Cimarron

[Guy La Pourque]

Hey guys - does anyone know who makes their guns? Is it Uberti by any chance?

[Seth Hawkins]

Yes. It is Uberti.

[littlejack]

Yes sir.
My Uberti Hiwall IS stamped "Cimarron xxxx xxxx"
Jack

[Bigbuckeye]

Not all of their guns are Uberti. It depends on which gun, my Sharps is a Pedersoli.

[RMulhern]

Save your $$$$$!!

[ilcop22]

Save your $$$$$!!

+1

Bought my brother a Cimarron coach gun for his 18th. Last year one of the locks stopped functioning. Took it apart to find the sear had snapped in half, was made of very cheap, thin material and was covered in tooling marks. It's a good fun gun, but the internals are extremely cheap. If I had to do it over again, I'd get something better. Certainly wouldn't count on it in the field or for defense.

[Sixgun Symphony]

I have a Cimarron 1873 Winchester Carbine and I have not had any problems with it. It's still rather new, I only fired about four hundred rounds of .44 WCF blackpowder cartridge.

[cajun shooter]

My 1873 Texas Brush Popper was purchased over two years ago from Buffalo Arms who bought it from Cimmaron.
The rifle was made by Uberti 100% and Cimmaron is just the distributor as they make no guns themselves. I average shooting 3 SASS matches a month and have had 0 problems with my rifle. I had a backup in case of problems and sold it after two years of non stop service.
It has been stated by many persons in the gun world that the Uberti copy of the 1873 and 66 rifles are much better than the original Winchesters.
I can't say that is true but the craftsmanship is outstanding with any of the products I have had made by them.
I also purchased a 1874 Sharps competition rifle made by Pedersoli that shot side by side with the rifles from Montana. It's only flaw was that the factory sights were not up to the better ones made by several American companies. Later David

[littlejack]

I do have two Uberti firearms.
Some of us, (a lot of us) cannot afford the very high priced top shelf firearms. Given that the prices are rising practically on a daily bases, some of us can barelt afford the clones.
With al;l of that being said, I own two of the Uberti firearms. They are both well made and the fit and finish is fine for me and my standards. I absolutely dispise ill working or ugly firearms.
I have the Uberti Hiwall in 45-70 that shoots very well with my black powder loads, and is a dream to clean.
I also have on of the Uberti "Evil Roy" saa revolvers. This also shoots very well with my smokeless powder loads. I can not say much more about them except, I would buy these firearms again. I carry and shoot them with pride.
Jack

[Ed in North Texas]

Quality of Uberti-made "cowboy" guns seems to vary with type of gun. I hear positive comments from fellow shooters about their Uberti-made lever and falling block (high and low wall Winchester copies) rifles. However, my gunsmith considers Uberti SARs poorly fitted inside, even compared to Rugers, which get good marks from him. Long ago I bought Ruger SARs and avoided Uberti-made revolvers entirely -- a decision I have never regretted.

Dalyoke

I'm glad you are happy with Ruger revolvers, but to base your decision on the opinion of one person might not be the best way to arrive at a decision. Just because he is a gunsmith doesn't mean he isn't biased. I don't know how much experience he's had with them, but one example in his shop years ago could have turned him off of the Uberti products forever.

You couldn't go wrong choosing the Rugers, but that doesn't mean your decision to avoid the Uberti products was validated by the satisfaction you have had from the Rugers.

Just my $0.02, which is worth nothing these days.

Ed

[cajun shooter]

A big huge plus 1 on your post ed!!

[9.3X62AL]

No Cimarron experience so far, and only one Uberti--a Cattleman SAA clone in 45 Colt x 4-3/4". It ran well and shot well. It was probably made 25 years ago. It went down the road when the Bisley Blackhawk x 45 Colt arrived c. 1995, and the BisHawk's throating caused me to regret the Uberti's sale. A bit of time with a throating hone got the Ruger completed properly, and only then did it shoot to the same standards of the departed Uberti.

I pretty much expect a new firearm to be in need of completion these days.

[StrawHat]

I have a few Uberti revolvers, ranging from the Pocket Police up to the Dragoons. I like them all. Yeah, some have needed work but I do it myself and consider the Italians C&B revolvers to be kits. They all need work to make me happy, some more than others. I have also had Rugers. If you like revolvers that are larger and heavier than they need to be, get the Ruger. If you like single actions like they used to be made, get the Ubertis, or Piettas.

And a +1 to both cajun shooter and Ed.

[ilcop22]

Just because he is a gunsmith doesn't mean he isn't biased. I don't know how much experience he's had with them, but one example in his shop years ago could have turned him off of the Uberti products forever.

Ed said it best. I'm not a big time dealer/gunsmith or anything, but I have a good size law enforcement clientele, and there are certain guns they ask about that I won't even sell if they paid me a premium for them because bad apples ruined the bunch. Bias is everywhere.

[Bigbuckeye]

I am currently awaiting delivery of a 1860 Henry from Cimmaron (Uberti) so i can't report yet as to quality. I do have a Pedersoli Sharps "Quigley" and it is one of the highest quality firearms that I have ever seen.

[Ed in North Texas]

Ed,

The number of Uberti SAs that particular gunsmith has worked on is way more than 1, all within the recent 10 years I have been using him for gunsmithing works on various revolvers, rifles and hammer doubles, all made in Europe or Scandinavia many decades ago. AND, like several of my fellow shooters and many posters to this thread, he has positive things to say about Uberti-made falling block rifles -- never heard a peep from him about Uberti-made lever gun replicas. SO, your supposition is poorly based and inaccurate in this instance.

I rather like "sure things" with guns and generally avoid ones with reputation for poorly finished and fitted internals. I would note that one poster reports being very happy with his "Evil Roy" Uberti-made SAs. Last I knew, the extra price one pays for them reflects additional fitting of internals, reputedly to bring them up to a quality level that Evil Roy is willing to endorse. This alone supports a finding of lesser quality in ordinary Uberti-made SAs.

AND, a big -1 to Cajun Shooter's post immediately following yours.

Dalyoke

Might I suggest that "...one example in his shop years ago could have turned him off of the Uberti products forever." is not the same as my supposing that he only had one example. And your statements do not preclude my being correct that your gunsmith could be biased. I made no positive statement regarding your gunsmith, or you, beyond your choice of Ruger SA revolvers couldn't be a bad choice. Others since have pointed out they have had minor problems with the Rugers - so I stand corrected on that point. I only own one Ruger revolver currently, an Old Army which has yet to be shot (haven't got a round tuit for that yet).

Ed

[Hang Fire]

Uberti is now making their 1873 Winchester in .357 and .44 mags in the blued action carbine models only as I understand it. From what I read, Uberti has changed the receiver metal only but the internal action components remain the same?

Anyone had any experience with these?

Youtube video, I like the light weight stacked egg cartons for rest.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBTgNxOj9Eg

[Bullet Caster]

I have an Uberti 1873 4 & 3/4" bbl. chambered in .45 Colt. I love my Uberti. I also have a L. Pietta BP revolver that is a real hoot to shoot. Those are the only Itialian imports that I own. The forcing cone on the Uberti needs polishing as it is roughly cut and in need of polishing as lead begins to form around the forcing cone. Has anyone ever polished the forcing cone? Will that help the leading around the forcing cone? I know that a polished feed ramp on a .45acp works really well in cambering rounds so I thought this might improve my Uberti. BC

[Ilwil]

I've had lots of Ubertis, rifle and handgun. The rifles have all been great, handguns less so, I had an 1875 Remington in .44-40 that was unmtigated junk, very soft metal. I have a Cimarron nickled 1873 in .44-40 that shows great workmanship. It used to be that Cimarron did the final fit and finish instead of in the Ubert factory, so they were considered a cut higher. I don't know if that is still true.
Last year, I could not remove the cylinder base pin, so I took it to a smith. He had to dismantle the gun to find the pin had broken and somehow frozen up. He attributed it to Uberti's uneven use of quality steels in their guns.
I have found Ubertis to be uniformly of better quality than Pietta and other makers, but that may not be saying much for Italian repro handguns.

[9.3X62AL]

I do from time to time get lustful for a '73 Winchester repro in 32-20 WCF, but to date have resisted the urge to actually buy one. After seeing the internals of my original 1873 in 44-40, there is NO WAY ON EARTH that I would trust that system to support high-velocity loadings, nor would I fire one chambered in 357 Magnum or 44 Magnum--even at current gutted SAAMI specs. Not gonna happen.

[TXGunNut]

Gunsmiths are like mechanics, they know more than most of us about the machines they work on but (other than upgrades) they generally only see the ones that break. If I want to know how a gun holds up I'd look for answers from SASS and BPCR shooters. Uberti is a major player in the SASS game from what I hear. I recently became the proud owner of a Uberti Bird's Head 1873 and have enjoyed a Pietta C&B revolver for years. I'm very impressed by the quality and workmanship of both.

[TXGunNut]

Speaking only for myself and folks I shoot with, our primary reason for taking our guns to smiths is to have innards slicked up, to have triggers adjusted to how we like them, to have throats and/or forcing cones altered, old guns T&D for scope mounts, for tang sights, etc. -Dalyoke


Sounds like you have a good gunsmith, treat him right because they're hard to find. I had a good gunsmith build and repair my match and duty guns, he's gone now and I haven't been able to find another anywhere near as good. My comments weren't directed towards your 'smith, just 'smiths in general. They all have their likes and dislikes, just like we do. However, as a competitor I would still be more interested in your opinion than your gunsmith's. I was lucky in my comp career because I was a PPC shooter and almost every team had an armorer that was more than happy to fix another competitor's gun. At Nationals S&W sends an armorer or two to perform free minor repairs. The original build and some repairs had to be done by a fully equipped and qualified 'smith but most of my repairs were done @ the range. I learned how to slick up and keep my S&W's in time, I know what I like and they were very reliable.
I don't know when my imported revolvers were built or what happened to them before I bought them used. The Uberti Bird's Head is fairly new but the C&B 1858 was probably built in the '80's or 90's when quality apparently varied a bit, I'm guessing this was one of the good ones. I only have personal experience with those two but will likely buy another based on my favorable experience with them.

[cajun shooter]

The entire group of gun makers in Italy went to meet with the one bad egg and that is Armi San Marco. They have the worst record of any gun maker in Italy and still use inferior parts.
The Pedersoli, and Uberti and Pietta all have guns that are well made and strong.
I have been to 5 Smith&Wesson schools, Ruger Armorer's School, Remington 870, Ithaca, Sig Sauer and others. They all have made guns that have problems. Ruger builds some of the strongest guns made but has also built thousands that were out of the correct caliber dimensions.
They had one gunsmith that probably made a living on fixing Ruger guns.
I had a Pedersoli 1874 Sharps Competition rifle in 45-70 that was able to shoot side by side with the guns made in Montana. If you take time to do some research , you will see that some of these makers have been making guns for hundreds of years.
Our own Military gave it's handgun contract to replace the 45 ACP to Beretta. The Benelli shotgun is thought to be one of the best in the world.
I was mad when S&W did not receive the military contract as I believe that Americans should carry guns made here in combat.
My post is trying to show that the guns in Italy are no different than the other products made in this world economy that we have now.
You want to talk cheap made look at the Chinese guns and they have some that are good also.
9.3x62al, I have a Uberti made 1873 in 44WCF reproduction and with all my years of gun experience I 'm not afraid to fire any round in it.
Now having said that let me say that first I shoot nothing but BP which reaches no more than 14,000 PSI with any load. The toggle bolt system of all the Winchester designed rifles is not a strong design and therefore was never intended to fire high pressure designs. To say you would not fire one with all of your knowledge is not a good thing to say.
It gives persons with less knowledge the wrong impression.
Just as you would not enter a Chevrolet Volt in the Indy 500 you should not fire any high pressure round in a gun that was designed in 1873. The only powder of that time was not called black powder but simply gun powder as it was the only thing made.
Several SASS shooters including myself shoot all of their guns many more times than any pleasure shooter each year and therefore do have problems that guns kept in a safe or dresser drawer will never see. Many of them are so worked over that they are at the point of breakage when shot for the first time.
When you cut or lighten a spring you are putting wear into that gun.
I'm off the box, Later David

[littlejack]

Cajun:
Thank you. Good read, and infomation.
Jack

[9.3X62AL]

Cajun--

I think we're saying the same things, sir. I didn't mean to offend by sharing my distrust of the toggle-link 1873 Winchester action when coupled with the 357 or 44 Magnum calibers, but that is my position--honestly felt. In 32-20, 38-40, or 44-40 loaded with The Holy Black or with equivalent-pressure smokeless fuels, I enjoy the '73 Winchester rifle immensely. My own dates from 1897 and remains quite serviceable, which I think speaks to their durability using 1873-level loadings very succinctly.

Someone at Uberti et al feels that the '73 action can safely contain the pressures and backthrust generated by current 357 and 44 Magnum loadings. I could be all wet--and I reserve the right to be wrong. :) But I feel that high-pressure handgun calibers like the 357 and 44 should be housed in Win 92 or Marlin 94 platforms. I'm certain that the Uberti '73s loaded with CAS-level cast boolit loads in either caliber will last a couple lifetimes, just as my own '73 soldiers on after 115 years. I just don't think the '73 chambered to 357 or 44 Magnum is the best all-around lever rifle in those calibers. That's all.

Sola mi dos centavos.

[cajun shooter]

I misunderstood your posting as you just explained it and I do agree with you as far as using the toggle bolt system with rounds that reach the pressures of the 44 magnum. I'm sorry for that as I told you I've always been in 100 % agreement with your postings. Later David

[9.3X62AL]

No sweat, sir. I read and enjoy your posts as well.