Help ID'ing Martini

[218bee]

I saw a Martini today at a neighbor but didnt have time to give it a good going over. Guy thinks its 303British because of markings but is not sure...he never shot it.From what I recall....
Left side of receiver:
a crown
VR
ENFIELD
1896
ME 303

Right side of receiver:
a crown
VR
ENFIELD
1879
III
1
2 the 2 has a line thru it..crossing it out?

Couldnt see various marks on barrel etc to well would need a magnifier
Dont know much about Martini's but pretty sure "short lever" as lever didnt go way down stock.
Barrel didnt look to good but didnt have bore light with me
Dia could be 303 I guess
Might be fun to play with or maybe rebarrel??
Looking for general info with what little info I have...any thoughts??

[swamp]

I believe that the markings on the left side indicate that it was redone at Enfield arsenel to 303 in 1896.
I am going from memory, some one will chime in with something concrete. A wealth of info here.
swamp

[JeffinNZ]

It's a Martini Enfield (ME). Started life as a 577/450 cal and was rebarreled to .303 Brit. Great old rifles. The actions are strong and make the basis of a good rebarrel job (again).

[swamp]

Thanks Jeff. I least I remember a few things.

[218bee]

thanks....I forgot to mention it has a triangular bayonet that appears to fit....dont know if correct or not. So originally a 577/450......Hmmmm

[Bane]

Left side of receiver:
a crown
VR
ENFIELD
1896
ME 303

Right side of receiver:
a crown
VR
ENFIELD
1879
III
1
2 the 2 has a line thru it..crossing it out?



Will start by desciphering the left side of the receiver

The key part of this is the date, the fact its on the LEFT side of the receiver, and the ME

ME stands for Metford-Enfield, indicating it has .303 calibre rifling, in the Metford-Enfield pattern.

The date of 1896 being on the left side of the receiver indicates it was refurbished on this date. These markings are of little interest unless you intend to shoot it as it is now.

The right side of the receiver is a little more interesting. manufactured in 1879 (Obviously) in .450/577 calibre being originally a Mark III Henry rifle, When you say it has "1" and "2" on the side of the receiver, this refers to the "Class" of the weapon, AKA, at the time of the stamping of the 1, it was a class-1 weapon, utilized in the front lines, as it wore out/became obsolete, it was restamped with a 2- dictating it as a Class II weapon, rearguard, training purposes etc.
The fact that the 2 has been crossed out is interesting, i can only assume this was done after the .303 conversion to indicate its return to "Class1" status

A couple of markings you need to look for before its 100% SAFE to shoot

Firstly you need to locate any Sold out of Service markings, they usually are of a pair of broad arrows pointing towards eachother

A detailed picture if there IS a SoS marking can identify the origin of the rifle further

http://www.martinihenry.com/images3/sos2.jpg

Secondly, you need to isolate its proofing marks. Being a converted rifle, it should have THREE proofing marks, the first two looking similar with nothing more than a change in numerals from "1" to "2" on the second proofing mark. Both bear the V.R. and the crown symbol.
http://www.martinihenry.com/images3/3032proof.jpg
There should be a third Birmingham proof mark from when it was converted to .303- if it is not there, DO NOT SHOOT IT.

Lastly, go over the rifle with a fine tooth comb, check EVERY letter, there are MANY "Khyber-pass" Martinis around and the only identification is a backwards N in Enfield or a wrong date or the proofing mark stamped backwards.

http://www.martinihenry.com/images2/khybercypher.jpg

Other markings that could help identify the rifle, etc
http://www.martinihenry.com/othermarkings.htm

Lastly, the ideal option is to remove the block from the rifle, on the side of the block itself should be stamped with ME .303 or similar, this is to indicate the block is a stronger block designed for the .303 cartridge

[rollmyown]

Bane, I'm not so sure you're right about the ME meaning Metford Enfield. Metford rifling was designed for BP, Enfield for cordite. I understand ME to mean Martini Enfield and MM to mean Martini metford. Both are in .303 Brit

[218bee]

BANE...wealth of information, thank you very much.
If I were to buy it I would certainly want one I could shoot, so I will see about those other markings you state above....again, Thank You

[Bad Ass Wallace]

LHS / RHS would be sililar to this!


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/BAWallace/ME_lhs.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v152/BAWallace/ME_rhs.jpg

[Ed in North Texas]

I'd not look for multiple proof marks on the barrel of a .303 M-H, they were new barrels. But do look on the receiver. And there will not always be a 3d proof mark on the receiver, sometimes only 2.

Good catch.

[Bane]

Bane, I'm not so sure you're right about the ME meaning Metford Enfield. Metford rifling was designed for BP, Enfield for cordite. I understand ME to mean Martini Enfield and MM to mean Martini metford. Both are in .303 Brit


Sorry, your right, it was quite late when i typed that out :)

ME = Martini Enfield, MM = Martini Metford, the intent was correct ;)

*Edit*

Also, anybody have any good suggestions on how to lighten the trigger pull while still acheiving a crisp and reliable firing pin strike, let me know! :P

[herbert buckland]

To lighten the triger a siple way is to put a shim under the trigger spring or polish the trigger spring

[Loki610]

Sounds almost like the one I've got! Mine however has no enfield markings on it from whenever it was rechambered to 303. It has a chamber on the large side and with modern smokeless factory loads shoots 2' high at 200yards (lowest sight setting)
http://i1085.photobucket.com/albums/j426/loki610/303/P7010070.jpg
http://i1085.photobucket.com/albums/j426/loki610/303/P7010066.jpg

[herbert buckland]

Yours seems to have been re-proofed comercialy or is a trade modle,shooting high is nomal for these rifles,they were sighted for 215 gr bullet traveling slower than Mk VII amo

[bydand]

Any military firearm in the U.K. sold out of service is required to go through proof before it can be put on the civillian market. (even if it was on a military firing range the day before)

[218bee]

My trapdoors shot way high at 100yds. If ya can make a taller front blade it will bring impact down

[herbert buckland]

Any military firearm in the U.K. sold out of service is required to go through proof before it can be put on the civillian market. (even if it was on a military firing range the day before)That is true but this carbine has many comercial fetures and no British military marking that I can see,but even this does not mean it did not see military use,as officers had suoly there own arms

[Bad Ass Wallace]

[QUOTE=Loki610;1541804]and with modern smokeless factory loads shoots 2' high at 200yards (lowest sight setting)
[quote]
Mine shot similar and left, a piece of hacksaw blade epoxied the the foresight (front sight needs to be higher) should cure the problem leaving the rifle foresight original

[Loki610]

I'm not too worried about it, its kind of a safe queen and almost never gets used. Although it is super fun to elevate the sights to the 1600yard mark and try to take out the coyotes on the hillside across the section!
I might try some handloads at a modest velocity and that should cure the elevation issue.

[Superfly]

Not to high jack But where can i find wood for a martini Henery, All i have is a reciever and will build it into a new rifle for target shootin i am thinkin in 44 mag calibre

Jaime

[Ed in North Texas]

Not to high jack But where can i find wood for a martini Henery, All i have is a reciever and will build it into a new rifle for target shootin i am thinkin in 44 mag calibre

Jaime

Depends on what receiver you have. Both IMA and Atlanta Cutlery have a stock set (original Infantry Rifle configuration) for the Mark I and II.

Go here for an extensive list of suppliers for M-H. Scroll down for the wood. I can't say all the links are still good, didn't check that.

http://www.martinihenry.com/links.htm

Good luck with that midget caliber project.

Ed

[Loki610]

Not to high jack But where can i find wood for a martini Henery, All i have is a reciever and will build it into a new rifle for target shootin i am thinkin in 44 mag calibre

Jaime

Last time I called Ellwood Epps in Canada had a stock for a long lever style

[torpedoman]

Not to high jack But where can i find wood for a martini Henery, All i have is a reciever and will build it into a new rifle for target shootin i am thinkin in 44 mag calibre

Jaime

http://www.gunstocksinc.com/web_pages/Plate-pics/Martini/Martini-small-frame.htm
if you call them they will also make your wood. and the price is not bad.
http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t111/torpedoman/aaaaa22.jpg 45-70 conversion

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t111/torpedoman/martini003.jpg 357 cadet conversion

[10x]

Not to high jack But where can i find wood for a martini Henery, All i have is a reciever and will build it into a new rifle for target shootin i am thinkin in 44 mag calibre

Jaime

I.M.I. and Atlantic Cutlery have some Martini parts....