Newbie to casting, introduction and..need some advice.

[Kansas Ed]

Hello All,

To start with, I shoot a lot of odd and obsolete. 25-20SS, 40-82. 38-72, 40-72 etc. But my latest project is a Browning 1886 that I'm having rechambered to 50-100-450. In the past, with a little searching I can usually find someone who makes a decent cast bullet similar to what I'm looking for...not so with the big 50. Since I had been given a Lyman furnace, and had some of the basics, I ordered a mould similar to the original 450gr Winchester bullet from Accurate Molds. Casting with Lyman #2 was pretty basic. Careful fluxing and attention to temperatures produces a very nice bullet. My problem lies in the lube process. My intent btw is to drive these up to about 1600fps give or take 100.

Searching around and reading on lubes (I have LLA but wasn't convinced). I ran across some recipes for home made lubes. I did a 1:1 mix of high pressure grease, and beeswax. It ended up about the consistency of Crisco. So I added more beeswax until it ended up about as hard and firm as KiWi shoe polish in the little round cans. I've tried pan lubing, but the lube has a tendency to break away near the bullets, even though it's relatively pliable, and pull the lube out of the grooves. I can, with firm thumb pressure force the lube back in the grooves, and then size. Sure seems like a lot of work to get 100 bullets, as I pretty much have to do each bullet this way. Is the lube too hard, too soft, or do I just need to use the LLA? Any advice here? I'm not excited about buying a lubrisizer right now.

Thanks,
Ed

[fryboy]

many folks use a kake cutter type tool to cut the lubed boolits out , personally i've had the best luck with the "whack it crack it "method ,
http://goatlipstips.cas-town.com/panlubing.html
actually the lee liquid alox works tolerably fair tho i personally detest the umm aroma :P much better IMHO is recluse's excellent recipe
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=67654
alot of what you end up with depends upon the grease used , some brands work better than others , another trick is to add a lil lanolin USP to add flex and tack ( helping it stay in the grooves better , g'luck amigo and welcome to the forum !

[tcbnick]

Try preheating your boolits before pouring in the melted lube, it made alot of differance in my pan lubing. I also just pan lube a few at a time, like 5 or 10, just to see how my new lube mix works in the pan lubing process.

[runfiverun]

a combination of the lanolin and heating the boolits should do the trick.
using a cake cutter will help force the lube into the grooves and keep it from breaking into chunks.
you can make a cake cutter from a golf club handle [shaft whatever] just cut it off at the appropriate diameter and champher the inside.

[randyrat]

I learned how to "dip lube" bullets, because that's all I had.. a lube machine was way out of line, too much money.


Dip lubing;

- Melt your lube so it is just melted.
-Heat your bullets so they are hot to the touch, in a pan or oven, electric, gas range or hot plate.Keep them hot to the touch.
- Lay out a paper towel to wipe the bottom of the bullets off. also lay out some wax paper to set the bullets on after you dip them.
- Using a needle nose pliers grab each bullet by nose and dip to the last lube groove
-wipe the bottom off and set it on the wax paper, standing up right

The trick is to keep your bullets hot...Too cool and too much lube will stick to the bullets- they will look like a chocolate covered ice cream cone. Practice makes perfect lubed bullets. You can do a bunch real fast with a little organized set up and practice.

[ltclark]

When I lube boolits I use a pan with lube in it from which I have already cut out lubed boolits - the holes are there for new unlubed boolits to fit into - once all the holes are filled with unlubed boolits (standing up for easy cutting) I put it on a heat source and heat the boolits and lube together - add more lube if needed - once the whole thing is heated and all the lube is melted I take the pan off the heat and let it cool until the lube is solidified. I like to cut the boolits out before totally cooled - while the lube is still a little soft.

[cajun shooter]

Look at the lube receipes if you want to make some good lube. You did not say if you were firing the real gun powder or that new stuff they call smokeless.
A easy way to lube with the standard type of lube is by pan lubing as the bullets are heated with the lube.
Buckshot of this forum makes the best Kate cutters for cutting out the bullets. It makes it fun instead of a chore. His are knurled and long enough to hold and they are hollow steel so that the bullets just come out the top. Lanolin will help in your lube and may be purchased along with other lube supplies from Randy Rat.

[mdi]

With some of the lubes I like, bullets don't "push out" successfully; lube won't stick in the grooves (I've used lubes that will allow "push out", but they aren't my favorites). I've added lanolin and I usually heat the lube and bullets together and I've tried pushing at different lube temps. So I just use a cutter, no big deal for me. I made some from stainless steel tubing and reamed the ID to .003" to .005" larger than cast diameter. The tubes are about 6" long which is comfortable and will hold 5 or 6 bullets before emptying...

[Kansas Ed]

Well folks, I appreciate all the replies. Good information in all of that. I lubed two more pans worth this weekend...about 60 bullets total. I used a small plastic hammer and "Whacked" each one to break it free from the lube as previously suggested. This worked about 80% of the time which is much better than before. Prior to that I tried using the ALOX to size and seat gas checks...not a good solution, as it took all 220lbs of my body weight on the press to do that. (first time out with gas check crimping/sizing). So I went back to the home made lube, and the pan. They size much much easier with the other lube. My recipe for the lube was as stated before ended up about 2 parts beeswax and 1 part red high pressure grease. I'm thinking with a little experimentation as outlined above I'll get closer to the 100% yield out of this. I'm also going to make the cookie cutter deal too. Now if the rifle would get here so I can start shooting!!

Ed

[mdi]

Well folks, I appreciate all the replies. Good information in all of that. I lubed two more pans worth this weekend...about 60 bullets total. I used a small plastic hammer and "Whacked" each one to break it free from the lube as previously suggested. This worked about 80% of the time which is much better than before. Prior to that I tried using the ALOX to size and seat gas checks...not a good solution, as it took all 220lbs of my body weight on the press to do that. (first time out with gas check crimping/sizing). So I went back to the home made lube, and the pan. They size much much easier with the other lube. My recipe for the lube was as stated before ended up about 2 parts beeswax and 1 part red high pressure grease. I'm thinking with a little experimentation as outlined above I'll get closer to the 100% yield out of this. I'm also going to make the cookie cutter deal too. Now if the rifle would get here so I can start shooting!!

Ed
I think I'd be looking for a reason that it's that hard to size yer bullets. Measured before sizing? How much are you dropping the OD? I don't have any probs sizing (I sit and use one hand) and occationally I'll reduce the bullet .003" while applying a cascheck (Lyman429244 and Ranch Dog's 265 gr. .44). I've used xlox, Mink Oil Boot Dressing, and diluted Lee case lube for sizing lube. I have noticed though, my die will collect a lot ot excess lube when I size pan lubed bullets. Easy to clean out; just run a bore brush through it a couple times...

[Kansas Ed]

Well, I'm only sizing down about .0025". From .514 to .5115. As I stated before, it's no problem to size and crimp the checks on with the home built lube. I also tried some lanolin/Castor oil mix I have for case reforming, which was no issue either...but the ALOX required unreasonable amounts of pressure. Even when wet. Maybe I'm wrong, but this sure seems to point to the lubricity rather than a mechanical interference of some sort. I had also tried cleaning the lube die, and no still no change with the ALOX. I just figured that ALOX wasn't meant for the gas check crimping.

Ed

[MT Chambers]

Well I think the first question should be, Smokeless or Black Powder? Very diff. lubes, but both can be made at home, and both require bee's wax.

[Kansas Ed]

Smokeless.

Ed