Abysmal .223 results

[kbstenberg]

I have read beagles 3 part tutorial on the .223 an I am in full agreement on the difficulty casting for the .223
I have done what was suggested. Inspection, weigh an separate by weight. An I still can't come up with any consistent results. Yesterday I was getting very good results with some test loads at 50Y. Today I made up the same loads and shot at 50Y again and also 100Y. My 50yard groups were 3 times the size as yesterday. And at 100 yards I was lucky to keep my hits on a double size sheet of paper.
I am seriously considering selling all my 22 molds and just shooting J bullets.
Sorry for the rant. Kevin

[Larry Gibson]

Rifle?

Twist?

Mould?

Load information?

Larry Gibson

[kbstenberg]

Savage Axis .223 bullets used Noe 225-60gr / Noe RCBS 22-055 / 225646 / Noe 225107 / 225415
Powders used Unique- 2400- Blc2- I just got Varget but haven't used it yet. I just got a chronograph an used it on the Unique.
WSRP / Ben's Red Lube / Alloy 6WW to 1Lino all WD / Gater GC / sized .225 Lyman L.S.
I haven't had a problem with Key holing or with leading in the barrel.
My last attempts were Unique 7-8-9-10 gr with RCBS 22-055. The first day the 7-8-9 gr loads all grouped 1.5" at 50 yards for 4 shots with 1 flier about 2" out. No shots taken at 100 yards. My shooting sequence was to shoot 3 rounds over the chronograph then 5 for group I never put a patch through the bore during 30 rounds. That night I did a therough cleaning of the bore.
Next day using Unique with 7-8-9-10 gr of powder with the same bullet. I varied my shooting sequence hopping my grandson would come out and help " which he didn't" First I shot over the chronograph, 3 rounds for each powder weight. I then ran 2 patches through the bore to clean fouling. then I shot each powder weight for group at 50 Yards putting a patch through the barrel between each powder weight. All my groups were 3 times larger than the day before. then I tried each powder weight at 100 yards. This time not using a patch between powder weights. Of the 12 rounds fired at 100Y, 9 hit the double sized sheet of target paper ( 2 targets paper clipped next to each other ) The only bright spot was 2 consecutive bullets of the same powder weight struck the target 1/2 inch apart.
The most perplexing thing of all. On day 1 I would set the powder scale an through each load not weighing the powder. On day 2 each powder charge was thrown then weight was checked on a balance beam scale for uniformity.
Last night (day2) I did another bore cleaning. I took the scope off and checked the scope base for looseness. All 4 screws were tight. Re-attached the scope.
Today day 3 . I think I will load just 1 weight of powder with the same bullet. So I don't waste any more components. And shoot for speed and groups. To see if anything has changed again. Just thinking. I will also load as the powder comes from the powder thrower, and a second group of bullets will have the powder weighed. Yes I know by taking the scope off I will probably have changed the point of impact, but group size shouldn't have been affected.
Later in the day. loading and shooting completed.
Load A was the thrown powder which chronograph ed at 1818-1821-1844. 4 rounds shot about 1.5 by 1.5, the last round was thrown 2" out
Load B which had the measured powder. Choreographed at 1816-1813-1808. Again the first 4 shots went in to 2" by 3/4" with the last round going 3" out.
I am starting to think I just had a bad day yesterday and keep on going.

[Larry Gibson]

Your Savage Axis .223 has a 9" twist. At 1800 fps you are pushing the RPM threshold and everything, I repeat everything, must be perfect to reduce those flyers. I suggest you try the Varget with the heaviest type bullet you have. Start at 16 gr and use a 1/2 gr dacron filler. Work up in .2 gr increments until accuracy goes south or doesn't get good. The flyers will tell you when it's over the RPM threshold.

I also suggest you drop back to 5 - 6.5 gr of Unique with Noe RCBS 22-055 / 225646 / Noe 225107 / 225415. Or use 4 - 5.5 gr Bullseye with the 22-055 or the 225415 looking for best accuracy in the 1500 - 1750 fps range. No filler or wad is used with either powder.

With the Noe 225-60gr you might try AA4350 or RL19 starting at 18 gr and using a 1/4 - 1/2 gr dacron filler working up until loading densrity gets at 80+% when, if accuracy is still good you can drop the dacron filler.

Larry Gibson

[Gunnut 45/454]

Larry's got it pegged, I have a Sav Hunter and get about 1.5- 2 " groups with the Lyman 55 GC over 18 gr of IMR4895 and a tuff of cotton over the charge, move it up to 18.7 gr and a tuff of cotton for my AR 15. Get about the same groups maybe a little bigger at 100 yards with a 1:7
Ther movin about 1875 ish fps . Bullets are WW quenched sized .225" . Castin I found get the mold hot and then start run the bullets out- when I first started casting .223 I got alot of defects until I got the mold hot and the technic of the pour down. Flux well and add enough tin to fill them out and you'll get very nice bullets. With my mix they run about 62 gr checked.

[runfiverun]

stop cleaning the bbl.
changing powders will cause problems for a while too untill it gets settled in.
10-11 grs of 2400 will get right close to 1800 fps also.
use a rifle primer with it.
load one powder and shoot 20 rounds of it and see what happens.
i have changed just lubes and not powder or amount in a test, and watched it scatter 8 boolits over a 5"x5" area, the next 12 went into 3/4 of an inch.

[telebasher]

Great tips and imformation to be sure, one more little piece of advise for you would be to keep accurate notes with your targets. Sometimes a small hint of what your gun wants to shoot is right there in front of you. I am guilty of not being able to see the forest because of the trees. LOL