plans for a machine rest for a pistol

[kombayotch]

Does anyone know of any plans out there for a machine rest for a pistol? Something similar to the Ransom Rest?

I found this: http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f14/machine-handgun-rest-project-10378/
But, that is the only post that guy ever made on that site.

Was thinking the grip inserts could be made with RTV rubber the same way you make a mold:
http://www.alumilite.com/HowTos/2PieceMold.cfm
There are other companies making RTV rubber in different hardnesses.

[44man]

Does anyone know of any plans out there for a machine rest for a pistol? Something similar to the Ransom Rest?

I found this: http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f14/machine-handgun-rest-project-10378/
But, that is the only post that guy ever made on that site.

Was thinking the grip inserts could be made with RTV rubber the same way you make a mold:
http://www.alumilite.com/HowTos/2PieceMold.cfm
There are other companies making RTV rubber in different hardnesses.
I made one long ago to fit contenders. I could still out shoot it by a wide margin with sandbags. We still out shoot the Ransom from bags with any gun.

[aarolar]

I made one long ago to fit contenders. I could still out shoot it by a wide margin with sandbags. We still out shoot the Ransom from bags with any gun.

Im not doubting you at all but please explain your theory on this?

[KCSO]

I have never been impressed with the Ransom. I thin it is a crutch for the lazy. I have tried 3 of them now and have always shot bbetter from sand bags. In one case testing a K38 chamber by chamber I found the Ransom shot groups over 1/2" Larger with each chamber than sandbag rests.

[R.M.]

If Iwas going to build one, I'd set it up to use the RR inserts. Just makes things easier.

[44man]

Im not doubting you at all but please explain your theory on this?
No theory, just the way it works. I feel your hand and eye is better.
I read many gun rags and when I see a test using a Ransom, I discount it and the poor groups. I know most shooters will do better.
The rest was made to remove human error but then you have mechanical error combined with human error to set the thing up.
Have you ever seen 1" groups shot at 100 yards from a Ransom?

[kombayotch]

I can see that with things like contenders and large revolvers. However, with smaller revolvers and autos... Well, there is a reason the AMU and Bianchi Cup shooters test their ammo with a Ransom.

[aarolar]

No theory, just the way it works. I feel your hand and eye is better.
I read many gun rags and when I see a test using a Ransom, I discount it and the poor groups. I know most shooters will do better.
The rest was made to remove human error but then you have mechanical error combined with human error to set the thing up.
Have you ever seen 1" groups shot at 100 yards from a Ransom?

Never much paid attention to the things I just took it for granted that they were more accurate than that.

[44man]

I can see that with things like contenders and large revolvers. However, with smaller revolvers and autos... Well, there is a reason the AMU and Bianchi Cup shooters test their ammo with a Ransom.
They are all close range shooters and are concerned with SPEED.
I am very sure that a good load will make one hole at 25 yards with a good gun just from bags that to spend more money is silly.
Now just how many Bianchi cup shooters use the Ransom for competition?
I consider it a crutch for someone that just can't handle a handgun to work loads. They might be just super off hand or with speed, so why can't they just shoot without the machine?

[kweidner]

Michael Duck" Dawson uses a Ransom when developing loads for his SA. Lives across the county from me and works on my guns. Exhibition shooter at end of trail 2009. Also holds 2 world records from 2009 I believe. Man can drive the same hole offhand but uses a Ransom for load development. Course he also runs EVERYTHING 22bhn.:killingpc Seen some amazing groups from that rest. He is the revolver Guru around here. He will fix your forcing cone, size your throats, time your gun and then shoot with his ransom to prove the gun. Most groups come back 1 hole at 25 yards after he has been through the gun.

[44man]

Michael Duck" Dawson uses a Ransom when developing loads for his SA. Lives across the county from me and works on my guns. Exhibition shooter at end of trail 2009. Also holds 2 world records from 2009 I believe. Man can drive the same hole offhand but uses a Ransom for load development. Course he also runs EVERYTHING 22bhn.:killingpc Seen some amazing groups from that rest. He is the revolver Guru around here. He will fix your forcing cone, size your throats, time your gun and then shoot with his ransom to prove the gun. Most groups come back 1 hole at 25 yards after he has been through the gun.
I have no doubt at all, you are talking about a smart revolver man, just wonderful. My question is, does he need the Ransom? I for one, do not think so. I am willing to bet he can make one hole from bags and off hand.
I notice he likes 22 BHN. Same I use, maybe we agree.
NO, if he shot any which way, he does not need the mechanical rest and I would trust him 100%. It is only easier for him but I bet he can shoot better without it.

[kweidner]

+1 on the off hand. He can do it. Not exactly sure why he uses rest. Certainly not because that's the only way he can shoot accurate. His health is not as good these days. Maybe that is why. Maybe for extended load development? Will ask him next time I see him. He just fixed the forcing cone in a model 19 I inherited. That thing looked like it was cut with a rock before. Smooth as glass now. I think for myself my load development could be better with a RR. I like to shoot 2 cylinders of each load for chrony purposes. 8 or 10 different loads in an outing at 2 cylinders each and my concentratin is pure shot. JMHO.

[leftiye]

Caldwell's HAMMR is an economical version of the Ransom concept. You might wanna look at that.

Myself, I can't outshoot it. I like to put a scope on the pistols prior to testing too. The gun IS on target when it fires.

[jimkim]

Get a Mequon. You'll need to build your own mount though. You mentioned plans, so I thought you might be capable of it.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=269022260

[subsonic]

Heres a pic i stole from cyberspace:
http://i1179.photobucket.com/albums/x386/Dennis_Doza/7d19a057.jpg

[Whiterabbit]

What alloy/treatment results in 22 bhn bullets?

As for spending the money, well, some people have a passion for it. Like the person who spends thousands on jigs and shaper bits then hundreds on wood to make the perfect from door to their home when they could have bought one front Home Depot for a quarter of the cost, or left the one that was already there.

If that person wants to argue they got a better performing product, I could beg to differ, but if they want to talk about the joy of producing it and using it, well, I'd not have much to refute. This is only a thought, playing devils advocate. Not an opinion or trying to make a point.

[subsonic]

What alloy/treatment results in 22 bhn bullets?

Most WW dropped HOT out of the mold into cold water will get it. But I think adding some tin is a good idea.

[mstarling]

Takes a while to learn to use a Ransom rest well. Does require proper fit of the pads and fixing of the rest itself.

I tend to suspect they have an upper recoil limit as well. They work pretty well with things up to 45 ACP at 50 yard ranges.

[kombayotch]

Maybe for extended load development?

While many of us can shoot a few groups that are just as good or better than the Ransom, most of us can't do it over hundreds of rounds, any time and any day. People might claim to be able to, but I put about as much stock in that as I do in the factory Remington 700 that shoots 1/4 MOA all day long. Very common on the interwebs, not so much in person... and never at matches.


Get a Mequon. You'll need to build your own mount though. You mentioned plans, so I thought you might be capable of it.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=269022260

That's a simple design, thanks!

[44man]

While many of us can shoot a few groups that are just as good or better than the Ransom, most of us can't do it over hundreds of rounds, any time and any day. People might claim to be able to, but I put about as much stock in that as I do in the factory Remington 700 that shoots 1/4 MOA all day long. Very common on the interwebs, not so much in person... and never at matches.



That's a simple design, thanks!
It does look good but would fly over my head with my guns! :bigsmyl2: I have a plastic one that works like that and had to pick it up after each shot. It's funny to see the thing go over my head and land 10 feet behind me.
When I make a new boolit for a revolver, it takes five rounds of each load for 20 to maybe 25 shots.
Mine would leave a Ransom and maybe break it. :veryconfu
I suppose if you had a zillion boolits and loads to test from a .45 or such, it would be OK.

[kombayotch]

I prefer 10 rounds groups at 25 yards when evaluating loads for my autopistols. This gives me a repeatable group size. I work them in 0.2 gr. increments. With a new bullet, and various powders, it adds up quickly. Same with a new powder and various bullets. With a new gun, testing various bullets and various powders... well, lots of testings! :shock: If one load does better than the other in the rest, chances are that it will also do better than the other in the hand. But, the rest will not get tired after a few groups.