45 Colt w/ BP

[TXGunNut]

I think I may have a new favorite cartridge and firearm! On a whim I cast some tributes to St Elmer awhile back, then decided to load a few stray pieces of 45 Colt brass using FFFg KIK powder. Finally got to touch them off today and folks on the public range I was shooting on lost all interest in what they were doing for a moment. Little Uberti Bird's Head is a real crowd pleaser! Lots of fun for me as well, fired 30 rds off-hand, one-handed and most shots (7 yds) were touching, about 1/2" above POA. Range was pretty crowded, only distance available, but plenty far for my eyes these days. Guess I shouldn't be surprised when the sights on a BP-era replica handgun are almost perfectly regulated for BP. [smilie=l:
Little scamp cleaned right up with the Ballistol solution I mixed up. Can says 50/50 but I think folks around here prefer 3-1 or 4-1. I'll dilute it a bit for my next venture.

[kliff]

Sweeeeeet......great looking lil shooter too!

[TXGunNut]

Thanks, can't get over how well it handles & shoots. Think I'll designate it a BP only gun and keep some rounds loaded for stress relief. May even have El Paso Saddlery build me a cross-draw holster. Think I better get busy building BP loads, already looking like I'll need some BP therapy this weekend.

[Dale53]

It's kind of funny you should bring this up (at this time). I just loaded up some black powder .45 Cowboy Specials with 200 gr Big Lube bullets. I'm going to load up another box with Lyman's 452664 cast bullets (both lubed with Emmert's home mix black powder lube). I'll see which shoots closest to the sights with my Bisley Vaquero and my SS Bisley Convertible.

FWIW
Dale53

[TXGunNut]

Should be interesting, Dale. Which powder are you using? I'm using SPG lube these days, BTW. Cleanup was amazingly easy w/ moosemilk.

[Dale53]

TXGunNut;
I'm currently using Goex 3f. I use Friendship Speed Juice for clean up followed up with a couple of dry patches then left wet with Ed's Red.

Friendship Speed Juice:
1 pint of rubbing alcohol
1 pint of Hydrogen Peroxide
1 Pint of Murphy's Oil Soap

After you mix the Juice, it should be kept out of sunlight. I use the dark peroxide bottle for range use and keep the supply in a dark cupboard.

Speed juice leaves the metal chemically clean but you must follow up with a good preservative to keep from rusting. Hence, the use of Ed's Red. I believe with any black powder use or substitute it is also a good idea to follow up two or three days later, with a wet patch of Ed's Red inside and out.

Black Powder residue is also hard on cases. However, that can be handled by decapping the cases right on the range and dropping in a gallon jug about three quarters full of water with a couple of squirts of Dawn Dishwashing Liquid. By the time I get home the cases are clean (including the primer pockets) and I just rinse thoroughly in hot water, dump in a collander and shake dry. Then, while the cases are still damp, I drop them in my vibratory tumbler and tumble for a couple of hours. If you don't tumble the cases will turn dark. That won't hurt them but they look bad. I prefer
"bright and shiny"...

Dale53

[Hang Fire]

I bought a Kirst .45 LC conversion cylinder specifically to shoot BP in my 58 Remmy. But was not to be, the CC locks up tighter than any revolver I have ever owned with near perfect timing, end play is .001". Only a glint of light can be seen at the B/C gap, and therein lies the problem, a single shot of BP and it is binds up. Works fine with Trail Boss, but a definite no go with BP.

I shoot BP in my .44-40 BP frame 1873 Colt SA and it is a blast to say the least.

[StrawHat]

45 long Colt and blackpowder ... a match made in Heaven! Okay maybe made in the Springfield Armory but you get the point. I have tried most of the boolits available and have come to like the GB 454190 and the GB collar button boolit for the 45-70. Vast differences in POI but still a lot of fun to shoot.

Elmer Keith said that if he were stuck with only one revovler and had to use factory loads he would shoose the 45 long Colt and the Remington black powder loads. I believe that is what Taffin found when he unloaded the revolvers after EK passed.

[L Ross]

TexasGN, you are fortunate your revolver works with black. All of my open tops work great. The 1875 Remington and 1873 Colt clones I tried tied up tight with less than a cylinder full. On the other hand a buddy picked up a used Uberti 1873 clone and we ran a full box of 50 through it with out an issue. I sold the Remmie and Colt to smokeless shooters and they are fine.

Duke

[Wayne Smith]

I have that gun in 44-40 and shoot Goex FFFG in it too. Very nice gun. I probably need a cross draw holster for it also.

[TXGunNut]

Cylinder gap is a bit tight but the KIK powder burns clean enough to fire 30+ rounds without dragging. Absolutely no lead on the face of the cylinder. My old remmy c&b revolver's been on a steady diet of Swiss FFFg cleaned up by Windex w/ vinegar followed by Wonder Lube for years but I'm pretty impressed by this moose milk.
I use a similar case cleaning regimen, Dale, except I wait til I get home and use hot soapy water and dry them in the oven. Thanks for the speed juice tip.
I've been a fan of the SP 45 Colt almost as long as I've been a fan of Elmer Keith. I'm inclined to treat the BP 45 Colt as a different cartridge, tho. Ruger BH likes the Keith boolit and I think the loads I build for it and my little Trapper will continue to be powered by Universal Clays.

[TXGunNut]

I have that gun in 44-40 and shoot Goex FFFG in it too. Very nice gun. -Wayne Smith


With the price of powder I'm thinking a 32-20 might be fun and economical but I'm pretty sure there's at least one 44-40 in my future. Pretty sure the number 1873 will describe it, just don't know if it'll be a wheelgun or a levergun...hopefully both.

[Dale53]

I needed a black powder revolver with fixed sights when I was shooting side matches at BPCR Silhouette matches. I ended up with a Ruger Bisley Vaquero with 5½" barrel. I picked the Lyman 452664 cast bullet as it has a large square grease groove that will hold enough black powder lube. I use Emmert's home mix (50% pure natural beeswax, 40% Crisco, and 10% Canola oil. I later modified Emmerts by dropping the Canola oil and substituting Anhydrous Lanolin.

I cast the bullets at 30/1 lead/tin (my BPCR mix) and sized to .452". I can get 70 shots without cleaning, then the cylinder starts to drag. A five minute clean up and I am good for another 70 shots. Keep in mind that this is revolver specific - some will bind up early and others will not (see above comments from others).

I've mentioned it before, but the .45 Colt when loaded with black powder is a REAL cartridge. Much more powerful than I, at first, realized. I can see why the cavalry depended on it. It truly would take down a horse...

Dale53

[freedom475]

It may not be "traditional" but.... I really like to shoot my Remington 58 with the conversion cylinder and I was getting binding. I don't want to shoot smokeless loads in it just because that is not what I enjoy when shooting my 45.

I want to shoot Real BP in my 45's. But I hate the binding and fouled out barrel when I take it shooting in the hils. So I stared to experiment with options.

I tried "BigLube" boolits but it didn't give me the advantage that they claim to offer...I still use the EPP-UG 150gr Biglube boolit because it keeps the same POA as the Roundball cylinder for my Rem58.

I found that if I use 4 grains of 2400 (against the primer) to light 30gr of Goex that I can get a great results and the 2400 burns the BP real clean..

Why 2400??..because I tried a lot of powders an it seemed to work best. I wanted enough smokless to give me a good burn without raising pressures much. That pretty much eliminates the faster powders like Unique and anything faster. I didn't like the ball powders for this aplication because I want the powder to stay put at the primer. I tried 4227 but it didn't burn completely.

I also read of a "binding solution" (that I have not tried)..The guy chucked his base pin in a drill and scored the pin with a file just enough to hold some lube in several places, I think this would work well and according to the author it works great. The old C&B colts all had the lube rings milled into the base pins.

[StrawHat]

...I've mentioned it before, but the .45 Colt when loaded with black powder is a REAL cartridge. Much more powerful than I, at first, realized. I can see why the cavalry depended on it. It truly would take down a horse...

Dale53

Never shot a horse but the 454424 and black powder work on Ohio white tailed deer!

[blackpowder man]

I find that shooting BP is my therapy as well. Glad to hear someone else put it that way. I shoot BP in .45 colt and have tried it in my .44s, but recently got a pair of those Lipsey Vaqueros in .44 special for cowboy shoots. As soon as I get a mold for a boolit with a big enough lube groove I will be up and running. I haven't heard enough real world feedback on the Mav Big Lube to spend that kind of money yet. NOE is doing the remake of the 200 grain Lyman at some point this year and I think I will try it. Happy BP shooting therapy to all of you.

[cajun shooter]

Blackpowder man, take a look at Accurate Moulds. I shoot nothing but 100% black powder and designed the 43-210B bullet which is a modified design of the original 44-40 bullet made by Lyman. They sell it as the 427098 but it does not carry enough lube.
My friend W30wcf designed the 43-215C for Accurate Moulds also if you need more lube.
The way to keep your revolver shooting without bind is to use Mobil One synthetic Grease on the base pin and cylinder bushing if you have one that is removable.
I have used this in SASS matches for over 4 years now and never had a stoppage.
As far as you brass goes it's better to put them in a bucket at the range that contains about 1/2 gallon of water, 2 oz of Dawn/Oxy, 2 oz of concentrated Lemon Juice, and 2 ounces of Lemon Pine oil. This mix if left in the rear of your truck will be black when opened and knock you down with the smell. Your brass will appear to be black and splotched but will clean up like new with ceramic or steel pin media with water and that Dawn/Oxy again.
The proper mix of Moose milk is between a 7-1 or 10-1 mix of Ballistol and water. I use 2 ounces of Ballistol to 14 ounces of water for my mix. They will tell you that a heavier mix will separate and not stay mixed. I have found this to be true. The nice thing is that you may spray it all over the gun with no harm. I just add a good oil like EEZOX after cleaning and they are ready again.
I have used the above procedures for four years and shooting three SASS matches a month so I will say they are time tested.
The Mobil One has helped many BP shooters.

[JohnnyFlake]

I only see five cases next to that nice Bird's Head. Is it just a five shooter or is it actually a six shooter?

[TXGunNut]

I was only firing five at a time. Was playing around with leaving an empty chamber under the hammer. Also had 35 rounds on hand so that let me load it up 7 times.

[Wayne Smith]

If you really want a challenge and fun Uberti is chambering it's small P model in 41LC.

[bob208]

well you all have got me thinking. i have a few kegs of bp. i allso have a colt clone and a 66 win. repo. in .44-40. spring comes i am going to give it a try.

[TXGunNut]

I see blue smoke and happiness in your future, Bob. :coffeecom