Dillon and Varget

[45-70bpcr]

Just bought a 550b and curious what others are seeing when using Varget? I am getting .5 to 1 full grain variations routinely and sometimes up to 2 grains between charges. Is there a technique involved for extruded's or is it just me? What should I expect when I try my 4064?

Thanks for any help.

[Kevin Rohrer]

Try this:

1. Filler the hopper up to the top or near it.
2. Tap the hopper a few times w/ your hand to settle the powder.
3. Pause at the top of your stroke to allow the powder chamber to completely empty.

Am guessing you are using a Dillon measure. I will check mine w/ Varget and 4064 when I get home this afternoon and post my results.

[Alvarez Kelly]

It is well known that the Dillon powder measures do not meter the long extruded powders well.

You must switch powders or switch measures.

[45-70bpcr]

It is well known that the Dillon powder measures do not meter the long extruded powders well.

You must switch powders or switch measures.

Well that's not good news for the 4064 but Varget is not a long extruded powder

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

There are some tuning tips for the Dillon measures posted over on AR15.com While they may or may not cure your variability problem completely with that powder, they should help. They're posted as a sticky in the reloading section there.

[45-70bpcr]

Thanks for all the tips. Hopefully I can make it work better

[Kevin Rohrer]

I checked the Dillon powder measure using both Varget and IMR4064. I didn't use a particular setting. Instead, I took ten readings with each powder and looked at the spread:

Varget
13.5
13.5
13.4
13.5
13.3
13.9
13.6
13.3
13.2
13.4
As you can see, there was a spread of .7gr. I experienced a little resistance due to the measure cutting grains.

IMR4064
12.9
13.2
12.6
13.9
12.4
13.2
12.8
12.8
11.8
13.3
Range of .9gr. I experienced extensive cutting that made cycling the press difficult.

Next I decided to check these two powders using my choice of measures when using the Dillon to load rifle calibers: the Quick-Measure. It uses a semi-fixed drop tube similar to the tried and true Belding & Mull.

Q-M Varget
42.6
42.6
42.7
42.5
42.7
42.5
42.5
42.6
42.6
42.6
There was a range of .3gr and no cutting.

Q-M 4064
39.6
39.7
39.9
39.6
39.3
39.5
39.6
39.6
39.7
39.9
There was a range of .6gr and no cutting. I believe the 39.3 to be an anomaly, but included it anyway.

Lastly, I tried 4064 in my old Hollywood measure that uses a normal, rotary drum.

Hollywood: IMR4064
15.0
14.7
14.9
14.8
14.5
14.9
14.7
14.5
14.7
15.0
There was a range of .5gr and only a slight amount of cutting.

Draw your own conclusions, but it appears that the Dillon with the sliding powder does a poor job with stick powders, while the Q-M does a very good job.

[wrench man]

Are you working the press aggressively!? I load 4064 on my 550B and only get a variance of about .3grn?, I do weigh and top off each and every charge with stick powders.
Is your press a new one with the return linkage?, or the old style with the springs?, from what I've gathered the old style aren't as accurate as the new linkage style?

[Kevin Rohrer]

I have an old one. Since the powder bar is what measures and holds the powder, how do the springs affect accuracy?

[wrench man]

It's my understanding that "consistency" in operating the measure is the key, and the springs didn't/don't return the charge bar as precisely as the return linkage does, the linkage also gives the hopper quite a jiggle with each stroke, IIRC they also changed the charge bars slightly too, that may have something to do with it?
4064 is notoriously one of, if not the most difficult to throw consistent charges of, and as I said above I rarely exceed a .3grn variance with 4064, I spill more of it not waiting for it to fill into 22-250 cases!

[Kevin Rohrer]

Seeing the numbers spread using Dillon's measure validates my decision to go with the Q-M for rifle reloading.

[45-70bpcr]

Seeing the numbers spread using Dillon's measure validates my decision to go with the Q-M for rifle reloading.

Kevin,

Thanks for your efforts with the different powders and measures. My Dillon measures are new but old style with the spring returns. I did some more playing with it and read and found true that when you hit the top of the stroke with the ram to not baby it and hit it kind of hard. I give it a couple seconds to drop the powder. It doesn't work like my redding br3 but it is I think acceptable at least.

[StratsMan]

Personally, I won't use stick powders with the Dillon powder measure... Too much variation... so I bought their powder measure adapter to put my Redding powder measure on my 550B...

http://www.dillonprecision.com/#/content/p/9/pid/23634/catid/3/Powder_Measure_Adapter

Slows down my processing a little bit when using Varget, but the loads are more consistent... Even with this, I still wait an extra beat for all the powder to drop...

[Alvarez Kelly]

I have an extra one of those Dillon powder measure adapters if anyone wants one. I don't think it was ever used. Looks brand new. $20 shipped to your door (in the lower 48 anyway...)

FYI, you need the 450 style powder die with a set screw if you plan to use the adpater and your favorite "not" Dillon powder measure.

[Daddyfixit]

I got one of these and it works great!
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/591344/hornady-case-activated-powder-drop