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View Full Version : Reloading brass shotshells???



buck1
03-25-2007, 11:42 PM
HELP! i dont know where to ask this so I'll try here, you guys help me with everything else!
I am thinking of starting to load my own shot shells. I dont shoot a shotgun all that much but I have a nice Ruger O/U that I do enjoy chasing the birdies with.
and to make sure its complicated , I want to load BRASS SHOT SHELLS (smokeless).
But I can not find hardly anything on the subject. Chances are one of us has done some checking in to this and could offer some baddly needed advice.
Any help would be great! Thanks.......Buck

klw
03-26-2007, 12:06 AM
There are two sources for the brass shotgun shells and the tools to load them,

http://www.rockymountaincartridge.com/ and
http://www.hammerdouble.com/index.html

I've bought both. Interesting equipment.

Look carefully at the kind of primers you want to use. Not all of these are loaded with shotgun primers. Don't remember which is which but pay attention to that point.

If you want to add something really unusual look for British style 1870 vintage shotgun tools on e-bay. They do not show up very often but they sure are unusual.

Finally just recently RCBS introduced a die for loading brass shells.

Dale53
03-26-2007, 12:22 AM
The first thing you need is to know is "Where do I get the proper components?"

That would be "Ballistic Products";
http://shop2.mailordercentral.com/bpicart/

Brass shotshells are thinner than either paper or plastic. They require larger wads to properly fit (11 gauge for 12 gauge shells).

You will get better results using a plastic over powder wad than straight paper "Nitro over powder wads". The nitro wads are not nearly so consistent as the plastic overpowder wads are simply because the plastic wads, with their "skirts" obturate MUCH better. However, this will not necessarily apply to black powder loads as they do not have the ignition problems that smokeless powder can.

I would suggest that you call Ballistic products and ask if they have a manual on loading brass shells.

Brass shells are "cool" but after loading many, many different types of brass, paper, and plastic. There is nothing like a good paper or plastic shell loaded on a shotshell loader. Brass shells typically cannot be run through a full length sizer on a standard press. This means you have to use the shell that is originally fired in YOUR shotgun (different shotguns have different chamber sizes and a shell that is expanded TOO much will not fit a smaller chamber).

There are tools on the market that will full length resize in a strong press (like a RCBS single stage Rock Chucker press) but, in my opinion, it is absolutely NOT worth the effort.

I HAVE also loaded black powder brass shells. I find them MUCH easier to get good results. However, they are a "one at a time proposition" and rather slow to load.

A lot of brass shells have a large rifle primer pocket. I find that those primers are really border line for loading with smokeless. There have been some brass shells with shotshell primer pockets and they are considerably better. Frankly, I now consider all of this with brass pretty much a waste of time. More or less kind of going to a costume party pretending that you are a pirate, or something:mrgreen:0.

All of the above is just my opinion, but was arrived at by FINALLY successfully learning how to load consistent, reliable, ballistic results with brass shells (with both smokeless AND black powder). Then determining that this is little more than a stunt...

Dale53

woody1
03-26-2007, 07:15 PM
buck1, Check out this site for wads. Also might want to read Shop Talk there. http://www.circlefly.com/index.html

Regards, Woody

Buckshot
03-26-2007, 07:31 PM
................Brass shotgun shells are available from Graf & Son and Midway to name 2 I know about. These are made by CBC in Brazil and sold as Mag-Tech. They take rifle primers. I use their 24ga shells to make 577 Snider brass, and the 32 ga to make brass for my 11.4x42R Comblain.

http://www.fototime.com/7C6776752B29618/standard.jpg
These are the 32 ga shells.

http://www.fototime.com/D41D95B7168B29D/standard.jpg
The 24ga as a 577 Snider

Before these came with the Boxer primeing they used a really BAD Berdan cap which pierced if you looked at them hard. At the time I was converting them to use the 209 shotshell primer.

http://www.fototime.com/FB833F810B2C0FE/standard.jpg
Here's a couple Comblain rounds and the 209 shotshell primer. Very easy to convert and I never had any issues using them. It does require manual de-and repriming.

.................Buckshot

klw
03-26-2007, 08:27 PM
........

Here's a couple Comblain rounds and the 209 shotshell primer. Very easy to convert and I never had any issues using them. It does require manual de-and repriming.

.................Buckshot

Information on the Comblain would certainly be interesting.

BAGTIC
03-26-2007, 10:55 PM
PLEASE tell us more about your .577 Snyder.

What loads, bullet weights, ballistics?

Are you shooting an original Snyder rifle?

buck1
03-27-2007, 12:14 AM
WOW! Thanks for the great replys great opinionns and lots of help!!! :)

omgb
03-27-2007, 01:16 AM
Buck1, what do you want to know about loading brass shells? I have been loading them for years. First and foremost, unless you are loading BP brass hulls are far more trouble than they are worth. That being said, if you must then know this:

1. You will need three kinds of wads: over powder, lubed compression, and over shot. These need to be 11 gauge not 12. Brass hulls are thinner and therefore require larger wads.

2. Brass hulls usually use large pistol primers. Do not use large rifle primers. LRPs are too hard and a shotgun firing pin will not reliably set them off. Been there, done that. If you are using BP, a LPP will more than get the job done.

3. Deprime with a tool made from a wood dowel just small enough to enter the case and a small nail driven into one end and a hole drilled into the other just big enough to allow the primer pocket to rest in it when it is inserted into the case. Set the case over a block of wood that has a center hole drilled in it for the primer to drop into. Insert the tool nail end down and using a plastic hammer, drive out the old primer. Now reprime by setting a primer anvil up on a flat part of the block and set the case over it. Insert the other end of the dowel, hole side down over the primer pocket. A few firm taps will set the primer.

4. Measure out 90-110 grains of 2F BP. (90 grains is about a 3 dram load and will give you about 1200 fps with 11/8 oz of shot. Pour this into the case.

5, Set an over powder wad on this and using the dowel, press it home snug.

6. Place a lubed cushion wad down on the powder wad. You will have to experiment to see how many of these you need but in the end, after the shot is added, you need to be about 1/8 from the mouth of the case.

7. Add your shot charge.

8. Put an over shot card on the shot and press down firmly. Now mark the card with a Sharpie indicating the load and top the wad with enough Elmer's White School Glue to cover the card wad and partially fill the case. Set aside to dry.

That's it. After firing, be sure to wash the case in hot soapy water and to dry completely before reloading.

Since these cases are not sized, (that is a whole other deal in itself) they will work in just one gun; the gun they were first used in.

Wad pressure is not important with BP, neither is a crimp or much else. The Elmer's will dry clear and it will easily blow out of the case upon ignition.

John Taylor
03-27-2007, 09:22 AM
I haven't done any brass shot shell loading but plan on making the 70-150 Winchester up when I get time. I have a bunch of the Russian steel 12 gauge shells and plan on changing them over to take standard primers. This is going to be a slow proses as the tooling need to be made as I go. Starting with barrel reamers then a cutter box of proper size for the rifling machine to get the barrel. First barrel will be tested on an old single shot but the long range plan is to make a rifle out of an 1897 Winchester with a full length magazine. Hope to be able to hold around 10 rounds in the mag which will add a few pounds to the gun but it will get lighter as it is shot. Should be fun at the cowboy shoots.

OMGB, thanks for the glue idea

Buckshot
03-28-2007, 01:25 AM
............klw, I did a 4 part thing on the Comblain almost exactly 2 years ago.

Part 1: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=502&highlight=Comblain

Part 2: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=503&highlight=Comblain

Part 3:http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=504&highlight=Comblain

Part 4:http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=505&highlight=Comblain

................BAGTIC: I'm no expert on the Snider by any stretch of the imagination :-) Most everything I know about it came from the fine folks over at the British and Militaria forums at:

http://pub182.ezboard.com/bbritishmilitariaforums

I was given a Snider carbine and at:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=5980&highlight=Snider

I noted what I had to do to it, and then further down the thread are some photo's of it. A real gas to shoot!

.................Buckshot

KCSO
03-28-2007, 10:52 PM
I have an article coming out in The Shootist magazine on loading brass shotshells and it covers most of the basics and has photo's of the tools. I just bought a complete set of loading tools for brass cases made by Bridgport in the 1890's these are still in the box with papers and have never been used. I will try and photo them tomorrow and post if anyone is interested. Other than a wad guide and a re and de capper you don't need much else for B/P loads with brass cases. My first set of tools were hand made by my grandfather about 1906 and are still being used.

klw
03-28-2007, 11:34 PM
Looked for a Comblain for a long time without finding one. Well, without finding one at anything other than a HUGE price tag. Also never figured out how to tell which of the various cartridges a given gun was chambered in. And then there is the problem of getting dies and brass. They are made for at least of the possible cartridges but not all of them.

Thanks for the references.