The One and Only Rossi Rio Grande in 38-55 Win!

[Ranch Dog]

Based on my satisfaction with my Rio Grande chambered in 45-70, I thought this series is just begging for a 38-55 Win. I bought a new 3030B and sent it to JES Reboring (http://www.35caliber.com/index.html) to have the rifle rebore/rechambered to 38-55. Rather quickly, I packaged the rifle up and sent it to JES as I knew I would not do the work if I put much thought into. You see, after shooting it as a 30-30, I found that it would go head to head with any of my Marlins and outdo a couple of them on the initial accuracy with a wide variety of ammo.

http://www.ranchdogoutdoors.com/Firearms/RG3855/images/RG3855_sightin.jpg

Using QuickLoad, I went straight to a 30.0K PSI load and it was right on the money with the velocity. My bullets are 95/5, wheelweights/tin, with some #8 shot added to increase the antimony and then water quenched. On the LBT BHN Tester then are 21 BHN. Will pump up the PSI on the load this coming week.

http://www.ranchdogoutdoors.com/Firearms/RG3855/images/RG3855_1st_target.jpg

I will end up running this up to 42.0K PSI, about what a 21 BHN bullet can survive at. That will be about 2050 FPS for the 235-grain bullet, the same as my Marlin 375.

Steelbanger, Tom Myers (TMT), and I will be working on a more traditional 38-55 bullet in the 250-grain neighborhood.

Rossi is really in a great position, in that they control the total manufacturing environment, to really complement the Rio Grande product line with the introduction of rifles chambered in 32 Win Spl and 38-55 Win. They would fit nicely between the 30-30 Win and 45-70 Govt. Rossi has always seen great support form the CAS crowd and fellows interested in traditional style rifles so I think they would be well received.

How sweet would it be if the chambered their '92 in the original cartridges; 32-20, 38-40, and the 44-40 Win. I believe they would turn a lot of heads. While they are at it, they could give us an affordable 86/71 action chambered in 33 Win, 348 Win, and the 45-70 Govt. Marlin (Remington) would be wondering what hit them. I did mention this to the TALO group, in that they have done quite a bit of work with Taurus/Rossi, and even received a reply that it was a very good idea that deserved consideration!

Rossi-Rifleman (http://www.Rossi-Rifleman.com)

[northmn]

I realize that the 38-55 has attractions, but if I were to rebore the 375 Wichester does not sound all bad either if I want that power. It does have a use for those dirty J word bullets. It is still and interesting experiment and I will looking at further tests as I do like my 38-55.

DP

[Ranch Dog]

JES will do either and I have both. The 375 and 38-55 Win are equals in the modern levergun.

[runfiverun]

michael, this is the same one you showed over at the rossi leverguns sight right??
http://www.rossi-rifleman.com/
shameless plug ^^^^^^^
and rossi did make a 44-40 i have one,actually passed on a 454 and 480 to grab it.
really want those still.
but the 32-20,38-40,25-20,41 mag,218 bee,22 hornet,327 fed.
any of the supermags 357,375,414,445, or the 360DW,10mm,45 win mag,460 S&W,and i could go on, would be pretty cool.

[Four Fingers of Death]

Great stuff. These sell pretty cheap here, (well cheap compared to a Marlin), but no one does re-boring. They should start turning up cheap second hand anytime soon and would be neat with a re-barrel/re-bore. I have always fancied a 32/40 and a 35Remington, but 30/30s are like black T Model Fords here, everyone's favourite (read all that is ever available).

We saw a bit of variety when the 94 Big Bores were on sale many years ago and there is the odd 38/55 Marlin, but since the demise/passing of the big bores, it is back to everyone's favourite again. I have only ever seen a few of the 38/55 Marlins on the cowboy shooting circuit and those owners said they were on the phone for months scouring shops all over the country. There must be a few 38/55s around because ammo isn't that hard to get. I had a BB375W, but managed to convince myself that I could get by without it????

[Gee_Wizz01]

Ranch Dog,

That's just plain cruel showing us that 38-55! I was just looking for a 30-30 Rio Grande and now I will need a couple more. I really want a 32 Special, as that is what my favorite uncle used when I was young. I also would love to see a Rossi 92 in 32-20, 25-20 or even 218 Bee. My Rossi Puma was a mediocre shooter till it met your 432-265, now it can shoot tiny little groups a 50yds. Hopefully Rossi will see the light and add some of these calibers.

Gary

[Old Goat Keeper]

OOOOOOHHHHHH I want one in 327 Federal! Yes I do!

T-o-m

[Crash_Corrigan]

Me too. I have a 327 Ruger 8 shooter in Stainless Steel and I would love to have a levergun in the same caliber.

[Four Fingers of Death]

Hmmmmmmmmmm, I found a box of 500 375 commercial boolits tonight, if they don't feed in the 375H&H, I'll just have to go out and buy me a 38/55 or a 375W, :) I have a few 375 moulds and lotza gaschecks as well, wouldn't want to waste them.

Now, if they turned out a side eject flat top 92 in 25/20, 32/20, 357/38 and 44 I reckon they would sell. I have all of these in Rossi and original Winchesters, but would love a flat top for use with a low powered scope. 25/20 and 32/20 Marlins are as rare as rocking horse poop and sell the moment they come on the market. I'd jump on a 25/20 and a 32/20. Probably end up buying the two Rossis for the price of a second hand Marlin.

[TJF1]

327 for me too. Have 94 in 32h&r i will rechamber
when i can get to feed the 327 round.

[TXGunNut]

There's something I like about that rifle. Not sure exactly what, pretty sure I'll need to obtain one (two?) and explore the matter further. Should sell my minty Big Bore, buy 2, have one rebored to .375.
Nicely done, Michael. Looks like you have another keeper.
If you don't mind me asking, why 5-groove?

[Ranch Dog]

If you don't mind me asking, why 5-groove?

Because he doesn't offer a 6-groove. Not sure why.

[6pt-sika]

I will end up running this up to 42.0K PSI, about what a 21 BHN bullet can survive at. That will be about 2050 FPS for the 235-grain bullet, the same as my Marlin 375.

Steelbanger, Tom Myers (TMT), and I will be working on a more traditional 38-55 bullet in the 250-grain neighborhood.

Rossi is really in a great position, in that they control the total manufacturing environment, to really complement the Rio Grande product line with the introduction of rifles chambered in 32 Win Spl and 38-55 Win.

WHile I liked the 235 grain bullet and a 250 grainer sounds intresting I'd be curiouse to know how this rifle did with your original 379-210GC bullet ?

I always liked that one better then the 235 grainer !


And as to the 32 Special thing I was gonna suggest you rebore one to 32-40 , but in my minds eye the 32 Special is almost as much fun as the 32-40 !

[Ranch Dog]

WHile I liked the 235 grain bullet and a 250 grainer sounds intresting I'd be curiouse to know how this rifle did with your original 379-210GC bullet ?

I always liked that one better then the 235 grainer !


And as to the 32 Special thing I was gonna suggest you rebore one to 32-40 , but in my minds eye the 32 Special is almost as much fun as the 32-40 !

I did not keep a copy of the TLC379-210-RF, I never liked how it shot Craig.

[oscarflytyer]

OK Michael... How bad was the damage to rebore/re-barrel? (Know the base rifle is very reasonable...)

And for the record - I almost hate you for posting projects like this!

[TXGunNut]

Because he doesn't offer a 6-groove. Not sure why. -Ranch Dog

Noticed that on the site, seems the 5-groove has a bit of history as well. I have several years' supply of .375 Win brass and a pristine Big Bore that I really need to sell to a collector. A Rio Grande in .375 w/ a 2-7 Leupold or Redfield would ensure that brass didn't go to waste.
Keep us posted, Michael. I don't see much chance of Rossi chambering a rifle in .375 so I bookmarked JES's website. Seem like good folks.

[Ranch Dog]

OK Michael... How bad was the damage to rebore/re-barrel? (Know the base rifle is very reasonable...)

The rifle cost me $409 out the door. JES charges $250 which includes the return shipping. It was another $20 to get it there. So, all said I'm in this rifle $679. That is a lot but it doesn't matter to me because I have what I want, a real tight 38-55 Win.

I'm shooting it with my standard Bushnell Banner 1.5-4.5 X 32 but recently purchased a Banner 1.5-6 X 21 Lite-Site Scope for it at a reasonable price. These scopes were in production in the 60-70's but I never could afford one. They have the Bushnell multiplex reticle with a .25 dot superimposed on the the crosshairs with the push of a switch. I will be using this rifle as my "bean field" rifle out in my food plots at dusk and dark dealing with my feral hogs.


And for the record - I almost hate you for posting projects like this!

[smilie=l:

[Ranch Dog]

Keep us posted, Michael. I don't see much chance of Rossi chambering a rifle in .375 so I bookmarked JES's website. Seem like good folks.

I didn't read up to see if I mentioned this or not but I corresponded with TALO about this rifle and the need for a 32 Win Spl and 38-55 Win to span the 30-30 Win and 45-70 Govt. They surprised me in that they immediately wrote back and said it was a great idea that deserved consideration. I don't know if they will really act on it but they do have a history of working with both Taurus and Rossi.

With Rossi having those four basic cartridges in the Rio Grande lineup, they would really put the heat to Remlin. Very basic cartridges, the three related to each other and all four with relatively mild max pressures. That would be one heck of a lineup.

[northmn]

Wasn't the 375 Big Bore a 375 bore? Many 38-55's are from 377 to 381+ . I have a 38-55 Marlin that needs a little more work, but required Starline Brass to get it to shoot at its best as that permitted the use of as cast bullets. Now its a matter of matching velocity to alloy. As stated both are good cartridges, just wondered about the use of a tighter bore.

DP

[rockrat]

I would like a 41 mag, 327mag and 38-40 for starters. So few Marlin 41's out there.

[TXGunNut]

I didn't read up to see if I mentioned this or not but I corresponded with TALO about this rifle and the need for a 32 Win Spl and 38-55 Win to span the 30-30 Win and 45-70 Govt. -Ranch Dog


I agree, but I wonder if the .35 Rem would be a better choice than the .32 Win. I'm a big fan of both cartridges but wonder if the 35 would make more fiscal sense. How about a 30-30 w/ a 1-16 twist and skip on up from there to to 35 and 38 calibers? Agreed about the pressure on Remlin, Michael. What they need is a bit of competition and I think Rossi is willing to step up and make the levergun game intersting.

[TXGunNut]

Wasn't the 375 Big Bore a 375 bore? Many 38-55's are from 377 to 381+ .

DP

Mine probably is, hasn't been fired in 20 yrs and never slugged it. Shot a .375 (.374) Hornady J-bullet acceptably well, IIRC. Some 35-55's were as tight as .375 as well, according to my Lyman manual. Good point. I have WW .375 brass and dies but wonder if the 38-55 chambering would merit another set of dies? I'm thinking 375 brass would be ok in either. I'll be shooting cast boolits and sizing to fit the bore so could go either way.
I'm guessing you faced a similar choice, Michael. Why did you go with 35-55?

[6pt-sika]

I did not keep a copy of the TLC379-210-RF, I never liked how it shot Craig.

I've still got mine , just in case I should be tempted to get another Marlin 375 at a later date .

[northmn]

Mine probably is, hasn't been fired in 20 yrs and never slugged it. Shot a .375 (.374) Hornady J-bullet acceptably well, IIRC. Some 35-55's were as tight as .375 as well, according to my Lyman manual. Good point. I have WW .375 brass and dies but wonder if the 38-55 chambering would merit another set of dies? I'm thinking 375 brass would be ok in either. I'll be shooting cast boolits and sizing to fit the bore so could go either way.
I'm guessing you faced a similar choice, Michael. Why did you go with 35-55?

They do not recommend using 38-55 and 375 BB brass intercheageably. Both are similar and the 375 has gained some acceptance with BP Schuetzen target shooters. The 38-55 in a target single shot is also very accurate. I am fond of the 38-55 and if I had one made up like Ranch Dog, I would make sure it was properly throated to use WW brass. It is a very interesting caliber but I do not load mine quite as hot as some do, but do exceed factory ballistics. Berfore I started doing as much casting I did get a couple of deer with the Barnes OS 250 grain bullets loaded to 1600 fps. If I did my part the 38-55 will do its part.
I definitely would get a 35 Remington before a 32 special as it is a step up from the 30-30.

DP

[TXGunNut]

I definitely would get a 35 Remington before a 32 special as it is a step up from the 30-30.

DP

True enough. The 32 is a small step up from the 30-30 but the 35 Rem isn't a very big step up. The 30-30, 32 Spl, 35 Rem are all very capable medium caliber, medium velocity hunting rifle cartridges IMHO. The 38-55 and 375 are also small steps above with the 358 Win somewhere in the mix as well. I only have four of the six, won't be happy until I have them all. :wink: Then there's the .405 and somehow we skipped the .348........[smilie=l:

[bearcove]

Good choice! I have a Marlin 336 30/30 that Jes did the 38-55 thing to. Got it on gunbroker been test fired 7 times,had new skinner sights peep and untrimed front sight. I was the only bidder, and he had 2. I wished I was working more so I could of bought both.

[TXGunNut]

They do not recommend using 38-55 and 375 BB brass intercheageably. Both are similar and the 375....

DP

True. I realized reading this thread that the only thing keeping me from selling my BB was finding something to do with the brass and dies. Doing a project like his in 375 would overcome that objection. If I do it in 38-55 I could probably use the brass I have on hand. My .375 BB is useless to me, it's a 98% gun and I'm not willing to damage it by adding receiver or tang sights and taking it hunting. I can install a scope or peeps to make a nice hunting rifle out of the Rossi and wouldn't worry about a few scratches or dings. I don't need another hunting rifle; I won't live long enough to get good use out of the hunting rifles I have, but that's another matter. :wink:

[TXGunNut]

Any updates, Michael?

[peterso]

Michael
I noticed in one of the pictures showing a 50 YD group that your rile had five lands and grooves. What is the rationale for choosing five as opposed to the four or three option? I'm glad you posted this project. I've wanted a good 38/55 for a long time now and have not been able to find one.
Owen

[Ranch Dog]

Any updates, Michael?

None really. I have not shot it a lot in that required no fiddling with the load work. Just been too busy around the rancho.

[Ranch Dog]

Michael
I noticed in one of the pictures showing a 50 YD group that your rile had five lands and grooves. What is the rationale for choosing five as opposed to the four or three option? I'm glad you posted this project. I've wanted a good 38/55 for a long time now and have not been able to find one.
Owen

Unfortunately, I can't offer much as I didn't put much thought into it. I'm not sure why JES offers the odd ball number of grooves. Al my leverguns and pistols have 6 groove unless they are Marlin Micro-Grooved barrels.

[northmn]

There is a theory that an odd number of grooves is better because when they line up there are no grooves directly opposite each other. Pressure ???? British buy into it. DIIKnow.

DP

[bearcove]

Part of the odd groove is the cutter is supported when cutting rifling