Range Report from 1963

[Char-Gar]

I picked up an old loading note book and started to peruse some of the old data. I ran accross some 30-06 cast bullet loads from 1963. The rifle was a DCM 03A3 and the only bullet mold I had was 311413 Squibb. Back then I didn't have a clue what I was doing and didn't know how to intrepret the data. I also didn't keep the group size, but a comment.

Today this stuff makes sense, and gives direction..anyway.. from March 3, 1963 This was my first attempt at cast bullet shooting in a 30 Caliber. Before that I had only cast for pistols (38/357, 44 Magnum, 45 Colt and 45 ACP) the 25 Remington and the 45-70 rifles.

I fired two five shot groups with each load for a total of 70 rns. that afternoon.

25/4895.....................Fair
40/4895.....................Very bad
15/4227.....................Good
24/4198.....................Fair
11/Unique..................Fair
15/4759.....................Excellent
30/Bl-C.......................Bad

I still remember that day at the range 44 years ago. I am glad I kept notes. I have keep records and notes on every round I have loaded since the first in 1959

BTW.. The first rounds loaded was for a Win. 94 takedown rifle.. 170 Hornaday FN/30/3031. The notes from 1959 indicate delight with the load, as it gave the same accuracy and POI as the 170 Winchester Silvertip factory ammo. This was January 1959.

[JeffinNZ]

HEY, that was 6 years before I was born![smilie=1: :twisted:

[Newtire]

HEY, that was 6 years before I was born![smilie=1: :twisted:


I was only 9. My first loads were with that same boolit only I didn't cast them myself. A buddy of mine presented me a cut off 1/2 gallon milk container stuffed with these all standing up and a little hollow point in each one. I shot them at 50 yds with 11-13 gr. Herco & Red Dot. Remember they were accurate and then went to hell at 13 gr. Funny, didn't load anymore cast real seriously until about 10yrs ago. Been hooked on them ever since!

[singleshotbuff]

10 years before me LOL (born in 73)


SSB

[drinks]

About 4 years after I started helping my cousin reload his Stevens .32 -20, 1955.
I made the bullets with my Grandpa's .31 Colt mold, ball and bullet combo and my cousin did the reloading with his grandpa's tong tool, later we swapped jobs.
I do not recall any 1" at 100yd groups, but a lot of cottontails and jacks bit the dust with the old Stevens.

[ktw]

I get the prize for being closest.

Within two weeks of the day I was born.

-ktw

[Char-Gar]

As if I wasn't feeling old enough.....

[jawjaboy]

As if I wasn't feeling old enough.....

Well....I was 14! [smilie=1:

[Phil]

Oh heck Chargar, cheer up. 1963 was three years after I graduated high school, a year before I went into the service. By 1963 I had already burned out several DCM 99 cent two groove barrels on my old DCM M03-A3, shooting mostly 17.5 grains of Unique behind the old M2 bullet. Wish I had that gun back, it was a Remington, serial number 3788894. I was also shooting a 7.7 Japanese rifle, cut down, with a 311467 bullet sized to .311, per the Lyman book of those days, fired by 50 grains of H4831. On a good day I could keep most of the rounds in the 200 yard black and really thought I knew something about shooting cast bullets! If I only knew then what I know now about bullet sizes and throat sizes! I can't remember that we got much bore leading but all the 7.7 Japanese rifles we cut down were the chrome lined jobs. Don't know if that made any difference or not. The M03-A3 cost something like $14.50 plus $4.85 for the Railway Express. Took about a year from submission of the order to delivery. We bought the newest, best quality, chrome lined Japanese 7.7's for about $10 because nobody wanted them. Started shooting air rifles and 22's in 1947, centerfires in 56 or 57, cast my first bullets about then. First j word match ammo I loaded was the ORIGINAL Sierra match bullet, the 180 grain Match King, fired by a Remington primer in a FA 57 Match case, 57 grains of IMR 4350. Those were the days!

Now, doesn't that make you feel younger? (:>)

Cheers,

Phil

[Junior1942]

One reason I like my recently acquired M38 Mosin-Nagant is that it was born the same year as me--1942. I don't really feel old until something happens like happened late yesterday afternoon down at the local honky tonk. The D-cup barmaid told me, "Junior, you're getting old."

[Char-Gar]

Phil and Jr... Well I will confess to being born in 1942 also and graduating from High School in 1960. I stared competition shooting (small bore) in 1954 and moved to high power in 1957. In 1958 I made my first trip to Camp Perry and shot with the big boys.

Like others I had one of those cheapo 03A3s from the DCM, that was the rifle I was shooting in 1963. I also had a good 03 I used for service rifle matches. I had another 03, with a long slide Lyman 48 on it.

I had some friends who were in the Texas National Guard and they "gifted" with cans of M2 ball in 250 rn. belts. Probalby about 20K rounds in all. I delinked the rounds burned up several 03A3 barrels. I think it was the third barrel in this Remington 03A3 that got used that day with 311413.

Those were different and in many ways better days. Today I am down to only 2 03A3s, plujs of course several score of other rifles.

[Phil]

Good Grief! We're all Old Farts! They were certainly different days and in MOST ALL ways better! I don't own an A3 anymore and tell the truth I don't think I could afford to buy one today. Especially to set it up the way I had my old one with a C stock and Lyman 48 and 17.

I never shot small bore competetively, just jumped into high power with club M1's in 56. That led to the A3 in 57. I used small bore as practice for long range tournaments. I never shot at Perry but lots of State Championships. The big reason is that I am really quite anti-social and don't like to be around big crowds. Also, although I really love to shoot, a two day tournament is starting to get boring about the middle of the second day, a three day tournament is intolerably boring, and shooting five days would make me seriously consider suicide. (:>)

Junior, how does that M38 shoot? I always wanted one but never could find one with a decent bore.

Cheers to the old guys, happy memories!!!!

Phil

[jawjaboy]

Well since I was 14 in '63, that put's me being born in '49. Does being born in the 40's qualify me for Old Fart membership?

[Phil]

ABSOLUTELY, and most welcome you are! The more the merrier. But, you have to be able to tell tall tales with the best of them. (:>)

Cheers,

Phil

[bishopgrandpa]

I will represent the 30's. Spent the late 50's in the pacific courtesy of uncle sam. Still roaming the Adirondacks with the 45-70 and enyoying every minute. A little white on top, but still have a few embers in the boiler.

[Junior1942]

Junior, how does that M38 shoot? I always wanted one but never could find one with a decent bore. It has a bore .316" across two grooves and .317" across the other two, and that way too big bore looks like emery paper--black & rough. However, it shoots fine after Buckshot taught me how to lap a Lee die and that I could then run a much larger bullet through it.

The 50 yard group below is with the Lyman #323471 8mm Mauser bullet ran through a Lee die reamed to .3155". I could have reamed the die to .317" but the .3155" bullets are a finger-press fit in fired cases. No case sizing required. No seater required either, but I use one anyway due to better precision. Actually, I use the seater phase of a whack-it 7.62x54R Lee Loader.

Velocity for the load below = 1821 fps.

http://www.castbullet.com/shooting/photos/mn01.jpg

[jawjaboy]

ABSOLUTELY, and most welcome you are! The more the merrier. But, you have to be able to tell tall tales with the best of them. (:>)

Cheers,

Phil

Thanks! Fair e'nuf. Did I ever tell y'all 'bout the time....................................:bigsmyl2:

[DLCTEX]

1963 was the year I went off into the world to rodeo full time. Spent 2 years at it and got 'er done. I was 18. Dale

[Kraschenbirn]

1963. Was a senior in high school and shooting on our Explorer post rifle team when I wasn't helping coach our Boy Scout smallbore team. Had a Mossberg 144 .22 and a Rock Island 03A1 with NM sights that I'd bought for $50 from one of our local Nat'l Guard guys. (Dang, I DO wish I had those two back!) Hadn't started casting or, even, reloading because we...the Boy Scouts and Explorers...got our ammunition through the local Guard battalion in exchange for helping to maintain their outdoor range (which they also let us use). Saddens me deeply to remember the 30-gal drums of '06, .45 ACP, and .30 Carbine that we swept off the firing line and sent to the scrapyard back then.

[bart55]

Sixty three ,I was reading Keith and Jack O'Connor ,couldn't make up my mind if I needed a 270 or a 45 70 ,wound up with both but my first cast rifle was a 99 savage in 22 hi power bought it that year (13 years old) with nutcracker and an old ideal mold .and sixty cases might have paid 35 dollars . Trappin money ,shoveling snow etc . I bought it on the way home from school and carried it a mile hhome. Nobody even thought it was strange. try that now!!!!!!!

[Poygan]

1963 was the year I decided to give the USAF a try. Kept trying it until summer of 1984....

[Char-Gar]

Phil... I can't resist it.. here is my lastest toy. S-C 03A3 with a spanking new 4 groove barrel built up in NRA Sporter style. Lyman 48 long slide rear and Redfield Sordough Patridge front. Shoots as good as it looks..

[TAWILDCATT]

a bunch of youngsters!!! my first rifle was a 73 win in 32/20 borrowed from a friend and the win tool and mold.used to shoot in and abandond quarry.also in high school range.30 cents hundred for primers.used powder from pulled 30/06.one day I shot in the firestation range and caught the floor on fire(unburned powder)lucky I did not blow the gun up.I'v still got mold and tool.
cheers

[Phil]

TAWILDCATT,

Ha! We just keep flushing 'em out of the woodwork! Well, don't stop in mid-tale, you still have the mold and tool, WHAT ABOUT THE RIFLE? Don't leave us hanging man, finish the story, what happened to the rifle? (:>)

Chargar,

Now you're breaking my heart! Beautiful rifle! Is that a reproduction stock? It sure is a beautiful piece of wood my friend. And where did you get the barrel band? I have an 03 action and several new, in the wrap, SC barrels and some stock blanks that have been drying for almost thirty years now. If I could find someone to turn it to SA Sporter specs I'd sure like to build a repro Sporter. One of my all time favorite rifles. Along with the M2 .22 caliber rifle. Now if a guy just had a pair of those......................................

Cheers guys,

Phil

[Newtire]

I bought it on the way home from school and carried it a mile hhome. Nobody even thought it was strange. try that now!!!!!!!

Remember hitchhiking (which was technically against the law) back in Illinois carrying a 12 ga. single-shot broke in half back in 1960. Walking home with a limit of squirrels and a .410 (in the case). My buddy brought his .22 to school & checked it in with our principal in the 7th grade so we could go rabbit hunting after school. These days if a kid gets caught carrying say ammo even and his folks will make the national news. Funny world.

[Char-Gar]

Phil.. the rifle stock is from Great American Gunstock Co. They can turn your blank to either NRA Sporter of M2 (22. lr.) configuration. The only difference is the M2 has finger grooves on the foreend and the NRA Sporter does not. Be sure and tell them which you want and be specific about the finger grooves or not.

The barrel band was the biggest problem. It uses the same band as the M2. However the band used on the Springfield "T" target rifles is the same size. After a long search, I ended up with both a M2 and T band. I went with the T band as it was heavier being reshaped at Springfield from a P1917 Enfield.middle band.

Oh yes, the NRA Sporter and the M2 use the same butt plates and they are not hard to come by. Last time I checked Gun Parts had them. I also sent the butt plate to Great AMerican Gunstocks for them to install as I wanted a longer 14" pull. I could have done it myself, but for $25 buck, I thought I would let them worry with it.

Sorry, but I sold the M2 band a year of so ago.

These bands are out there, but it will take some looking and probably some time for one to turn up.

The 03A3 can be turned into a very slick and pretty action, but be prepared to spend some fime filing and polishing off the tool marks. This is all hand work.

I also ground off most of the rear sight dovetail. You can leave it on, abd the the rear sight will supress far enough for any cast bullet use, but should you ever want to shoot condum bullets, the rear sight will be too high. I just ground it off before the metal was blued. I have also seen the rear receiver bridge on the 03A3 respaped to the 03 configuration, but I didn't do that. I don't trust my skill level with a hand grinder enough to do that.

I hand polished all of metal down to a 600 grit, including taking off all the tool marks from the barrel. I then had Accuracy Plating and Weaponry do their "Brushed 400 grit" blue job. It works perfectly.

I also changed out the front sight barrel and with an 03 band. Of course I went with a milled 03 trigger guard and floor plate.

I glass bedded the action and the first 1" of the barrel.

The whole project turned out quite nice.

My current project is a Bob Owen style Mauser sporter built on a Brno Persian 98/29 barrel action. It is just a hair from the shooting state and then I will do the final detailing, and finishing of wood and metal.

Next in line is a sporter Krag based on old Griffin and Howe lines. I have a 1901 vintage Krag action at my gunsmith now being rebarreld with a 2 groove Remington 03A3 barrel.

All of these rifles wear good vintage click adjustable Lyman or Redfield rear peep sights.

Lots of good fun and it keeps me out of bars, pool halls and from chasing long legged dancing girls. Well, the Beloved Redhead keep me from the dancing girls, she is tought on that issue.

Good luck... Charles

[Char-Gar]

Newtire and bart... I remember riding public buses with a Winchester 52 rifle on the way to shooting matchs in the mid 502. The rifle was uncovered and held between my knees.

A friend brought his dad's 1911 pistol to high school for a Speech class where you had to a demonstation. He demonstrated how to field strip the 45 Autopistol. Nobody raised an eyebrow.

Yep..things have changed. Today you would have a SWAT team all over you and you would be charged and labeled a dangerous troubled misfit.

[Depreacher]

In 1963 at the ripe old age of 20, I made one of my best shots ever with my O3A3 (the one I am shooting now). My first cousin (who was county sheriff at the time) drove me and the postmaster out to the oilfields about 3 miles north of our small town. He saw a buzzard sitting on the very top rail of an oil derrick about 400 yards away. He stopped and said "you're so good see if you can hit that. I slid the sight up to 400, leaned over the roof of his car and squeezed off a M2 military round (this isn't a cast boolit story). The buzzard sat motionless momentarily, then slowly rolled forward and hung by its feet for 3 maybe 4 seconds before he dropped. I assumed I would get complimented, but instead got "cussed out" all the way back to town. Preacher ps. Never shot that far before with any rifle. Just a kid luck shot.

[rvpilot76]

These days if a kid gets caught carrying say ammo even and his folks will make the national news. Funny world.

Actually, not funny. SAD. I remember when I was in high school (mid 90's) keeping our rifles in the truck to go deer hunting after school got out at 3:00. I'm disgusted at the direction our elected officials and lawyers have taken this country.

I guess I'm the youngest poster so far at age 30. I'm a bi-centennial baby.

Kevin

[PAT303]

Alot of blokes I shoot with used to be in the army cadets and used to take there lee enfields home and catch the train early the next morning out to the camps and no one would bat an eyelid,people look at you strange if you carry a toy gun out of a shop nowday's.

[Char-Gar]

RVpilot... Don't get to spun up about the change. If I have learned anything in life, it is that things will change. There is not sense trying to fight against it or assign blame. The only thing that doesn't change is the fact there will be change.

Oh yes.. My son was born in 76 as well.

[rvpilot76]

RVpilot... Don't get to spun up about the change. If I have learned anything in life, it is that things will change. There is not sense trying to fight against it or assign blame. The only thing that doesn't change is the fact there will be change.

Oh yes.. My son was born in 76 as well.

Please don't think I'm flaming you, but who should get the blame? The one's who make the laws or the one's who twist them to get what they want? Seems like an open and shut case to me as both are guilty. Not spun up; not yet anyway. :mad:

[Char-Gar]

RVpilot.. Change is going to happen in one form or another and there is no sense trying to assign blame. Assigning blame does bad things to the soul and spirit. It makes you a victum and not in charge of your life and in causes anger and resentment, both of which put a fierce tear in your Karma bag.

[obssd1958]

RVpilot.. Change is going to happen in one form or another and there is no sense trying to assign blame. Assigning blame does bad things to the soul and spirit. It makes you a victum and not in charge of your life and in causes anger and resentment, both of which put a fierce tear in your Karma bag.

Sometimes we are compelled to say, do, or write things, not knowing who we are going to reach...
You're comment above hits right in the ten ring in my current situation.

Sincerely - Thank you.



Back on topic - not the youngest, nor blessed with the experience of those not so young, but enjoying just where I am!!:drinks:

Don

[rvpilot76]

Hey, I've seen your license plate in CDA. Nice to know someone close to home that's here too.

Kevin

[obssd1958]

You sure that wasn't in or around Boise??
I haven't been to CDA for a few years or so, and haven't been any further north than Kooskia or Kamiah (just north of Grangeville) in the past year.
Don't get me wrong! If I make it up to CDA, I will definitely look you up. Nothing like having a local show you the best places to shoot and hunt!!
And if you ever head south to Boise, give me a holler - I'm sure we could find something that we have in common to talk about![smilie=1:

Take care!

Don

[rvpilot76]

Well, I'll be! There is another guy with almost that same exact plate! I'll keep you in mind if I make it down south this year. The same offer is extended to you if you make it up this way. Good talkin' to 'ya.

Kevin