Light loads and accuracy in the Freedom Arms 475

[Joe C]

I was looking at a used FA in my local gunshop .
I see some very good groups shot with some of heavy loads in these guns, but i was just wondering what kind of accuracy some of you are getting with lighter loads ,such as 380-420 bullets in the 1000/1100 fps range?

Do you find you need to keep the velocity up to get good accuracy when shooting out to 100 yd and beyond ?

thanks

Joe

[mellonhead]

My everyday goto load for my 475 is a 400 grain SWC doing 1150fps. At 100 yards I can get 6" groups with iron sights from one knee. I know its not benchrest groups, but its how I practice.

Toby

[Groo]

Groo here
Just remember that as the speeds get slower it is best if the bullet gets shorter in length.
Try a 325 gr at about 900 fps [ Unique or Trailboss]

[Groo]

Groo here
Go to http://www.speer-bullets.com/pdf/ReloadingSupplementalDATA/475lineb.pdf

[odfairfaxsub]

haha don't listen to that 44guy about light loads. he;s just going to cloud up the demand and idea of light loads but they actually work

[Frank]

I use only the top velocity powders for my .475 and have two high end loads, one 100 fps slower than the other. I want power and have no clue what a slower load would do. :?

[dubber123]

I've only used the LEE 400 gr. in my F/A for lighter loads, and even 800 fps. loads shoot very well to at least 100 yds. I've never really tried these "plinkers" past there. I even tried 5 grains of Trailboss, 550 fps. with the LEE 400, it shot in 1-3/8" at 50 yds. shooting across my knees. Probably sub 1" from the bench. Keeping the weight at 400 grs. or less for slower loads is a good idea. My 440 grainers shoot terribly at 800, but great at 1,350. Good luck.

[Frank]

dubber123:

I even tried 5 grains of Trailboss, 550 fps. with the LEE 400, it shot in 1-3/8" at 50 yds. shooting across my knees. Probably sub 1" from the bench.
Yeah, but it's one minute of barn door at 100. C'mon! Just like NASA rockets. You reduce the power level and it doesn't make it to it's destination.

[Lloyd Smale]

Not really what i consider a plinking load but mine shoots a 380 lfn with 14 grains of hs6 into one hole at 25 yards and does about an inch at 50. Personaly i shoot alot of full power 475 and 500s but there a ton of fun to shoot at lower velocitys too and as i get older and my hands get more beat up and sore i find that its about silly to hunt deer with a load that will crush a elephant. I can guarantee you a 400 grain bullet at a 1000 fps will do a lot of killing at a 100 yards. Dustin linebaugh shot his grizzly with a 475 using a 400 at 1100 and the range was 185 yards. Even he rarely finds the need to run full tilt bone crushing loads. Another thing at least for these old eyes is a 100 yard deer hunting is about a thing of the past. If i need to kill stuff much past 50 anymore ill just grab a rifle.

[Frank]

Most famous people don't really shoot much at 100 yards for accuracy. I don't know why that is. I think they are too busy and just give up with loading. Old people with worn out hands also move the targets back, but that doesn't change reality. Reality is if you want an accurate 100-yd .475 then you have to man up to it. Reduced plinking loads are good for only shorter ranges.

[Joe C]

Well , i went and bought the FA 475 yesterday .

The gun came with some fired brass ,and i had dies from my 480 carbine so i threw together some rounds just to get out and shoot it.

I had some 355 gr bullets , so i tried some Trail Boss listed as 800 fps ,and some
Blue Dot that was supposed to be around 1100-1200 fps .
Just to get a feel for the gun.

I really wont know what i can do with it untill i get a scope . or dot sight on it

If i put my glasses on to see the sights , i can only see a blur on the target. and vice versa.

I did put up a paper plate at 50 yds , and wearing my glasses to see the sights , i could just barely make out the plate .
Using the Blue dot load i was able to put 4 of 5 into about an 1 1/2 the fifth shot i dropped way out . ,

I will be looking for some heavy loads for this revolver , I do want to spend some time shooting it at 100 and 200 yds . after i get some type of optical sight on it .

I probably should start another thread for this question, since it is about a heavy load, but i am going to try it here anyway ........

Many times you can get a bullet type ( lfn, wfn , etc.) , weight , and powder type /charge that shoots good in several different guns. ( I realize that you have to work up a load to a specific
firearm to get the best out of it )

So , does anyone have any suggestions with what bullet / load / powder / combo i shoud try first for my heavy load ?

thanks , and sorry about the change in subject , (still open to suggestios for a light load also )

[snowwolfe]

Visit Freedom Arms web site. They have a very nice red dot sight mount for only $48.

[Frank]

Your best bet is to look at that link above with the load notes. Pick the top 3 powders for velocity. I had best luck with W296 & N110. #9 dropped out. Your load will be somewhere between those two bullet weights. Keep going up until the cases stick, then back down. Work down until you find the accuracy point.

[Lloyd Smale]

Ill still disagree with you frank. The only bullets ive ever had to rev to get to shoot well at longer range in my 475 were wfns and even some of them can be made to do well at a 100 yards with some load experimenting.. Now im not talking shooting pop gun trail boss loads. But at 900-1000 fps if your getting poor accuracy at a 100 yards you need to work on your load developement. Like dubber said you may have to select a slightly lighter bullet to get it to stabilize but it sure can be done and they still will sure kill animals. Also lighter loads spend more time in the barrel and demand a bit better follow through. Something many ppc and bullseye shooters find out when using very light loads. The 475 isnt some majic caliber that reacts to loading any differntly then any other handgun round. With proper bullet selection and load work up its not a bit differnt then working with something like the 44 mag. As a matter of fact ive found it easier to work with. Both my 475s are probably the most accurate relovers ive ever shot. Both are easy to find good loads with. Probably because there premium guns not off the shelf rugers. they certianly dont require loading up till the brass is sticky to get them to shoot well and if they did id be trying to figure out why. I dont know what kind of 475 you have frank but it sure can be done in my FA or my linebaugh built gun. At least it could be done a few years back when i could see ;)

[mellonhead]

My Freedom Arms is like Lloyds. I have had nothing but good results with just about everything but a WFN. They weren't bad just not as good as other bullets. I would have no problem trusting my gun and load for a 100-125 yard shot.

Toby

[dubber123]

The Trailboss load I mentioned was an effort to get something that shot close to POA when the sights were adjusted for my 440/1,350 fps. load. No "normal" light 800-1000 fps. load was close enough, so I tried slowing the boolit way down to give it more barrel time. It worked better than the others for POA, but the 2 loads were still 4" apart at 50 yds., so I gave up. I only mentioned it, as the OP asked about light loads, and I personally think 1-3/8" @ 50 from a field position to be pretty good accuracy, and thats with the lightest load I've ever heard of. For general light use, the LEE 400 and 8-10 grains of Power pistol, Unique, Herco etc. works fine for me.

[Frank]

Lloyd:

But at 900-1000 fps if your getting poor accuracy at a 100 yards you need to work on your load developement.
I've never had to go that low to find accuracy. Maybe some day if I feel like experimenting with a fast powder I can try a few of your "pop" loads.

[mellonhead]

lloyd:

I've never had to go that low to find accuracy. Maybe some day if i feel like experimenting with a fast powder i can try a few of your "pop" loads.

lol!!!!!

[44man]

haha don't listen to that 44guy about light loads. he;s just going to cloud up the demand and idea of light loads but they actually work
Yep, they do but all the guys here are correct.
Want a light load, use a lighter boolit. Don't try to get accuracy with a real heavy boolit at slingshot velocity.
Dubber is right in that the 440 gr needs pushed, the 420 gr needs pushed too to a certain extent. I have used HS-6 with it and it shoots good, good powder. A 400 gr works real good with HS-6.
We had super results with the Freedom with a 350 gr boolit over a wide velocity range.
I keep my boolit weights in a range where I don't have to jack them up. I use a 100% load density with my 420 gr using 296 by having the boolit base just touch the powder and it seems to be ideal.
It is true I don't mess with light loads much because everything I shoot is for hunting or very long ranges, out to 500 meters and I do it with an 80% meplat. I do not fear a WFN and have shot some factory boolits with much larger then mine.
I use a 440 gr in my .500 JRH so I just checked it and I'll be darned if it isn't exactly 100% load density too. It is also an 80% meplat.
Using a heavier boolit needs the velocity kept up, that increases pressure and compresses powder.
Now the best groups we got from the Freedom, near 1/2" at 50 for 5 shots was a 350 gr and I suspect it was also at 100% with 296, if I remember the charge. But loading the boolit lighter with other powders still had it shooting very well.
As we got to 400 gr and up in the Freedom, loads had to get heavier to maintain accuracy but in the end, they shot just fine if velocity was a little lower, just could not cut boolit holes at 50. More around 2" or so.
It depends on what you can accept and there is a wide range but I must have shot over 100 groups of 1" or under at 100 yards with my big bores, had several 1/4" groups at 50 with the .475 and .500 JRH, even set 5 shotgun shells on their sides and shot every one in the base with 5 shots using the JRH. 3/4" targets!
Choose the right boolit for the Freedom and it can also do it.
Like I always tell JWP, remember the twist rate! :kidding:
I had to check and measured my best load for the .44 using a 330 gr boolit and found it is also at 100% density of 296. This load put every group at 1/2", at 50 yards out of a new Ruger hunter, right out of the box except I did the trigger, put an over power hammer spring in and mounted an Ultra Dot.

[Frank]

Frank:

Your best bet is to look at that link above with the load notes. Pick the top 3 powders for velocity. I had best luck with W296 & N110. #9 dropped out. Your load will be somewhere between those two bullet weights. Keep going up until the cases stick, then back down. Work down until you find the accuracy point.
One thing I forgot to mention is the Lee 400 wouldn't give accuracy with N110. My other bullet uses a GC.

[44man]

I have started testing and started with my .44 with a heavy boolit at 50 yards at 1000 fps. I will expand powders, boolit weights and calibers as I go.
But heck my first group today at "a joke going around."

[dubber123]

I have started testing and started with my .44 with a heavy boolit at 50 yards at 1000 fps. I will expand powders, boolit weights and calibers as I go.
But heck my first group today at "a joke going around."

You want a real "group" try my 440 WFN at 800 fps. from the F/A. If you can keep it in 18" @ 50 yds. you are doing well. The first time I tried it, it freaked me out, it thought I had somehow smashed the muzzle crown or something. I tried again, same result. I couldn't see anything wrong, so I went and got some of my 1,350 fps. loads, just over 1". I never have this issue with the LEE 400 at any speed. Maybe it's partly the WFN profile, but I suspect it's more of a length/twist issue.

[jwp475]

You want a real "group" try my 440 WFN at 800 fps. from the F/A. If you can keep it in 18" @ 50 yds. you are doing well. The first time I tried it, it freaked me out, it thought I had somehow smashed the muzzle crown or something. I tried again, same result. I couldn't see anything wrong, so I went and got some of my 1,350 fps. loads, just over 1". I never have this issue with the LEE 400 at any speed. Maybe it's partly the WFN profile, but I suspect it's more of a length/twist issue.



A spin stabilized projectile is more accurate with the majority of it's weight toward the rear, WFN's get more weigth forward than other nose styles

[dubber123]

A spin stabilized projectile is more accurate with the majority of it's weight toward the rear, WFN's get more weigth forward than other nose styles


That very well could be it. At full power, it shoots very well, the best groups ever at 50 yds. from this gun were with this 440 WFN. I figured if it was that accurate at 1,350, an "easier on the hands" load would be just as accurate. Wrong. Hands down the worst shooting load yet. I've never shot it past 200 meters, but the WFN still seems accurate to me. We have an 18" 200 meter plate, and I hit it 13 out of 15 off hand with a few witnesses. Not 44man accuracy, but pretty good for me. You guys do have me wondering if there is any left on the table I might find with the LFN design. I might have to try one.

[Lloyd Smale]

Odd thing is that i have a ballistic cast 350 wfn plain base that will only shoot well in either of my guns at speeds of 1200 fps or better. the faster i shoot it the better it shoots. I also have a ballistic cast lfngc 420 grain and that bullet will shoot well at any speed from 900 to warp speed. I actually bought the 350 to make a plinking load with it that would still do deer in a pinch. I was so discusted in its accuracy that i shelved it. I took it out again to try in my 475 marlin 94 rob applegate built for me and its shot like a lazer in that gun. So for grins i thought maybe it just needed some speed and loaded with 28 grains of 110 it shot one inch 50 yard groups out of both revolvers. I guess it just goes to tell a guy that nothing is for sure. by the way i wacked a 1000 lb cow buffalo with that 350 out of the marlin and it was the second quickest kill ive personaly witnessed on one and the quickest kill was another one to shake your head at. It was a 1200 lb cow i shot with my 44 4 5/8s super loaded with believe it or not a lyman devestator hp.

[44man]

A spin stabilized projectile is more accurate with the majority of it's weight toward the rear, WFN's get more weigth forward than other nose styles
BULL, last word!

[cottonstalk]

I've had good results with Hunter Supply 412gr boolits over 14-15grs of HS-6. I know of nothing in the lower 48 that this load wouldn't take.

[44man]

I've had good results with Hunter Supply 412gr boolits over 14-15grs of HS-6. I know of nothing in the lower 48 that this load wouldn't take.
Yes, 15 gr is wonderful.