Guide to Hand Sorting Wheel Weights

[Revolver]

Guide to Hand Sorting Wheel Weights

As the industry replaces lead wheel weights with alternative materials you may wish to sort these items out.

Although WW can be separated by controlling heat sometimes it may be desirable to hand sort your wheel weights prior to melting . Some advantages of pre sorting this are:

• Less wasted energy going into your melt
• Less chance of accidentally getting zinc in your lead
• The ability to separate ZINC from STEEL for other reasons such as selling for scrap or using the Zinc for other projects.
• Separating stick ons (Typically softer and useful for other purposes)
• Removing other debris

The picture below are some common examples of wheel weights.

http://www.doaks.net/projects/guns/casting/wwguide/WW-Examples.jpg

http://www.doaks.net/projects/guns/casting/wwguide/WW-stickons.jpg

The two main designs of WW are Clip-on and Stick-on. Stick on WW are typically much softer lead than Clip ons and can be used for other purposes.

http://www.doaks.net/projects/guns/casting/wwguide/WW-ClipOn-vs-StickOn.jpg

There seem to be 5 materials that wheel weights are made from:

• Lead – USABLE
• Zinc – QUESTIONABLE USE or SCRAP
• Steel – NOT USABLE, SCRAP
• Composite – NOT USABLE - (highly flexible polymer composite stick on)
• Plastic – NOT USABLE

http://www.doaks.net/projects/guns/casting/wwguide/WW-Lead-Zinc-Steel-Composit.jpg

Be careful, some designs are the same but the materials are different:

http://www.doaks.net/projects/guns/casting/wwguide/WW-Lead-Zinc-Plastic.jpg

Composites have no apparent re-uses.

Common Methods of identification:

VISUAL IDENTIFICATION

After a little experience you should be able to sort WW visually with a good degree of accuracy. After using other methods to accurately ID various types of wheel weights you will learn which is which. Assuming you have no previous experience, here are some other methods of visually determining the make up of wheel weights.

LEAD: Look for deformation, gouges, deep scratches, and scarring, these generally only occur on lead. I also have never seen a WW labeled “Micro” that wasn’t lead.

http://www.doaks.net/projects/guns/casting/wwguide/WW-Lead-Scarring.jpg

ZINC: Look for the label Z or Zn (except when used as "oz" specifying weight, which can be lead) Some Zinc WW are not labeled and must be tested using other methods.

http://www.doaks.net/projects/guns/casting/wwguide/WW-Similar-Zinc-Lead.jpg

http://www.doaks.net/projects/guns/casting/wwguide/WW-unmarkedzinc.jpg

STEEL: The easiest to identify and poses no risk if a mistake is made. Typically marked "Fe" and always have the printing stamped (recessed) into the material.


CRIMPING/CUTTING IDENTIFICATION

When in question lead can always be confirmed with a pair of cutters. Lead is the only type of WW that you will be able to cut a notch into without much trouble. I prefer to use a large set of cutters as it provides more leverage and better feedback with less work. Zinc and Steel will not give the same results.

(See image further down)

AUDIBLE IDENTIFICATION

Lead can be differentiated from Zinc and Steel by tapping it against a hard object and listening to the sound. This works best with large and medium size WW but becomes less reliable with smaller ones. Holding the WW limp tap it against a heavy hard object (I use a large chunk of steel). Lead will make a dull thud, steel and zinc will make a higher pitch pinging noise.


SCRATCHING IDENTIFICATION

Sometimes scratching is a quick way to confirm lead. Instead of taking the time to use cutters simply drag its edge against the edge of something hard. if it feel soft and you end up with a nice shiny line then it's lead. If it's noisy, you can feel it grinding, and there is not a generous amount of shiny metal exposed then it's probably not lead.

http://www.doaks.net/projects/guns/casting/wwguide/WW-Tap-Scratch.jpg


MAGNET IDENTIFICATION

Lead, Zinc, and Steel WW all have steel clips that will be attracted to a magnet, so you can't very well use a magnet to pull out all your steel WW. A magnet is good for confirming your suspicions about questionable wheel weights. Check the end of the WW (farthest from the clip) against a magnet to test it.
Lead and Zinc are not attracted to magnets (but remember, their clips are).

WEIGHT IDENTIFICATION

Most WW are labeled with a weight. Zinc and Steel are significantly lighter than. If you are questioning the composition of a WW simply compare size and/or weight against a known WW.

ACID IDENTIFICATION

It is said that Zinc will react to muriatic acid (and perhaps others) and that lead will not. I have not tried this. It has been used to test if there is any amount of Zinc alloyed into your alloy.

SAFETY

Wheel weights are dirty and poisonous. Your health is priceless escpecially vs. a bunch of filthy dog pee covered lead. Besides the hazards of lead they may also be contaminated from brake dust, road grime, and tire shop junk. Some examples to consider are:

Lead dust
Brake dust
Asbestos
Dog Urine
Tobacco Spit
Cigarette Butts
Razor Blades
Any other garbage or junk

I wear gloves and a quality respirator (3M with P100 Filters, under $15 shipped on ebay). I also cover my work surface with cardboard that can be disposed of and keep my “lead working clothes” in a sealed tote so that it doesn’t contaminate anything in the house or get mixed with the laundry. Of course don’t eat, rub your eyes, pick your nose, pet the cat, pick the cat's nose, etc. I simply keep the frame of mind that I am contaminating anything I touch. When sorting WW the dust will get on you, take a shower and change your clothes when you are done!

Some of my videos related to lead, smelting, wheel weights, etc. can be found on my youtube channel at:

http://www.youtube.com/mainejunker

DISCLAIMER: I hate disclaimers and think people should use common sense. This is a compilation of information that I have learned, there are no guarantees the information is accurate. Do your own research especially where safety is concerned. Only you are responsible for yourself!

I welcome anyone to correct or add information to this thread.

I also put together a video with tips on where to find lead. Maybe it will help some fellow forum members.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4KmaXfoIKE

http://www.doaks.net/projects/videos/how-to-find-lead-embed-thumbnail.jpg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4KmaXfoIKE)

[clodhopper]

This post screams STICKEY! nice primer for the casters just trying muddle through melting wheelweights.
Thanks

[LatheRunner]

Very well put together. This will help alot of people.

LatheRunner

[Lefty SRH]

Wow, sorting is what I'm doing now.

I ma getting A LOT of the stick on style lead WW. Should these be set aside from the lead clip on WW when its time to smelt down?

[Revolver]

...I ma getting A LOT of the stick on style lead WW. Should these be set aside from the lead clip on WW when its time to smelt down?

I would, and I am. The stick ons are supposedly much softer. I have been setting them aside in case my future needs require a softer alloy.

[alamogunr]

I always separate the lead stick-ons from the lead clip-ons. I can always put them back in later if I don't use them in muzzleloader balls. This is what I probably will do since I normally buy the swaged balls for the rifle and the Old Army.

[wtfooptimax200]

Awesome post....definitely worthy of a sticky. It's funny because while sorting wheelweights earlier today I thought how useful it would be to have a compilation of a bunch of wheelweight photos to show beginners....then BINGO you made this post. Way to go!

Branden

[bumpo628]

Very nice work; it should definitely be a sticky.

[BulletFactory]

Sticky

[engine4on]

Great post! I always sort my wheel weights!

[Lefty SRH]

Are the stick on WW pure lead? Or atleast ideal for muzzleloaders? Guess I have to go back thru them again!

[williamwaco]

Junker !

That is probably the best single post I have ever seen.
This is a complete thread in a single post.

I understand the amount of work it took to do it.

Thank you so much.


.

[biscot]

Very enlightening. Thank you for this post.
I have no problem whatsoever with paying $1/lb. for WW lead to those forum members who gather these, sort them, smelt them, pack them, mail them, etc., and am very grateful for the effort they put in to do it. Makes casting and reloading look simple by comparison.

[Lefty SRH]

Ive run across another zinc weight (I think) that in unmarked and is a stick on.

Junker, can I email a pic of it to you so you can post it?

[Dean D.]

I just saw this post and agree that it should be a sticky. Done deal. Thanks Junker!

[41mag]

Hey Junker, your the man, great post.

Thanks for your time and effort putting this all together.

[Revolver]

Ive run across another zinc weight (I think) that in unmarked and is a stick on.

Junker, can I email a pic of it to you so you can post it?

I think it would be a great idea for people to add pictures to this thread.

Does anyone know if there storage available to host pics on this site or do they have to be linked in from elsewhere?

[clintsfolly]

Well Done Junker You are a asset to the group Thanks Clint

[Lefty SRH]

I'll dig thru the scrap box and see if I can find one.

[twkilmer]

great job this is a big help to us newbies.seen the youtube video.that was good also.thanks tk.sticky for sure.

[a.squibload]

I think it would be a great idea for people to add pictures to this thread.

Does anyone know if there storage available to host pics on this site or do they have to be linked in from elsewhere?

I found this in "FAQ" near top of any page, also click on "Image Hosting":
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/faq.php?faq=vb3_user_profile#faq_vb3_albums

Or you can start a free Google account and pile LOTS of pics there,
other free providers offer storage you can link to.

By the way, GOOD JOB!

Now for the dark side of WW collecting:

These WWs are not suitable for casting as they present a hazard when
dropping them into the pot:
https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-oyczrAKVrgo/TxOqpIeEGDI/AAAAAAAAAWI/rp_wcSJ4S5k/s640/DSCF0007.JPG
Arranged in weight order L to R, L side is 4 oz, R side is 10 oz.
Should you find any of these nasty things PM me for the address of the TLWDC
(Too Large WW Disposal Center).

Of course, it's my address...:wink:

[jeeedbb]

Nice post - Thanks

[badbob454]

great pics i was going to do something like it now, cool i dont have to

[TJD]

Up until 13 years ago I poured many boolits. But jobs and life as I knew it changed. My re-entry into the world of melting Wheel Weights was for fishing sinkers. Something was wrong. Thanks to you I now know about the off brand WWs that have been added in the years I was away. I sorted them and my boolits are working well.
THANK YOU

[canyon-ghost]

A good idea, for those of you that might wash the clothes you wear while smelting: High phoshate dishwashing detergent is said to take the lead out. You'll have to wash them twice, or two cycles through the washer because the stuff is slimy feeling.

My two cents worth!

[Vly]

Tip of the cap to Junker for this post. Thanks for the time and effort involved in putting this together. Very nice job!

[mrbillbus]

Question about stick on wheel weights. I have separated them but I noticed two different types. One is flat and soft and very easy to bend. The other is like little cast bricks. They are painted and appear to be just like the painted COWW in the bucket. Are they all soft lead or just the flat ones?

Besides boolits, I want to make some decoy strap weights for my brother. They need to be pure soft lead so that he can bend them many times without breaking them. If the painted stick ons aren't soft lead then I don't wan them in my decoy mix.

Thx
Bill

[cf_coder]

The little bricks are likely steel. I've just started hand sorting a bunch of mine here and have been running across a lot of them. Use pliers or wire cutters to separate the lead from the others. Then use a magnet. That will quickly separate the steel from the zinc ones.

I keep mine separate by type (lead/steel/zinc). Just never know when we might end up having to cast zinc bullets...

Cheers!

[bumpo628]

Question about stick on wheel weights. I have separated them but I noticed two different types. One is flat and soft and very easy to bend. The other is like little cast bricks. They are painted and appear to be just like the painted COWW in the bucket. Are they all soft lead or just the flat ones?

Besides boolits, I want to make some decoy strap weights for my brother. They need to be pure soft lead so that he can bend them many times without breaking them. If the painted stick ons aren't soft lead then I don't wan them in my decoy mix.

Thx
Bill

I have seen the little painted weights you're talking about and they are harder than pure lead. I would throw those in with the clip on weights.

[dRok]

http://i21.photobucket.com/albums/b287/keredeht/054.jpg

Here are a few of my big weights, largest in picture is 16oz. Lots of 10's in that pile!

[Flintlock Hokie]

Is that a problem? That may be what caused the thick layer of foamy gray stuff on top of my lead when smelting WWs today. I just scooped it off but I had not seen this before. (I'm VERY new to this and have only smelted twice before and that was with only 10 lbs of lead.) Thanks.

[a.squibload]

Could be a problem, if there's too much zinc the melt won't pour right, etc.
Search for zinc here, there are multiple threads about contamination & removal.
Sort WWs first, and keep your pot below 700º, I think that's the zinc melting point.
Then the zinc weights will float and you can pick 'em out.
I thought I had 'em all sorted out last batch, still had a few float up.

[fishindad]

Great post. I wish I had read this before doing my recent smelting!

[alamogunr]

Great post. I wish I had read this before doing my recent smelting!

I cleaned up my first batch of WW about 20 years ago. This site didn't exist then. If the AIMOO site was around then, I didn't know about it. Thankfully there were very few, if any, zinc weights then. I cranked the flame up and had no idea what the temperature was. Luckily the cast iron dutch oven didn't get red hot but I sure did sweat.

Since then I have learned by experience and reading this site. My stash of approx. 2 tons will last as long as I will so I don't anticipate lighting off that propane flame except on the plumbers pot for ladle casting.

[handloder]

An anecdote: My tire shop mechanics told me that this zinc wheelweight issue started in Europe. Apparently the greenies forced the European car manufacturers to develop tire styles/shapes that could be balanced with zinc only weights. Presumeably, substituting our American lead weights would void the European car warranties. Don't know about the Japanese or Korean cars...anybody know for sure? Possibly American cars shipped to Europe have to have zinc weights to pass European import rules...another European trade restriction on American products!

[NLS1]

What a wonderful post to start this thread!

Thanks for the effort, it will help this new boolit caster to not screw it up!

Dan

[One Gun Andy]

Great job, Junker! I am new to casting and this post will be an invaluable resource. My last attempt to produced WW ingots resulted in my introduction to contamination via zinc. Thank you very much for the time and effort you've put into this post. You've done many of us a big favor!

[AlabamaEd]

Great post. I sorted a bunch of WW today. Had several zinc WW. The zinc clips are different from the lead WW. The zinc clips appear to be held on with little rivits and not molded in as are lead WW. For sure they float to the top.

[cf_coder]

In my experience, the zinc ones look very similar to the lead with the clip being cast into the weight, the steel weights look like the clip is riveted on. But that's just my experience. Did you take a magnet to those weights?

[Fredx10sen]

Very nice Post and I thank you for your hard work. I have a sorting section in my smelting area consisting of a very large cookie sheet that I dump a large amount of WW on. Using side cutters is slow but very effective. If I can't cut into the WW and leave a mark, then it doesn't make it into the pot. Here in Ca. they are coming up with a lot of new WW designs so having this post to add to is really great. Again, Thanks :)

[RobsTV]

Any issues with using a hardness tester for fool proof testing?
It would seem to work, but is there any chance that small amounts of zinc would be used in some weights, which wouuld increase hardness a little?

Most "stick on" wheel weights I just finished testing showed anywhere from less than 6 to 8 BHN. However, all the stick on wheel weights that match the image in the first set of photos, 3rd from the right in stick on lead picture section, measure 11.5 BHN, or around what you would expect for good clip on wheel weights. I had not seen any mention of stick on wheel weights being as good as clip on wheel weights, and it seemed most would simply throw the SOWW aside for soft lead applications. The weights obtained were from a new car dealership, and these 11.5 BHN made up around 20% of the total SOWW received that day.

[gideons301]

I test all of my clip-on wheel weights with a large pair of compound leverage wire cutters. I grab close to the clip, and if it is lead I cut it off both sides of the clip sorting the ends from the clips.I have 4 containers, 1 for non-lead, one for steel that I am confident are steel, one for the lead clips, and the last for weight ends. This way I can melt without skimming clips most of the time, and do the clips in a separate batch when the mews strikes me to do so!:D My 2 cents worth

[geargnasher]

Dust mask and tough Nitrile mechanic's disposable gloves or dishwashing gloves are also a must. Oh, and a cold beverage of your choice, covered to protect from dust during sorting.

Gear

[Jaybird62]

I posted on here recently that I throw the painted stick-on lead weights with my clip-ons. I found a few ingots from the painted lead stickies under my bench today and read my notes that say that their hardness is 9+ BHN. My clip-ons range from 12.5 to 14 in hardness. My non-painted stickies are pretty close to pure Pb, and are in the 5-6 BHN range.

[Tinbullet]

A buddy that I cast bullets for brought me 60 lbs. of wheel weights. So from this thread I gather that lead WW's will cut with tin snips or side cutters, lead goes thud and zinc goes tink. Either may be painted, pure lead should melt before zinc so zinc WW's should float to the top of a melt, and finally some forms of WW's may be harder than others so sorting is needed for that also. Did I miss anything? OH! And its all toxic! I use to change tires at a VW dealer. OMG All of the WW's that I could have had!

[tmattox]

I'm going to be melting wheel weights for the 1st time tomorrow. I've already seperated the zinc and steel out and am only using clip on WW. How do I flux this in order to retain the tin? Sine I've never done this before, explain in simple terms. I've gotsome Frankford arsenal flux to use. I'll be using a 20 lb lee pot and will be making ingots.

[Smokin7mm]

tmattox,
I would not use your casting pot for raw WW to make ingots. Leaves a mess out of your pot. I would get an old cast iron pot or some other steel pot to do the bulk melting down over a propane burner and pour into ingots from that. Then use the casting pot for the clean lead. Fluxing is simple and there are lots of things you can use. Once you have the WW melted, skim off the clips and junk. Add fluxing material per instructions if you are using commercial stuff and stir. All the dross will come to the top to be skimmed off.
Bret

[rmatchell]

I agree with smokin7mm. You can go to walmart and pick up a 7 dollar stainless pot and melt all at once. easy to clean and cast from.

[LightsOutND]

Thanks to everyone, especially Revolver for the great info and pics. I am a newbie too and just got hold of about 200 lbs of WW's. They sorted out to be about 95%+ usable, the remainder being about evenly split between zinc and steel/iron. Most of mine run bigger than the ones in the pics, I think they are probably from semi's and tractors as I got them from the Farmer's Union, and they work on a lot of bigger equipment there. I am especially glad to find out that the stick-on's are a different alloy, I thought so when I was sorting them. I separated them, but what can I use them for? I have about 40 lb's of antimonial lead a friend of mine purchased from a metal distributor. I guess it's just lead and antimony. Could I possibly use some of the stick-on weights with some of this to come up with a suitable alloy for casting boolits for either rifle or pistol? Or lacking that, does anyone know of a use for antimonial lead or have a recipe for using it in a good alloy?

[jcharb]

real good infromative article

[bumpo628]

I have about 40 lb's of antimonial lead a friend of mine purchased from a metal distributor. I guess it's just lead and antimony. Could I possibly use some of the stick-on weights with some of this to come up with a suitable alloy for casting boolits for either rifle or pistol? Or lacking that, does anyone know of a use for antimonial lead or have a recipe for using it in a good alloy?

All lead is useful in one way or another. If you know the composition, then even more so. A lot of people in this forum mix clip-on and stick-on WWs 50/50 and then add some tin to improve fillout when casting for low velocity pistol calibers. You could also mix the antimonial lead and stick-on WWs 50/50 and add some tin to see how that casts.

Antimonial lead is usually 5% antimony and the rest lead. Stick-on WWs are nearly pure lead with maybe a little tin mixed in. You can check out the alloy calculator in my signature to mix the components that you have on hand into your desired recipe.

[Revolver]

My biggest stash of lead a sailboat keel that is 97% lead and 3% antimony. I add pewter to it as Tin, seems to work good so far but still experimenting.

[OnceFired]

Just wanted to say thank you for such a thorough method to identify wheel weights. I used the info here and followed closely, and out of an entire 5 gallon bucket I hand sorted, I only missed a single steel wheel weight. I missed zero on zinc. Great write up - very practical and useful.

[RG1911]

A couple days ago I sorted 152 pounds of wheel weights. Some were easily identified as lead because they were scratched or gouged. After testing quite a few, I noticed that any weights labeled MC or MICRO were lead. For the rest I had to use the cutter method.

I'm a little curious about how accurate the cutter method is because a number of weights that looked like a couple of the examples of zinc weights (painted an off-white) were relatively easy to cut. So I tossed them into the pot. The weights that were labeled Zn were barely scratched by the cutter.

I also have a number of weights labeled AL-MC and AW-MC, or AL or AW alone, that could be grooved fairly easily with the cutters. I would like to make sure that the AL doesn't stand for aluminum.

Thank you,
Richard

[SlippShodd]

I also have a number of weights labeled AL-MC and AW-MC, or AL or AW alone, that could be grooved fairly easily with the cutters. I would like to make sure that the AL doesn't stand for aluminum.Thank you, Richard

I recently sorted and smelted 2 5-gallon buckets of weights given to me by a cousin that works for a tire shop. I'll ask him to be certain, but I'm pretty sure those designations are to indicate that the weights are safe to put on aluminum or alloy wheels, rather than content of the weights. They alloyed up just fine; I too got by with only a couple steel weights making it into the smelt, and no zinc.

mike

[NLS1]

Hey thanks again for the great thread, as I have been smelting lately it was great to read all that awhile back to start out with. Only a couple bad ones snuck in after sorting, and because I was watching temp, it was no big deal.

Dan

[LocoFixersbetterhalf]

Thank you so much for the information.

Amy

[fishnhunt]

Richard,
The letters you are seeing: AL, MC, AW, P, FN - all of those are the style of weight, it fits a certain style of wheel. Wheel weights are not made of aluminum, though many wheels are. The function of a wheel weight is to add weight to the wheel to balance it properly. Aluminum is lighter and more expensive than steel - therefore not cost effective to use for wheel weights. Most zinc weights are marked with a "ZN" which stands for Zinc. Most steel weights are marked with "FE".

[Brahma]

Thanks for making this guide. It will definitely speed sorting up quite a bit.

[badbob454]

if you miss one zinc it will float on top if you slowly heat up the melt if you see all melted exept one or two, pull them out and re check them m probably missed them , easy to do if sorting 3 5 gallon buckets in a day ..

[Sledster]

My first post here.

Thanks Junker for the detailed description that you gave.

I spent a half day sorting WW's with a friend last weekend.
Of the roughly 120 lbs of WW's we were only rewarded with 20 or so lbs of lead WW's.
That was a bit disappointing, but I still have a few hundred lbs left to sort, so not a total loss.

Is this the same kind of results everyone else has? Maybe I am going to the wrong places.

I have a question...Does anyone simply augment their purchased Lyman #2 with WW material to adjust hardness? What proportions are used?

Thanks to all for this fine forum.

Sledster

[dRok]

My WW still run about 85-90% lead. Picked up another 200lbs this weekend for $40... :drinks:

[joes29729]

You can scratch them on an old piece of wood and the lead will leave a nice lead line and a shiny spot on the weight. Be careful though because I have had zincs leave a line also but it is much fainter and doesn't leave a shiny spot on the WW.

[JWFilips]

My WW still run about 85-90% lead. Picked up another 200lbs this weekend for $40... :drinks:

It's funny; If you hit the small country service stations you get a good yield of lead COWW however get the city & town tire centers & it's a **** shoot! More often the not it's 50/50 or less ( lead) You can really see by the volume the industry is trying to go green

[Neo]

Great post I have gained allot of useful information now I have to do some sorting. :castmine:

[clemedc]

What happens if you accidentally melt ZINC into your lead?
I have no idea how hot my pot is as I use a camp stove with unleaded gas to melt lead. Kinda ironic aint it.

[khmer6]

Thanks for the guide. Got 80% yield

[khmer6]

I don't know if it was this thread or another, but someone had mentioned if the markings are embossed and not engraved it is lead. I just went through a new bucket and there do was definitely some embossed zinc. I checked and older bucket that was alreasy sorted, same findings. Definitely very few zin prices that have their markings embossed.

[JWFilips]

Side nippers tell the truth...the only sure path!

[40Super]

Yep, the snippers easily and quickly tell you which are lead and which are zinc .

[psychicrhino]

Was glad to see the pic of the white stick on zinc. I had put some in my questionable pile.

[Cowboy T]

I just processed two full 5-gal buckets. When I was done, I had maybe five muffin ingots.

Yeah. Five ingots.

I just started picking them out by hand. It was faster that way and uses way less propane.

From now on, it's reclaimed range lead. Good thing I got mine while I could.

[JeffG]

Great thread. I icked up a 5 gal bucket today, felt like it weigh at least 100lb. Sorted and casted about 22 lb of ingots. The pictures and side cutter test was very helpful. The few that contained zinc were pretty obvious when you tried to cut it. Had a lot with a coating of what I'd assume was paint, to make then look better on wheels I suppose?

[JeffG]

I should say that's about 22 lb so far. There' a lot to smelt yet. I appear to have gotten a high percentage of PB WW.

[Larry D.]

Great guide.
Sitting here sorting at 9PM.......
I'm scratch testing with the handle of a tablespoon, and it seems to be working.

[Airman Basic]

Just now perusing threads at Castboolits concerning whys and wherefores of wheelweights. I have several 5 gallon buckets of wheelweights which I regularly mix with my pretty much inexhaustible supply of linotype and monotype. (used to be in the newspaper business) Was wondering when the wheelweights started being adulterated with zinc, plastic, et al. The last time I scrounged for WW metal was 20 years ago, so my supply is at least that old. Should I be worried about my WWs?

[alamogunr]

My guess is that you can rest easy. I cleaned up my first 15-20 buckets of WW about 20 years ago before I knew anything about zinc contamination. I didn't have a thermometer either and just jacked up the heat until everything melted and then turned it down so I didn't run out of propane. Those ingots are what I have been using so far with a little addition of range scrap. Most of the problems I have are cold mold and possibly oil in the mold. So far I have been able to fix those problems by going back to square one.

[Dannmann801]

Scored my first batch of ww tonite and came here and searched "sorting lead wheelweights"
Found this thread, and I'm happy that I did. I'm already familiar with some of the author's videos, and saying thanks for sharing.
Started sorting them tonite, and I'm seeing mostly lead....small lead ones...most of the larger ones are marked Zn and Fe

[pathdoc]

Excellent post, thank you, and very useful to newbie me, who has a big box of wheelweights and must now sort out the wheat from the (I fear very plentiful) chaff. I had considered a hammer test for the unlabelled ones (most of them!). My logic: if it deforms easily, it's lead; if not, it's zinc or steel. If it smashes, it's plastic.

Has anyone else tried this? If it doesn't work, why not, and I'll go out and buy the cutters. :)

[Steven]

I just processed two full 5-gal buckets. When I was done, I had maybe five muffin ingots.

Yeah. Five ingots.

I just started picking them out by hand. It was faster that way and uses way less propane.

From now on, it's reclaimed range lead. Good thing I got mine while I could.

I'm in SLC and when I pick up a bucket of WW's they average 70% lead vs Zinc/Steel. I think it may vary from state to state considering states like California and Florida are bent on going green with everything. Here's another factor to consider, I'm hearing guys are sorting through buckets taking out most of the lead, leaving SOME and then selling em for WW value n keeping the lead for themselves or someone else they know. I'm also hearing guys that have multiple hook ups at tire shops will ask the shop owners to spread rumors that the lead is pretty much depleted so folk won't bother hunting for lead, this does 2 things: 1.) Gets people to leave tire shops alone 2.) Allows the guys who want lead to horde it for themselves. Here's my evidence, I went to two independent tire shops, 1 told me this "You can go back there if you want, there's two 5 gallon buckets full for ya to sort through, but the last guy who did that only walked out with a handful of lead" and after searching it, he was right, I later on found out the guy deliberately did that to keep people from bugging em while he had his mechanics trained to discern the lead from zinc/steel and they were throwing the lead in a different bucket. The second shop I went to just down the street let me have dibs on all theirs (the owner knows me anyways, I keep him hooked up with boolits), and so far I'm finding plenty of lead ones. Here's another one to consider, I went to multiple car dealerships and looked at their brand new WW's, they were all lead. So lead is still in the market, but that market may very from state to state. My 2 cents.

Steven

[Lights]

Just got done sorting half of a 5 gallon bucket. 90% of it was lead. So I would say, lead is still king here in MN.:grin:

[badbob454]

sort out the zinc , and find shady grady , he will swap sorted zinc only wheel weights and send you good lead in ingots or muffin cone shapes i have sent him over 200 lbs , always treated me right sent me back the same .. good guy .... my way to sort zinc is the scratch test and concrete , if it looks like it may be zinc scratch it on the sidewalk it will make a hi pitched chalk sound a lead ww will sound a little duller , the rest you can try with side cutters , takes a little longer but very accurate , or look for a z at the end of the name like regZ or a zn on the clip . takes some practice but after 30 - m40 buckets you get to recognize the fe ,iron...the zn ,zinc... and the pb lead alloy good shootin ...badbob

[fastfire]

I'm just getting started casting bullets, been pouring sinkers for 20+ YEARS, i HAVE PLENTY OF SOFT LEAD.
dO THE WHEEL WEIGHTS HAVE ANTIMONY IN THEM AS TO MAKE THEM HARDER?
What % of ww do you use for bullets, I going to cats for 9mm,45,and 300 BLK

Thanks

[Fugowii]

I picked up a box of these at the dump today (including some weights) and thought this information might be of interest.

http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i227/BP_2006/WheelWeightIdentification_2a_zps0ee5af2d.jpg

http://i73.photobucket.com/albums/i227/BP_2006/WheelWeightIdentification_1a_zps23043563.jpg

[brassballs]

Yes! Most run 3% but some older ones can be as high as 5% ANTIMONY.

Just Say'n


I'm just getting started casting bullets, been pouring sinkers for 20+ YEARS, i HAVE PLENTY OF SOFT LEAD.
dO THE WHEEL WEIGHTS HAVE ANTIMONY IN THEM AS TO MAKE THEM HARDER?
What % of ww do you use for bullets, I going to cats for 9mm,45,and 300 BLK

Thanks

[jonp]

The video at the beginning looks great but has no sound

[1bilmr59]

Good Job I like this a lot of info

[BoolitBullet]

Thank you for posting this. I am just getting into casting and this will be a great help. BTW, if you come across any more free junk sail boats and you don't feel like breaking in down, send it my way ;)

[mikeym1a]

I'm just getting started casting bullets, been pouring sinkers for 20+ YEARS, i HAVE PLENTY OF SOFT LEAD.
dO THE WHEEL WEIGHTS HAVE ANTIMONY IN THEM AS TO MAKE THEM HARDER?
What % of ww do you use for bullets, I going to cats for 9mm,45,and 300 BLK

Thanks
Yes, the antimony in WW's does make the alloy harder, so does the tin. '...What % of WW...' Depends on what you mean. The precentages of #2, as listed in my 1951 Ideal Handbook, are 90% lead, 5% tin, and 5% antimony. The Lyman manual says to use 9lbs of WW's and 1/2lb of lead, and 1/2lb of tin. This is supposed to bring the alloy up close to the Lyman #2 alloy in percentages. So, from this standpoint, it's 90 %. (Oh, Lyman bought out Ideal) Darn, my brain just went for a walk. Can't remember what the other use of 'percentage' was that I was going to use. I have Lead (pure), Tin (pure), and antimony (pure). The antimony is a bother to get mixed into the alloy. I've been reading on it, but, haven't figured it out yet. all that to say, I can mix any alloy I want. I also have linotype alloy, and foundry type metal that I can add to the mix. But presently, my wheelweight alloy, mixed as per the Lyman manual, is my source for daily shooting. I just got another 85lbs of WW today. Smelted about 50lbs this evening before the light went away. Got ~41lbs of refined alloy. Will do the rest tomorrow, weather permitting. Hope this rambling answer is of some help. [smilie=s:

[Garyshome]

Thanks for the info. What a time saver it is.

[RogerDat]

Thanks for the original post. Seems that I recall lead will leave a black streak on paper/cardboard. I just checked a "micro" wheel weight and confirmed this. Steel won't mark not sure about zinc.

[RogerDat]

If diag. wire cutters can leave a cut mark it's not zinc? I have a bunch of coww that while they will take a cut are clearly harder than those labeled "micro".

I have many coww that appear to have a coating, almost like plastic are they ok to smelt? I'm guessing that the coating may be to protect aluminum and alloy rims. But not sure what happens when it's thrown in the pot with that coating. These also tend to be the ones that are harder to cut into with my diag cutter. If I rub the coating off with a bit of emery cloth they do leave a black streak on wood.

Just smelted 60lbs of scrap lead into ingots so am anxious to get some ww lead to mix in and get some hardened ingots suitable for casting. Going to be above 30 this weekend so going to want to go for it when it won't be painful to open the garage door for ventilation. Doing the ingots was a blast, can't wait to cast some actual boolits.

As a side note anyone have any "best" ways to clean these ww's up? I'm thinking oil, grease, etc. is to be avoided when casting so they should probably be cleaned first... and I know DW will not be amused if I use the dishwasher :shock:

[catman81056]

Just throw them in the pot as is, it will smoke a lot but it will cook out the paint, oil and unwanted grime. Just flux a few times and skim the clips and such off. That's what I do anyways.

[KingAirNeal]

Hello all, first post, been lurking the last couple weeks.

Sold the boat, bought a 1911 for me and an XDs in 9mm for the wife. Changed hobbies, decided to shoot instead of sail. Also decided I am going to reload to make it more affordable, and while I am at it, I might as well cast too. So...

I looked on CL, found a guy trading WW for ??? and did a deal. Traded a 410 breech single shot shot gun for 600 pounds of mixed WW.
I got a heck of a deal!

Here is the breakdown after the sort.

495 pounds total lead. 450 clip on, 45 stick on.
65 pounds steel (Fe)
28 pounds Zinc
rest was trash... valve stems cigarette butts etc.
I expect to loose some more when we smelt to ingots in clip weight, and mis-sort. I am sure I missed some unmarked Zinc.

I used the techniques on the video in the OP, and it worked well. Took about 6 man hours to sort. My back is NOT happy with me right now!

Looking forward to getting these WW's into ingots, and sometime in the next month or so, casting into usable boolits! Still doing my research on here for what molds to buy, boolit shape, tumble lube? etc.

Leaning towards TC tumble lube 124g Lee for the 9mm and 230 tumble lube RN for the 45...
So much to read, so many different opinions, hard to decide.

I'll keep y'all posted how much we get from the smelt in finished ingots.

[Frag]

I'm new and this is awesome. Answered a lot of my questions.

[SpudRider]

I just went through 15 gallons worth of wheel weights I picked up from a local tire shop. Talk about disappointment. I ended up with about 2.5 gal worth of lead. I've never seen so dang much steel. Anyone else experienced this? I live in Idaho.

[flyingmonkey35]

I just picked up my 1st 5 gal bucket of ww for 35 Bucks.

Wish me luck

104193

[RedHawk357Mag]

Here is a pic of some plastic Wheel Weights I haven't seen before. Would think they would cause a sticky mess in a pot.
Stats of last buy in Colorado Springs CO:
330lbs of WW hand sorted 240.4 lbs of COWW 48.2 lbs of SOWW 41.4 lbs of steel zinc and other trash104651

[pathdoc]

Awesome post, and thank you. I have been sitting on my WW afraid to wonder what was in them, but did the snipper test tonight on a new acquisition and most of it cuts or deforms neatly.

Observations from a newbie:

1) The hard plastic coating on some COWW distorts the ease of the cut test.
2) Even aside from this, some COWW that can be cut, are harder than others.
3) Following on from #2 above, I wonder what would happen if you went to the trouble of sorting out WW by appearance and then did a hardness test (even as simple as with a Lee hardness tester) on the resultant ingots? Has anyone tried this? Ultimately I'm not sure i care; if some of the WW have a higher antimony content, this will help the whole batch be harder, which is not a bad thing.

As a last resort, I can always go to Rotometals or one of the other companies. But for now, I am content to scrounge. :)

[alamogunr]

Awesome post, and thank you. I have been sitting on my WW afraid to wonder what was in them, but did the snipper test tonight on a new acquisition and most of it cuts or deforms neatly.

Observations from a newbie:

1) The hard plastic coating on some COWW distorts the ease of the cut test.
2) Even aside from this, some COWW that can be cut, are harder than others.
3) Following on from #2 above, I wonder what would happen if you went to the trouble of sorting out WW by appearance and then did a hardness test (even as simple as with a Lee hardness tester) on the resultant ingots? Has anyone tried this? Ultimately I'm not sure i care; if some of the WW have a higher antimony content, this will help the whole batch be harder, which is not a bad thing.

As a last resort, I can always go to Rotometals or one of the other companies. But for now, I am content to scrounge. :)

There is still a big difference in the effort required to cut between coated WW and zinc WW. I use a thermometer and keep the temp below 700ºF. The zinc(& steel) WW come out with the clips.

[RogerDat]

Awesome post, and thank you. I have been sitting on my WW afraid to wonder what was in them, but did the snipper test tonight on a new acquisition and most of it cuts or deforms neatly.

Observations from a newbie:

1) The hard plastic coating on some COWW distorts the ease of the cut test.
2) Even aside from this, some COWW that can be cut, are harder than others.
3) Following on from #2 above, I wonder what would happen if you went to the trouble of sorting out WW by appearance and then did a hardness test (even as simple as with a Lee hardness tester) on the resultant ingots? Has anyone tried this? Ultimately I'm not sure i care; if some of the WW have a higher antimony content, this will help the whole batch be harder, which is not a bad thing.

As a last resort, I can always go to Rotometals or one of the other companies. But for now, I am content to scrounge. :)

There is probably some variation in alloy composition in WW's but shape can influence ease of cutting too. The ones with more of a block shape are harder to cut than the ones that are more tapered but I think that is mostly because the dikes are open wider when cutting the block shaped ones and you get less leverage at that part of the cutting stroke.

Larger the batch you melt the less deviation there will be from the individual weights. If you melted a 100 lbs of WW's in 5 lb. batches there would be more potential variation between each batch then if you did 2 50 lb. batches.

If you really wanted your WW's ingots to be consistent it would be easier than pre-sorting WW's if you re-melt and re-cast into ingots by selecting equal amounts from each batch. E.G if you did 5 batches at 50 lbs. into 10 lb. ingots then selected 1 ingot from each batch to melt into a 50 lb. batch and re-cast into smaller ingots for use. By taking same amount from each initial batch your final ingots should come out to be pretty consistent. Then you could test for specific hardness. Seems like a lot of work for plinking ammo, if it mattered that much probably better off selling the WW's and buying known alloys.

But then I tend to be getting lazy as I get older (or efficient depending on who you ask).

[pathdoc]

Like I said, in the end it's more of a theoretical question. For now I don't care; lead alloy is lead alloy, and everything I can get is going into the pot.

Your comment about the shape of the COWW is well made.

[Joe88XJ]

Great threar with lots of useful info! Thanks!

[lightman]

I just finished sorting between 1000&1200# of wheel weights. This thread was very helpful. After a while it gets easier, and faster, as you get familiar with the looks, shapes and sizes. Iron weights have a distinctive shape and the clips are usually riveted on. Zinc weights are harder to tell apart. They are usually a dull gray color, are hard to cut, and usually, but not always have a Z on Zn on them. Stick-ons are mostly soft lead except for the painted ones that have a ridge around them and look like little bricks. I put these in with the clip-ons.

Out of this batch, I had about 1000-1050# lead. I had about half of a 5 gallon bucket of iron, 1/3 or so of a bucket of stick-ons and a coffee can of valve stems, composite/plastic weights. All in all, pretty tired of sorting, but happy!:-|

Here is the batch that I sorted out.

http://i788.photobucket.com/albums/yy164/PTheodo/IMG_0274.jpg (http://s788.photobucket.com/user/PTheodo/media/IMG_0274.jpg.html)

[johnc486]

Now that you have the hang of it, come over and do mine:-|. I have been at it for 5 hrs today and probably have that much longer for tomorrow before I start smelting, a true labor of love.

[M-Tecs]

I have 12 5 gallon buckets to do. I keep putting it off.

[lightman]

Yeah, its boring and easy to put off. It goes better if you have a shooting buddy to help.

[OnceFired]

I found a few that haven't been covered in the information here. Namely those weights that are marked "T"

I had some that were AL, AL and a #, AL and letters (I think somethingW) and a couple FN. But those seem to have been discussed.

From what I have read here, all the AL stuff would be lead. At least I would melt them with lead, but I'd do it last and just under 700 degrees to be safe.

OF

[MoldyJoe]

Thats right the AL is lead, They are meant to go on Aluminum alloy wheels. They are usually lead. The stick-on's are perfect for round balls in my muzzle loaders and cap/ball revolvers.

[OnceFired]

What about the "T" ones?

OF

[lolbell]

[QUOTE=OnceFired;3006937]What about the "T" ones?

I'm wondering about this also. I am just getting into casting myself, but so far just to the point of separating WWs. I've been tossing the ones with a T on them into a separate bucket. I've scratched and cut a few and they seem to be lead that has been painted or coated with something but am unsure. If they are in fact coated lead can you toss them in the pot with coating in tact?

[SeabeeMan]

I don't know what the marking signifies but just about anything that isn't liquid can go in the pot. Paint, valve stems, dip remnants, acorns, and cigarette butts will all just burn off or float to be skimmed off with the dross. Stay up wind, but it won't hurt anything if you miss something.

I have tried sorting my wheel weights visually, with snips, and by controlling the pot temp to skim off the zinc. Visual takes to long and I just don't want the risk of contaminating a large batch with Zn. I've ended up hand sorting everything with a pair of side cutters. I don't even pay much attention to what is marked on them except to make sure they aren't stick-ons.

- If I can put a good mark in them, they go in the COWW bucket.
- If I can't mark them, Zn's get separated out and Fe's go in the recycling bin.
- SOWW that feel harder than sheet lead go with the COWW's, the soft ones go in the pure-ish lead bucket with pipe scraps and sheet lead.

[mold maker]

I'm with Rich. My eyesight's not, what it used to be, and seeing through all the grime is a PIA. I just use the old timer household pliers, and only have to see the bite mark they leave. I have a small bucket for zinc, and a scrap metal bucket for the Fe weights. There is also a bucket for jackets from range scrap.
My last trip tp the scrap yard yielded 290 lbs XRay of lead, four more empty buckets, an empty trailer, and $176.

[RogerDat]

Markings other than Zn or Fe are pretty much useless for determining the metal composition. The different letters are generally to indicate the suitability for different rims. Alloy rims, and attachment to rim styles. Just lets the mechanic or manufacturer know what fits what. Much like a battery group size, a group 27 battery is a certain size, but can be many types of battery with many types of cable attachment.

I sort sitting with a tray in my lap watching TV. I do nip test everything I keep, but after awhile one can spot the iron and many of the obvious zinc and toss them into their own buckets without bothering to nip. Scrap yard here pays for zinc (and steel) but more for the zinc. My purpose in sorting is to only store "good" material and have it ready to go when I have time to smelt them. Others melt it all at controlled temps and skim the scrap which floats in lead and does not melt at the temps that lead does. Either one works but I don't have the "extra" space to store 20% scrap (works out to 1 out of 5 buckets is wasted space)

The thermometer is critical tool for casting and melting WW's, get one if you don't have one. Tell Tru makes a good one at a good price. Keeping the melt at or below 700 degrees is the best way to avoid zinc contamination. It also is why you don't put a pot of WW's on to melt and "do something else" while it melts. Aside from safety of not keeping an eye on a pot of molten lead, the possibility of temp going high and melting a few missed zinc WW's is worth avoiding by being on hand to monitor temperature.

http://www.amazon.com/Tel-Tru-LT225R-Replacement-Thermometer-degrees/dp/B0055777EU

[omerta]

I have a question and I hope some one can help me here I had some diver weights and ww's as well I cast so many bullets now I have this problem after I so some shooting lean builds up in side rifling I did not use lube just plain cast and wax coat on bullets
I assume I did not do this right way and looks like I have to melt all the bullets and start over again
Any suggestions for me ? I really appreciated THX.

[fragman]

Very useful indeed. Helped me sort about 130# of wheelweights.

[Sticky]

Tried something last time around to differentiate the few odd zinc weights that try to slip past me. I had been using side cutters, but after sorting enough, I was visually able to sort the majority with only the occasional nipping... then I tried a spring loaded center punch. Those 'questionable ones' were set aside on my sorting tray (a large piece of plastic sheet about 1/2" thick) and when I had amassed enough to need to clear them out, I just spread em all out in a single layer and took the punch and punched each one. It's quick, you don't have to use two hands and there is a distinct difference when punching lead versus zinc. It was much quicker for me than using side cutters and I am confident that I got all the zinc/irons that way.

Just another option.. ;)

[ballistim]

Tried something last time around to differentiate the few odd zinc weights that try to slip past me. I had been using side cutters, but after sorting enough, I was visually able to sort the majority with only the occasional nipping... then I tried a spring loaded center punch. Those 'questionable ones' were set aside on my sorting tray (a large piece of plastic sheet about 1/2" thick) and when I had amassed enough to need to clear them out, I just spread em all out in a single layer and took the punch and punched each one. It's quick, you don't have to use two hands and there is a distinct difference when punching lead versus zinc. It was much quicker for me than using side cutters and I am confident that I got all the zinc/irons that way.

Just another option.. ;)

Good idea, I have a spring loaded punch & weights to sort, will give it a try. I've learned to be pretty good at visually sorting most of them but have found some are hard to tell for sure, and this might help with those. HF often has the spring loaded punches in sale for cheap.

[borg]

I found something different today, a COWW labeled T-Zn.
I did a muratic acid test on it and it didn't bubble.
I have also found some SOWW that didn't deform with side cutters, and no reaction to acid.

[lightman]

A lot of the Zinc that I've seen had a coat of paint on them. Your acid may not be getting through it.

[borg]

I've been around the block a few times, :kidding:I did take a file to remove the paint.


A lot of the Zinc that I've seen had a coat of paint on them. Your acid may not be getting through it.

[K7sparky]

borg
Muriatic acid / HCl would have expected to form ZnCl. Tried some marked Zn here with some HCl same as you did. Hit the WW with the grinder first and all the acid did was tarnish it a bit. Next up was weak Sulfuric - battery acid - and same thing just tarnished it a bit. Starting to think they might be pot metal? Glad I hadn't cast them up for boat zincs

[K7sparky]

Tried some Zinc SO with HCL and they bubble nicely.

[Blanket]

sorted 15 - 5 gallon buckets this weekend, done with collecting ww. Thank goodness I have enough. The guy that started using zinc needs to have his buttons cut off

[K7sparky]

I read most places that SO WW are almost pure lead and thus OK for BP. That's a yes and no. The dull ones that cut like solder measure close to 0.100 on a LEE tester = OK for BP almost pure.

First batch of SO WW I kept separate from regular WW & smelted I just tossed all the SO together and cast ingots. Being a bit cautious about BP lead I tested an ingot just after casting. LEE tester .088 dia is off the bottom of the LEE tester BHN table - YEP this is good for BP.

For some reason I tested it a day later and got .082??? pure lead does not age harden! Hum 6 days later .074 that's in the LEE BHN table about 9.1 BHN. 18 days after casting .068 =11.0 BHN 32 days after casting .066 BHN 11.8

I have been getting around 10 BHN for air cooled WW ingots, So the SO mix was harder than regular WW I have been getting - What's up??

I started tossing all what I now call hard SOWW in a bucket to do some more testing on.

http://i1356.photobucket.com/albums/q734/stovepipepb/other/painted%20stick%20on%201_zpstm5i4axe.jpg
Hard SOWW

Finally got around to casting hard SOWW and water quench. Cast 10 or so full molds then did 3 batches of 2 ingot about 1/2 full and dumped in cold water as soon as surface hardened.



Hard SO WW water quenched on casting














Bar #
When cast
1 Hr
2 Hr.
18 Hr
28 Hr
3 days



Dia
BHN
Dia
BHN
Dia
BHN
Dia
BHN
Dia
BHN
Dia
BHN


1
0.066
11.8
0.056
16.6
0.056
1606
0.054
17.9
0.054
17.9
0.048
22.7


2
0.066
11.8
0.056
16.6
0.054
17.9
0.05
20.9
0.048
22.7
0.048
22.7


3
0.067
11.4
0.058
15.4
0.054
17.9
0.048
22.7
0.05
20.9
0.048
22.7


4
0.066
11.8
0.056
16.6
0.055
17.2
0.046
24.8
0.046
24.8
0.048
22.7


5
0.064
12.1
0.058
15.4
0.056
16.6
0.05
20.9
0.047
23.8
0.048
22.7


6
0.064
12.1
0.058
15.4
0.056
16.6
0.05
20.9
0.047
23.8
0.05
20.9



It will get a bit harder, but you get the drift and read below links to see the hardening trend

Don't like to fight the sticky goo off the back floating on the pot, but sure like lead.

BTW if you are not familiar with Heat Treat & Quenching alloys there is a good read on http://www.lasc.us/CastBulletNotes.htm select "Heat Treating Lead Alloys" and you will get to http://www.lasc.us/HeatTreat.htm by Rick Kelter where you can also download the PDF of it.. First link has a bunch of good links in LASC for further study all downloadable as PDF if you care..

If you don't already own one, BUY a LEE Lead Tester - shop around they are not that expensive - You can't tell the ball game without a program. I've been adding a dab of Teflon oil to the sliding parts of the LEE tester as it is meant for Boolits and I'm doing ingots that tend to bind it. If you don't know the BHN of your alloy you're peeing into the wind. My eye gets tired looking through the little microscope. I have gotten to using a high intensity light up close for better viewing. Also found a knife blade scraping backwards makes a nice place to test punch.

[lightman]

There is a good sticky on this thread on XfR testing of stick-on weights. The one you pictured is going to be an alloy more like clip-on weights.

[brettb75]

If anyone knows what TT, MC and AW mean on wheel weights. I'm pretty sure TT and MC are good to use for Boolits but I don't know about AW. If anyone knows pm me. Thanks

[Blackhawk357]

Thank you, I am new to smelting/casting and appreciate the information.

[Yodogsandman]

I've started to use a strong magnet over the pile first now. My last 4 buckets have so many stick on steel weights. Then the painted ones on top, that aren't picked up, are mostly zinc. Then the real sorting begins....

[K7sparky]

If anyone knows what TT, MC and AW mean on wheel weights. I'm pretty sure TT and MC are good to use for Boolits but I don't know about AW. If anyone knows pm me. Thanks

What you are asking about are WW profiles not what they are made of.

Try http://www.perfectequipment.com/us/downloads/ Down load the "OEM Application Guide Wall Poster" it will explain a lot On the left are the profiles you mention. Lots of other interesting stuff on wheel weights. Other manufacturers also have similar / more information on their sites.:-)

[Chris C]

Don't like to fight the sticky goo off the back floating on the pot, but sure like lead.



Is there any way to get the adhesive off the backs of stick-on WW, before smelting, so it doesn't end up being such a gooey mess in the smelting pot?

[lightman]

Yeah, you can soak them in about any kind of solvent to disvolve the sticky stuff. I usually just drop them in the smelting pot and try to light the smokey stuff with a lighter.

[Chris C]

Yeah, you can soak them in about any kind of solvent to disvolve the sticky stuff. I usually just drop them in the smelting pot and try to light the smokey stuff with a lighter.

Do you mean the "smokey stuff" that comes from the adhesive melting off?

[mold maker]

It's just flux that stinks.

[PerpetualStudent]

Sorted my first batch of Wheel Weights, this thread was enormously helpful.

I worked on cardboard on the garage floor. I found that knocking against a shovel we not helpful but if I knocked it against the concrete I could hear the difference. I also found that after 3 or 4 good thunks on the concrete lead WW would take a stipple pattern from the rough concrete floor. Zinc would not.

Main thing I'd warn fellow Noobs is that the sound will change depending on the size of the wheelweight. So a large zinc WW will have a different sound from small zinc WW. It's not a one sound thing but more a range of dull thuds and a range of pings. Iron really easy to ID from sound and all marked with FE in my batch.

[copdills]

thanks this is a big help

[pcmacd]

I thought "pot metal" WAS zinc?

[pcmacd]

borg
Muriatic acid / HCl would have expected to form ZnCl. Tried some marked Zn here with some HCl same as you did. Hit the WW with the grinder first and all the acid did was tarnish it a bit. Next up was weak Sulfuric - battery acid - and same thing just tarnished it a bit. Starting to think they might be pot metal? Glad I hadn't cast them up for boat zincs


If you keep adding zinc to the HCL until it stops bubbling, it makes a WONDERFUL flux for soldering sheet metal - it will take that galvanized coating (zinc!) and itbe gone! My dad was a tinsmith, and used to use pennies to make the flux, which nowadays, are mostly zinc with a copper wash.

[OnceFired]

Picked up a 75-lb bucket of WW today. Half of a 5-gallon bucket of mixed weights from a source new to me - a local junkyard that's been around forever.

18 lbs were steel
30 lbs were MC / MICRO

A bunch of others too - P, T, TW, IAW, AL-MC, AL, AW and others that do all seem to be lead.

I think I got ~55-60 lbs @ just $0.10 per pound.

We'll see when I smelt it how many may turn out to be Zn.

OF

[Cold Trigger Finger]

This is a great thread. And I appreciate it being a sticky.
As I'm brand new to casting. I was nervous about sorting. So I used a pair of 7" handled diagonal wire cutters( dykes) to check every single wheel weight that I saved . I got a bit over a half full 5 gal bucket of wheel weights when we went to town last Sunday. Only found 1 tire shop open. Cost me $25.00 . I ended up with 3 coffee cans full of lead wheel weights And about 1/2 can of (other materials.) Composit, steel, zinc, and plastic. . I cut into every weight I saved . I want to try to do this right from the start. I threw the stick p.s. in with the clip on . Just to increase the volume of bullet alloy I have.
For a test on how hard I needed to squeeze on the cutters . I tried some recovered Boolits I had shot into firewood. Anything harder went into the reject bucket. I had to shake and tap the coffee cans to get over 20 lbs per can. The small clip p.s. don't add weight as fast as the multi oz ones due to the steel clips. ( that's my theory anyway) as one can ended up weighing more than 26 lbs and 1 only made it to 21 lbs . the light can had a lot of small weights in it.
. So, now I need to get some cup cake pans to make ingots. And cut in half a 5 gal propane tank I got out of a dumpster. That will be my smelting pot. Got an outdoor propane burner last Sunday while in town also.
Now all I need are gas checks, lube, and a sizer to install the checks.
Thanks again.
Glen.

[K7sparky]

Hi Glen and welcome to casting.
I use an outdoor burner for smelting also. I think it was an OLD plumbers unit. Looks a lot like the modern turkey boiler.
I use an old dutch oven. When it gets too low to dip I grab the side handles with vise grips or channel locks to get the last out.
Be interested on how the bottom of a propane tank works for you.

Most of the time I am now using wood chips for fluxing. Chain saw chips from cutting fire wood so there is a bit of chain lube.

The LEE lead hardness tester is fairly cheap and works well. Read the tests of various hardness testers on LASC site. While you are there download the free book " From Ingot to Target": A Cast Bullet Guide for Handgunners - A joint effort by Glen E. Fryxell and Robert L. Applegate. It is the best book out there. Lots of other gems there also.

I haven't found any lube better than Fryxell's take on Alox: Moly lube (Wally World or any AP store) and bees wax.

[Cold Trigger Finger]

Thank You!
What velocity does your lube work well at ?
Summer =busy time at work. Long hours. Its getting in the way of my lead smelting.

[K7sparky]

Well at least it's light 24 or almost 24 hours there. If around Fairbanks in the hole it may be hot too

Glen Fryxell gives you all the data in his free online book. Molylube is better than the old ALOX so anything that you read ALOX this is better.

You can go to LASC & get or there is a Sticky with links in the CAST BOOLITS forum http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?110213-From-Ingot-to-Target-A-Cast-Bullet-Guide-for-Handgunners

Glen has a lot of articles on LASC that will help you a LOT getting started. Other articles there are a treasure trove. Look around there and most can be downloaded as PDF.

Glen's lube is what lives in my Lyman lubrasizer. Everything from slow 50 Cal front stuffer to Blowup speed in a 22-250 with homemade beer can PB GCs

[MAGA]

Thank you for this informative thread!

[MstrEddy]

Thanks to the OP and all that have contributed. This thread has been extremely helpful as I just got some COWW from a member here and a half bucket from the tire shop. The info helped me to quickly got through the batch and sort it all.
The COWW from the member here was as advertised - mostly lead with a little zinc and steel.
The tire shop bucket was unfortunately mostly steel Stick-on. It did yield some SO and CO lead.
I had first gone through by scratching with a utility knife and looking for the Zn marking on those that were tough. I also used a magnet to help find the steel.

Again, thanks for all the info.

[Cold Trigger Finger]

You also need to look out for synthetic weights. I use a pair of diagonal cutters to check the hardness. A steel weight is easy to tell . Zinc are too hard to cut into very much. Lead stick on weights get cut through really easy and leadalloy wheel weights can be snipped through with a real good squeeze. For my hands at least.

[charleswrivers]

Very helpful.

I just got my first bit of wheel weights... about a 1/3 of a bucket a small shop in town saved for me over the course of a few weeks. I ran out of light but I started sorting this evening. Looks to be about 2/3 lead with the other 1/3 steel and zinc. Now that I have something to mix with some of the pure lead I already have... I'm getting ever closer to being able to start casting.

[lightman]

2/3 % lead is not a bad ratio. Not as good as the "old days", but still a nice yield. If this shop becomes a regular source for you consider doing something for them to ensure that they remain a regular source. Transfer some of your business to them, take them some donuts and coffee on a cold morning, maybe a pizza at lunch.

[charleswrivers]

2/3 % lead is not a bad ratio. Not as good as the "old days", but still a nice yield. If this shop becomes a regular source for you consider doing something for them to ensure that they remain a regular source. Transfer some of your business to them, take them some donuts and coffee on a cold morning, maybe a pizza at lunch.

Yep. I was already planning on a 'random doughnut morning' when I can get there right at opening in the next couple weeks when I'm on leave. Good suggestion though. I got turned down by about a 1/2 dozen places before I happened upon them. Apparently, the guy who's runs the place's dad shoots and has 2 55 gallon drums full of weights saved up to cover himself for the next 2 lifetimes... so he was happy to spread some around.

[MstrEddy]

You also need to look out for synthetic weights. I use a pair of diagonal cutters to check the hardness. A steel weight is easy to tell . Zinc are too hard to cut into very much. Lead stick on weights get cut through really easy and leadalloy wheel weights can be snipped through with a real good squeeze. For my hands at least.

I did come across a couple of different synthetic weights. One SOWW type was like a foam/tape and was ferrous, another type looked like a standard COWW, not magnetic, and the dykes would cut it, but it was a dense plastic (?) material.

I did notice that most, though not all, of the Zinc were labeled with either the Z or Zn. Similar to the steel, Fe was on most, though not all.

Of the box that I obtained through here, I had done a hand sort and scored using the blade as mentioned above. I have since gone back and used the dykes to further refine the search and handle the questionables. I am mostly done with that project.

If the weather is good this weekend, I will work on rendering the WWs into ingots.

[Rubino1988]

I like the video thank you

[abunaitoo]

I got about a 1/3 full 5 gal bucket from a friend.
He thought he was giving me gold. I knew better.
First sorted with a magnet.
1/2 the bucked was steel
Next drop each on a metal plate.
Took out all that went "ping"
Also sorted all the plastic, and stick-on out.
1/2 of that was taken out.
Sorted out all with Zn on them.
Rest were kept on the side.
Pile that seemed to be lead was sorted.
Those with "P" were lead.
Of the stick-on 1/4 were lead.
Those that didn't "thump" when dropped, were put aside.
So, I have a pile of known lead, around #10.
A pile of unknown, and of zinc.
Zinc I'm keeping. Metal and plastic went in the trash.
Any idea how to find out what the unknown could be?????
I'm thinking it might be a mix alloy.
But a mix of what????
Should I just trash them????

[lightman]

If you post some pictures someone here could probably ID those unknowns for you. I am not familiar with any mixes. There are lead alloy weights, iron weights, zinc weights and a composite weight thats some type of powdered metal. There is also a stick on weight thats flexible like rubber. I have also found a few chrome plated weights.

My method for sorting weights is that I dump them out on a flat surface and start "cherry picking". I start with the junk. Tire stickers, valve cores and stems, lug nuts, brake pads, ect. Then I pick out the stick ons, separating out the lead as I go. Then I pick out the steel. This leaves the zinc and lead weights. I look at each weight and make a test cut on any weight that looks suspicious. I use a pair of electricians dykes for this. Lead cuts fairly easy. You won't even be able to mark on the steel and you would really have to have a grip like Godzilla to make a mark on the zinc.

After you sort several it gets easier. You almost develop a radar for zinc. The steel/iron weights are very distinctive looking. I've not found a magnet to be very useful. It will be attracted to the steel clip, even in lead weights. A magnet is useful when sorting out the steel stick on weights. I would look at the ones that your magnet attracted one more time. If you miss an iron weight it won't hurt anything. You won't melt it at anywhere near the temps that we melt lead at. If you miss a zinc weight you may get a second chance as it melts at a higher temp than lead and will float to the top. And a tiny amount of zinc won't ruin a batch although I try for zero.

[longbow]

Similar to lightman, I use a pair of side cutters to determine whether wheelweights are zinc or lead. The zinc are noticeably harder than lead, it is easy to tell which with a quick squeeze on the side cutter handles.

Longbow

[K7sparky]

The sticky on SOWW makes a mess in the smelt pot but seems like good flux.
I keep the SOWW that feel / cut like pure lead (which is most of them) separate. The LEE hardness tester shows them much softer than COWW
I echo lightman, keep the smelt temp down and zinc will float on surface. A few always seem to sneak in.

If you have a local scrap yard keep them on your list to visit. They also get plumbers lead (pure) and lately lead sheet (pure) from Hospital X-Ray room referbs

If your unknowns all look the same try floating one with your smelt pot when it is just hot enough to keep the meld liquid. Or if you run a PID controller on your pour pot even better.

[vidiot]

An absolute complete explanation of WW lead. Thank you .. Mr Revolver

[Liberty1776]

So I found a COWW with a "T" on it, then ran into this excellent thread.

The T weight I have has a thick plastic coating over steel. It's magnetic. Very tough construction. Even getting through the plastic was difficult. It's a sleek, nice-looking weight, however, and will take the weather for years without discoloring or reacting to the rim. I can see why they're being adopted.

This "T" sample bodes ill for the future of wheelweights for casting. Lead is passing away.

285543

[barsik]

I use a fairly coarse bastard file to determine whether it is lead or something else. it's quick and identification is very easy.

[Oaks&Pines]

The letters that you are seeing on the weights refer to the rim types that the clip is made for, with the exception of course to fe and zn which denote iron or zinc weights.
All of the plastic coated one go right into the steel bucket.
I also use the corner of a coarse bastard file on any I have doubts about, you will know a zinc wt. right away:-)

[pcmacd]

The only thing that is dangerous about wheel weights is the oxide on them.

You could swallow ten or twenty pure lead 200 grain bullets and it will not affect you blood lead much, if at all.

But lead oxide from lead dros? Or lead styphnate from primers?

This is another story. These are salts and oxides of lead. Your mucous membranes (eyes, mouth, nose) will absorb that stuff just like they would table salt.

That is why you ALWAYS scrape/wire brush/clean your lead pot in front of a fan that is pointing away from you to the outdoors.

Poison your neighbors. Not yousef.

That's why you don't smoke when handling lead, nor eat nor drink w/o a good scrubbing up with a stiff brush on your fingers.

[OKMike]

Nice explanation


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[barsik]

well, I have some remedial work to do on about 300 lyman ingots. I thought I did a decent job of picking the zinc weights out of the wheelweight bucket but it wasn't good enough. the muriatic acid test showed bubbles so I found a relatively inexpensive source of elemental sulfur to throw in the pot to get rid of the zinc. I never had the oatmeal lumps in my pot but the ingots had a bit of a shine about them which made me a bit suspicious. now I am wondering if the company which makes the COWW has mixed lead and zinc weights a few years ago as part of their recycling process as it doesn't make any difference to them. I'm guessing something less than 1% zinc in my ingots and it isn't much but I wonder if the zinc will affect the Hitek coating ability to stick properly to the bullet. also, how much sulfur should I add to a 50 lb melt to bond with the zinc.

[K7sparky]

So far I have had good results remelting the offending bars and holding the temperature less than 700F to get rid of Zinc.
Zinc melts at 787F has SG of 65 so it floats on top and can be skimmed off.
Stumbled on it by accident but has worked.

The Zinc might well float off in your casting pot if you keep your temperature down. Cast a few and see what you get.
Easy to try
Would be interested in your results.

I have an OLD plumbers burner that uses propane and looks a lot like the modern turkey roaster that I use with a large cast iron pot to cast bars. Likely where they originated. Another "Hay Yo'Al gotta see this".
I try yo keep it below 750F so the Zinc never melts.

The lead hysteria would make me guess the Zinc weights would be kept lead free.

[K7sparky]

WATCH the sulfur fumes it burns, you breath and get H2SO4 AKA sulfuric acid

[farmbif]

I commented on this before from my experience working with the owner of several very large scrap yards. all sorts of stuff gets mixed up in the pallet boxes bales and bins of lead before it is shipped off by the truckload. I have no experience in what happens to it it once it reaches the smelters or refiners but can imagine its very expensive to purify and separate the different materials once they are all melted together. this is one reason why xrf is so important to the industry to know exactly what is in materials. I'm pretty sure this is why lead recovery from battery recyclers most often ends up being used for new battery construction.


well, I have some remedial work to do on about 300 lyman ingots. I thought I did a decent job of picking the zinc weights out of the wheelweight bucket but it wasn't good enough. the muriatic acid test showed bubbles so I found a relatively inexpensive source of elemental sulfur to throw in the pot to get rid of the zinc. I never had the oatmeal lumps in my pot but the ingots had a bit of a shine about them which made me a bit suspicious. now I am wondering if the company which makes the COWW has mixed lead and zinc weights a few years ago as part of their recycling process as it doesn't make any difference to them. I'm guessing something less than 1% zinc in my ingots and it isn't much but I wonder if the zinc will affect the Hitek coating ability to stick properly to the bullet. also, how much sulfur should I add to a 50 lb melt to bond with the zinc.