Awsome Results with Lyman 311299

[Dthunter]

Hi guys!

I would just like to share some good results I had today shooting the boolets I made with a Lyman 311299 mould. This is a 200 grain boolet.

I will describe my load/rifle set up specifics, and then give you the results.

Caliber was .308 Winchester.

I was shooting three loads, using IMR SR4759 (17.0,19.0,21.0 grains)

I used neck sized Winchester brass, and Fed 210M Primers.

I sized the boolets to .310" and lubed them with Lymans Super Moly Lube.

I loaded these boolets to seat well into the throat ( the first lube groove, and almost the second was visible)

I dipped the whole nose of each loaded boolet into an Allox applicator I made from a used 35mm film container. (filled the container with three layers of .75" thick foam and soaked it with Allox). I cut a hole in the center of the top layer of foam with a paper hole punch.

You can seal the container for future use with the original water tight lid.

I put two layers of Allox on the noses.

The nose diameter measure at .300" before I dipped them.

The alloy I mixed up in my 20Lb pot was: 18lbs Wheel weight lead + 8 Feet of 50/50 -Lead/ Tin Solder.

All bullets were air cooled, and weight segregated to within 1 grain or less of each other.

Conditions:

All groups were shot at 100 yards.
0 Degrees Celcius (32 degrees F)
Very little wind
Mixed sun and cloud

Rifle/scope:

Remington 700, Varmint Laminate
26" Factory Heavy barrel
1-12" Twist
6.5-20X40 Leupold Target scope (1/8 mil dot).
Factory trigger was set at just under 4 pounds Average break pressure, and zero creep. ( a little heavy to me still).


Here are the results:


1.) 17.0 Grains of IMR SR4759, Ave Velocity was 1573fps, Group size was 0.895"

2.) 19.0 Grains of IMR SR4759, Ave Velocity was 1691fps, Group size was 0.795"

3.) 21.0 Grains of IMR SR4759, Ave Velocity was 1812fps, Group size was 0.608"

:holysheep

I was a little stunned! This is more than I ever expected to get shooting cast boolets!

This is the very first time I have ever shot these boolets. Hopefully they repeat this precision the next time out!

I will keep trending with the powder charge till I either reach the maximum charge, or I see the groups start to open up. This is fuuunnn stufff!

Thanks to all the BOOLET MASTERS who gave valuable insite to aid me in getting these results!

This is a great site and hobby/passion/obsession!

[smilie=l:

Hope fully this info can help someone out!

[edward hogan]

Presumably a .308win?

[Dthunter]

yep, thankyou, my oversite!
I adjusted the original post

[rollmyown]

Congrats Dthuter, very nice results.

[x101airborne]

Very Nice!! I think I have my -06 hot on your heels!! Sure feels good!

[lead chucker]

I have one on the way Erik at hollow point mold service made one cavity into a hp he mailed it Monday I'm going to be shooting it in a 308 win so I'm happy you are having good results with it. I can't wait to start working up a load. Im hopping 2400 works I have lots of it. I want to get away from j bullets completely

[Dthunter]

I have one on the way Erik at hollow point mold service made one cavity into a hp he mailed it Monday I'm going to be shooting it in a 308 win so I'm happy you are having good results with it. I can't wait to start working up a load. Im hopping 2400 works I have lots of it. I want to get away from j bullets completely


If this bullet keeps shooting like it did the other day, i will be hugely happy!
My .308 has never had a jacketed round through it since I bought new.

[lead chucker]

I figure with a cup shaped hp it would be good for hunting Erik recommended it I think it would have more controlled expansion and even if the hp got torn off it would still have good cary through. I believe he is sending me three pin profiles so I can see what works. Should be fun. Plus I ordered a free checks II to make gas checks for it. Home made ammo from scratch. I hope to shoot a black bear with it this spring.

[Dthunter]

Thanks for the info!

No problem!
This cast shooting is fun and significantly challenging, "if" a casters goal is sub MOA accuracy.
But ALWAYS fun!
I will keep you guys posted if my next load trials mirror my last experiences.

[Dthunter]

Went out Saturday and confirmed the loads!
Shot 19.0 & 21.0grains of SR4759 again.
19.0= .775"
21.0= .985"
at 100yards.

I shot a boollet into some wood blocks from each load.
They expanded to .48", and .75" respectively.( at 100 yards)
About 11" penetration on dry Aspen.
Shot across grain, not length wise.
I am quite happy with that performance!

[atr]

that is nice !

[stronics]

That is some real nice shooting and manufacturing of the ammo.
Thanks for sharing,
David

[Dthunter]

A Lyman #311299 shooting update guys! :bigsmyl2:

Had some awsome fun today!
Shot at 200,300,400,500 & 600 yards with my #311299 200 Grain boolet.

Winchester Neck sized cases
Federal 210Match Primers

19.0 GR IMR SR4759

Lyman #31299 (18 pounds wheel weight alloy + 8 Feet of 50/50 Lead/Tin Solder)
Seated snuggly into the rifling.

Todays velocity reads 1741fps average(20shots) Two weeks ago,this load averaged 1691 fps.

Extream Spread: 39.0 fps

Standard Deviation: 8.66 fps

-2 degrees Celcius, and Cloudy, 2-3mph, wind from my back to target.


My groups are as follows:

200 yds= 1.5"

300 yds= 4.50"

400 yds= 4.25" (2 shots on plate + 1 on paper, as seen on the picture)

500 yds= 7.25"

600 yds= 8.0"

Wow! These are just dropping in there! I cant believe they are staying on target like this!
The boolet holes are still nice and round at 600. Indicating that the boolet is still stable.

I would have moved out further, but ran out of vertical elevation adjustment on my scope.
I guess I will be needing to purchasing a set of Burris Signature rings with the offset bushings to gain another 20 MOA or so. I wonder how far they will stay stable?

I tried another load with 35.0 Grains of Varget (2190 fps Average), 0.902" for 5 rounds!

I never expected to get this accuracy at this velocity with such a softish alloy!
No leading evident yet.

I recovered one of the boolets that hit my target at 600 yards. Talk about lucky!
It penetrated 4" of an Ash board after going through the target just above the gong.
I found it on top of the snow 60-70 yards down range of my backstop.

[Dthunter]

I wish I had more pictures to share guys!

Maybe next time, I will take more to share.

Straight shootin guys and keep it fun!

[TXGunNut]

Wow. Simply awesome.

[lead chucker]

Looks like you have that bullet mastered. So now what, maybe a new mold ?
I am very impressed with what you have going on there. What is your bore size on your 308?

[Dthunter]

Thanks for the encouragement TX Gun Nut & Lead chucker.

My bore measured out at .3005"
My groove diameter was a true .308

I think I got real lucky with my Lyman 311299 mould! It seems to have the dimensions my .308 likes.

I wonder if the lubed noses have anything to do with my consistancy? I will try some unlubed noses on my next test, to see if it has any affect one way or the other.

I bought a 311644, and a 311291 mould as well. the 311644 seems to cast at .309" and a .2985"nose.

The 311291 casts a .313 diameter and a .3025" nose. I havent shot the 311644 much yet, but I plan on trying it more soon.
If I can get a decent load at 100, I will try to stretch it out further as well.

The 311291 hasnt shot very well in my .308 "yet", but it shoots very well in my Ruger M77 Hawkeye 7.62x39. With the boolet seated to the rifling, it still feeds through the magazine! Groups around 1.25-1.5" at 100.

My .303 British Enfield shoots the 311291 into 2.5" or better at 100. That surprised me as well. I am using Trail Boss for that load.

This is getting funnnn! LOL!

Straight shootin guys, and keep it fun!

[Char-Gar]

About this 1.5" 200 yard group.

1. How many rounds in the group?
2. How many groups fired?
3. What is the average of the groups fired?

[RayinNH]

Charles you skeptic you.

[Dthunter]

Chr-Gar:

Valid questions you have there.

The 200 yard group was only 5 shots.

I would have shot more, but I never had enough ammo loaded to shoot more rounds per group.
I planned to reach out further that day, and the ammo I loaded would only go so far.

I had 8 different loads to try.
I shot one group of five shots each, that day for each load/each distance.

It is still just a start, but greatly encouraging non-the-less!

I went shooting today again. Great day to be shooting, a little windy, but not bad at all.

I will post a new thread to share the info. gathered today.

Bear in mind that I only have so much time to shoot and reload. I dont think I need to shoot 20+ rounds/group to make them valid.

I feel shooting the same load at least for 5 rounds gives a small window of a loads potential.
Shoot this load over four or five different days, and this gives you more pieces of the puzzle.
This is where I am at right now.

If the load performs on well on at least 4-5 different days, I get a little more serious with the fine tuning from there.

This is fun stuff!

Straight shootin guys!

[Char-Gar]

Well, not really a skeptic. I don't doubt the number, but I do doubt it represent the real accuracy level of the rifle and load. I use the average of 4 consecutive 10 shot groups when I determine such a number. A one time three shot group, really means very little.

If the rifle and load in question would deliver 1.5" 200 yard 10 shot groups on demand, I would be most impressed.

I am not trying to downgrade the OPs results, just trying to place the numbers in context.

[Dthunter]

I totally agree Char-Gar, I havent been shooting this rifle long enough yet to give large scope results that you talk about. Just give me time to accumulate it.

I am hoping that my loading practices/procedures will find a consistantly long term, accurate load similar to the ones I recently got at 200 yards.

If you look at my results I posted tonight on another thread, you will get an idea of the cross section of loads I am looking at. Some loads are higher velocity, others lower. I will consistantly post my groups and experiences as time goes by. You can take what contexts you like as I post my results from time to time.

I will try to continue to improve the load performances. And hope to find more good , consistant loads.

I am a very experienced shooter, who has shot out to 1000,1760+ yards many times with Jacketed ammo (many calibers). This cast shooting is a whole new challenge! I Love this sport!

Char-Gar, or WHO EVER, if you think you can give me ideas to improve, go ahead! I love learning and pushing myself to improve! Thats why I am a member here.

I hope to reach out to 800 yards+ with my 308Win and cast boolets some day! That will not be too long from now I figure!

Straight shootin, and keep it fun guys!
This certainly will take time.

[Char-Gar]

Dthunder.. It seems to me you are on the right track and I can only encourage you to continue on in the direction you are heading. For a rifle to turn in the performance you want, the key is consistancy, even in the small things. Sooner or later than will mean weighing your bullets, neck turning your cases, uniforming your primer and all of the othe other tricks of precision shooting. The rifle will also be required to have the capability. This means a good barrel, crown, dead straight chamber etc. etc.

Like you, I have been at this riflecraft business for a very long time and have shot in many 4 position military matches out to 1,000 yards. After a while we turn to cast bullet because it opens up a whole new level of challenges. We can keep tinkering and tinkering all of our lives and never be "tinkered out".

This insanity may lead you to paper patching, which can boost the velocity and give you the wind bucking capability you need to shoot at longer range. You can still shoote at longer range with more traditional cast bullet velocites, but you will need to dope the wind with great precision and keep the bullet sonic all the way to the target. Here is where sectional density of the bullets will make a big difference.

Out of the several score of rifles I own, only one will deliver true sub-MOA accuracy as I undestand accuracy. It is a Remington 700 VS and this is with the factory Remington barrel. Remington is not known for their high quality barrels and when their custom shop builds a rifle for accuracy they don't use Remington barrels. I keep wondering what this rifle would do, if I installed a high quality cut-rifled barrel.

I first hit the prone postion, drew a tight sling and fired in competition in 1954 when I was 12 years old. That started a love afair with the rifle and riflecraft that is with me to this day.

I am not much shakes as a cast bullet theorist as science and math are not my joy. I am a windage and elevation kind of guy. I am only interested in the science in so far as it helps me to hit the target. Thankfully, we have some very good folks on this board who are good with the science stuff and can explain things.

The number of shooters in this country seems to be on the rise, but the number of riflemen is in sharp decline. It is good to see another rifleman on this board. There are several of us here.

Best of luck and best wishes as well.

[Dthunter]

Thankyou for your encouragement CHar Gar!

I am really pumped with this cast boolet shooting!

All of my brass has been weight segregated, trimmed,primer pockets uniformed, and segregated by wall thickness. Its a freakin lot of work, but it seems to be paying off so far.

When I cast a "lot" of boolets, I visually inspect, and weight segregate them as well.
I even go so far as file the bases perfectly flat to eliminate any imperfections on the sprue end.
This may be over kill, but it makes me feel confident in a solid/square release from the bore. I tend think this would aid a gascheck with full face support as well.

I have a question:

My alloy is: 18 pounds of wheel weight alloy +8 feet of 50/50 lead/tin solder.
The boolets that I have recovered so far seem to mushroom not too bad.
But i found a nose fragment yesterday. Looking at rhe fracture point, it is verysharp,jagged, and crystaline in shape. Is this typical with this kind of alloy?
The boolets hit the pallet , then ice/gravel behind the target.

[Char-Gar]

I am math challenged, so I would have to hire a 10 year old kid to come up with the composition of your alloy. But my best guess (and it is just a guess) that the crystaline structure you see is the antimony in the alloy. Your pretty much have to go to pure lead to be certain a bullet will mash and not break 100% of the time. I would not worry about it, as all that matters is how well the bullets play follow the leader to the target.