Question for machinists re: an RCBS 4x4

[MikeyPooh]

So, I'm new to reloading and am perfectly happy using my old single stage press, and frankly don't see myself ever needing a progressive.

I bought a box of reloading stuff a few years ago on craigslist and got an RCBS 4x4 progressive in the mix. I love the press, stout as all get out, but hate the wacky linkages and also have no desire to track down a bunch of shellplates for it.

I've seen the CH 444 H-press and like that - and it seems more my speed. And then I had an AH-HA! moment. (look out!)

Here's a pic so you'll know what I'm talking about:

http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/846/img6003r.jpg


So I'm thinking it should be possible to make a new part that either replaces the shellplate, or the shellplate holder - something that would allow me to just pop in standard shellholders. Does anyone think this is feasible? Any idea of who could do something like that? Any idea of the cost of a job like that? Or is it just a stupid idea for some reason I haven't thought of?

Thanks

[drhall762]

I think it boils down to setting down and doing some measurements. Could it be done. Probably. Actually sounds like a good idea to me. Looks like the shellplate holder may be thick enough. Most likely a machinist will quote it at an hourly rate for design and machine work. I would unless I was doing it for myself. Basically have to replicate the attachment on the single station ram 4 times.

[dnotarianni]

why not sell it and get something like a T-Mag?
dave

[1bluehorse]

Not sure if you're talking a single shell holder as like in an auto indexing turret (I think someone makes one of those for about 80 bucks) or four shell holders (@ six bucks apiece which would cost about the same as the 4x4 shellplates do) so since you asked, and using your words not mine, I think it's a stupid idea. Those were pretty good presses as they are and the shellplates are easy to come by and run 25 to 30 bucks each... if you don't want to use it as designed then I agree, sell it and buy a turret press..

[wcp4570]

For many years I was satisfied using my RCBS RC press to load all my rifle and pistol ammo. Well my son bought a Dillon 650 with all the bells and whistles but didn't have time to load between work, kids, and manages a 4H shooting sports club. I am now retired and have time to tinker so I moved the press over to my house and learned to use the progressive reloading process. I now keep myself, son, and 2 grandchildren in pistol ammo. I am now sold on progressive reloading presses. I can load a 100 rounds of pistol ammo quicker than I can resize 100 rounds in the single stage press.

You have a great progressive press to learn on. I recommend that you get one shell holder for a caliber you shoot the most and learn to use the press as it was designed to be used in stead of trying to make the press do something it was not designed to do. You may be surprised at how much ammo you can quickly turn out. If it turns out that you just don't like it, then you can sale or trade it here on this site for something more fitting to your liking.

wcp

[MikeyPooh]

four shell holders (@ six bucks apiece which would cost about the same as the 4x4 shellplates do) so since you asked, and using your words not mine, I think it's a stupid idea. Those were pretty good presses as they are and the shellplates are easy to come by and run 25 to 30 bucks each... if you don't want to use it as designed then I agree, sell it and buy a turret press..


Well, yes I was thinking of something that would let me pop in 4 shell holders.... can get a set of 11 shell holders from Lee for about $25 - buy 4 sets and then I can load about 100 calibers for $100 - that is what I was thinking about... plus the one time I looked for these shell plates I think they ran about $40-45 apiece from RCBS... or maybe that was the Ebay price I saw... depending on the machining costs I think may idea might still be the more economical way to be able to load a nice variety of cartridges, although a bit slower but I can live with that.

But yes I was thinking of trying to sell it, which is why I was actually taking pictures of the thing when I had my brainstorm, lol. I'll let this thread go for awhile and see what I can see before deciding thanks guys :)

[W.R.Buchanan]

Mikey: First, you're problably not going to load all 100 calibers. Second, certain shell plates will load many standard calbers like .308,.30-06, 7/8mm etc. There is about 50-60 cartridges that use that same rim configuration.

There is essentially 4 different bolt faces for bolt action rifles, and the one that swallows cartridge rims of 12 MM (.468-473) IE Mauser style, is by far the most common. Point being you can probably get buy with only 2-3 shell holders, as you're not going to progressive all of your ammo.

I have a C&H 444 press and I do all of my Rifle and some Pistol cartridge loading on it. I have several sets of Lee shell holders, so far I have only used 2-3 of them, and the common 12mm ones get used the most. I break down cases on my Rockchucker so I don't use but 3 shell holders at one time for loading rounds. Drop powder , seat bullet and crimp in 3 separate operations.

If I was you I would find shell plates for the cartridges I load most, as you don't need to use a progressive press to load 20 rounds of some types of ammo you won't use that much of. That way you keep the progressive for longer runs od ammo, and use other tools for short runs.

This is what I do. I have 2 Dillon SDB's set up for .40 S&W and .45 ACP that stay set up for those cartridges. I shoot more of those calibers than all other put together. I am looking for a Dillon 650 to load .223's on as I shoot alot of them also.

For all of my other rifle cartridges I break down on the Rock Chuck, and load on the C&H.

This way I use the appropriate tool for the given job and things flow smoothly.

Now I could load .223's on my C&H also but moving the case 3 times for each round would get old after about 100 rounds and I need to load 300-400 at one sitting, so a progressive is the way to go.

I suggest you keep the RCBS press for long runs and buy a C&H too! That way you've got everything covered.

Randy

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Looking at the press, I see you already own one shell plate. I can't see if you also have the priming mechanism for the press. I see the press is a four hole press and from the looks of it, it's auto advance.

If you load a cartridge that uses that shell plate and you load it in a decent volume, I would set the press up to load that one single cartridge. Why? Because it doesn't have a quick die change setup and you're not familiar with the press.

If you don't have a cartridge that shell plate fits, sell that shell plate or trade it for a pistol cartridge you do reload a large volume of or want to, like .45ACP. Get a set of Lee or good used dies. Get a setup for powder through expansion with powder measure to automate your power drops. If you have or can locate a working primer system, get that back on the press and running.

Once the press is assembled to reload one caliber, clean it up, lube it, get it adjusted to run smoothly and load that one caliber. Once you've done that, you'll know if you like progressive reloading.

If the press works well for you, then you could drill and tap the die holes to accept Hornady LnL bushings. This would give you the capability to quickly change out your dies. You could then buy more shell plates and add calibers.

It looks like the press used buttons like a Dillon press to retain the cases. You could have them made or take measurements and see if Dillon buttons fit.

[dragonrider]

I think it can be done but it will be more work than it is worth.

[milprileb]

There is nothing wrong with that RCBS press. Shell plates are inexpensive. If its more press than you need, sell it and go buy a Co Ax which will eliminate any and all shell holder issues entirely.

My Course of Action #1: Stay the course with that Press
My Course of Action #2: Go back to C/A #1

[1bluehorse]

One more thing to consider. If the press isn't complete AND RCBS still has parts in stock for that press you can contact them and more than likely they will send you what you need at no cost. Thats worth a shot..a lot of those still in use.

[milprileb]

My parts catalog indicates they got parts on hand

[thehouseproduct]

Perhaps it might be slightly easier to make it similar to a Dillon 450/550 rather than making a custom shellholder shellplate. All you would need to do is disable the auto index feature and make some sort of star attachment to make turning the shellplate easier.

[Sonnypie]

When I set up my RCBS Auto 4X4 last year I needed a shell plate for 45 ACP. (#3)
I just called RCBS and had the Shell plate in two days for $50 +/-. They said it would take longer, but I think they found one in stock. (I think the part was $46 + shipping)
Yours has a bunch of things removed, as it sits. Looks like someone mechanically challenged took it apart and said, "DUH!"

http://www.rcbs.com/downloads/instructions/4x4ProgressiveReloadingPressInstructions.pdf

I can use every faction of mine. But prefer to hand prime my cases.

[MikeyPooh]

Thanks for all the input guys.. the more I thought about it, the less sense my idea made... heh.

What's the point of putting 200 some dollars into this thing to make it more like I want it when I could just take the $200 and start with something new... and sell this one.

Yeah it does have the 38/357 shellplate in it, and I do own two .357's so concentrating on that one to learn it would perhaps be a good option.

Oh, yeah, the reason why it's all stripped apart, I did take it all apart to clean it and lube it. When I bought it it had been sitting in a cardboard box in a basement for several years. I have all the parts and can put it back together! (I think, lol)

[GT1]

There is a vid on the tube of a guy running that press for .44. It looks to run pretty fair.

I'd give it a go if I had it, and RCBS is pretty awesome for fixing one up if they still have parts for whatever..

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

With that set of instructions SonnyPie provided a link to, it looks like you're good to go. I would certainly set it up to reload .38/357 and see what kind of results I got. I'm betting once fully cleaned up and tuned, it'll run good. You'll just need to be patient and ask questions on the forum here if you get stuck.