunting.
i just clean the action on most of mine.
i have one levergun that has had a patch down it once since cleaning the bbl when new.
[i thought i had some leading but it was lube streaking in the middle of the bbl.]
and two others that have not been cleaned since new [going on 17 years for the navy arms] but they have never seen anything other than cast boolits.
and had the action pulled down and cleaned.

[Bret4207]

I certainly wouldn't ell anyone to do things as I do, but I don't clean unless the gun tells me it needs cleaning. Preventing rust isn't cleaning in my book. The bore doesn't get cleaned unless I get leading or something or I intend to take a jacketed rifle and turn it into a cast only rifle. For storage a patch on a pull through coated with ATF or light oil is enough.

Just my two cents as a believer in bore conditioning. This also only applies to non-BP arms.

[bobthenailer]

I do clean my guns ! about every 200 rounds or less ,it also depends how long it will be until i shoot it again , the most i do for handguns bore is run a Boresnake through it but i shoot cast bullets 99.99 % of the time. for the HP rifles that i dont shoot that much i will clean after every range session.

[popper]

I don't use Hoppes anymore for CB guns. ATF/Kroil/kerosine. Mobil 1 for long term storage.

[Char-Gar]

+1 on Gear's post. That is what I do.

[edler7]

I think tomme boy is on the right track. Excessive muzzle wear from cleaning prior to you owning the gun. Not uncommon in surplus rifles.

[mpmarty]

I don't put a rifle in the safe until it's clean. I've got my 308 Savage sitting on my bench in a gun vise now for three weeks or so... I'll get to it someday.

[bbqncigars]

I used to be really anal about getting my Windrunner's bore absolutely clean after every range session. It would take a half hour or so before getting all of the copper fouling out(waiting on a NOE mold for it). Then a couple of serious match shooters in the FCSA stated they only cleaned their bores once a year, when they put them back in the safe for winter. I started to only clean after a few hundred rounds, and haven't noticed any decrease in accuracy. Now I don't clean my bores unless accuracy starts to suffer.

Wayne

[shotman]

I am with bret Ihave many that have never been cleaned and they will do anything a sniper needs. the old guns you need to back bore the last 2in out . its the muzzle not the barrel as a whole