Should I cast My Own Boolits?

[wv109323]

About 3 pages long.
Should I Cast Boolits (bullets)?

If you shoot a lot, you have noticed the price of ammunition and reloading components have risen over the last few years. Part of the reason is the demand for lead on the world market. What I would like to do in this article is put together the cost of acquiring the equipment to cast bullets and balance those costs over three years to see if it is feasible for you to get into casting your own bullets. I chose three years to recoup your costs because that is a rule of thumb for investment if you are in business.
I will look at two scenarios for the equipment. The first will be smaller equipment meant for those that probably shoot for recreation and the fun of it. The second scenario will be for some one that is considering competition or has a heavy, heavy appetite to shoot.
Let me first explain a little about casting bullets. In the simplest definition casting a bullet is simply pouring molten lead into a mold, allowing it to cool and extracting the bullet from the mold. After the bullet is extracted two things need to happen before it can be loaded and fired from a firearm. The bullet must be sized or at least confirmed to be of the proper size to “fit” the bore of the firearm. Most all cast bullets are sized but there are some molds that are classified as “shoot as cast”. The second thing that needs to be done to the bullet is to be “lubricated”. The lubricant applied to the bullet is actually a seal that prevents the hot gases of the ignited powder from escaping around the bullet and not propelling the bullet down the barrel. A by product of the gases escaping around the bullet is that the hot gases will melt the bullet and that molten lead will stick to the bore of the firearm. This is known as “leading” and it is never a good thing.
Lubricant can be applied in two ways. One is called tumble lubing where the cast bullet is physically in contact with the lubricant and a coat sticks to the cast bullet. This can be done by rolling the bullets around in a pan that has some of the lubricant in the bottom or standing all the bullets on their base in a pan and pouring the lube into the pan until the lubricant reaches a certain height on the bullet.
The second way to apply the lubricant is via a device called a Lub/sizer. With this machine the as cast bullet is pushed into a die of known size and the lubricant is forced in the grooves of the bullet. This does the two things already mentioned. The die sizes the bullet to a predetermined size and ensures that it is perfectly round and the lubricant is applied. After leaving the lubricater/ sizer it can be loaded into a case.
One limit to cast bullets is the amount of heat( powder charge) that can be directly applied to the base of the bullet. Too much powder and you get the leading as described above. To eliminate this bullet casters have come up with a copper or aluminum gas check that is crimped on to a recessed base in the bullet. The gas check is a cupped plate that is slightly oversize for the recessed diameter on the bullet base. When the bullet and the gas check are run into the sizing die the gas check is crimped to the base of the bullet.
There is a lot of controversy as to when a gas check is required but I am going to say if your reloads exceed 1200 fps then you probably need a gas check. This then indicates that your Magnum pistol calibers and all modern rifles need gas checks. About the only rifle cartridges that do not need a gas check are the 19th century cartridges such as 45-70, 38-55 and etc.
The first scenario is casting for a pistol caliber that does not require a gas check. For that scenario we would need:
Lead pot with 10 pound capacity $49.00
Lead pot with 10 Pound capacity with bottom pour $64.00
Lead ladle $4.00
Two Cavity Lee Mold $20.00
Lee Lubricating Kit $16.00
Lubricant $5.00
Shipping $18.00
Lead Ingots $1.00 per pound

I listed two lead pots. The least expensive requires that you take a ladle, dip molten lead from the pot, and pour from the ladle into the mold. The bottom pour is: the mold is held below an orifice in the pot, The orifice is opened and molten lead runs into the mold via gravity. I prefer the bottom pour for pistols but some casters of larger rifle bullets prefer the ladle pour.
To cast for a pistol your initial cost would be : 64.00 Lead Pot +20.00 Mold +16.00 Sizing die + 5.00 Lubricant or $105.00

1000 bullets for the .44 magnum (240 gn.) weigh 34.28 pounds or $34.28 in lead at $1.00/lb.
1000 bullets for the .357 Magnum weigh (158 gn.) 22.57 pounds or $22.57 in lead.

The price for cast bullets is varied to say the least. My references listed cast bullets for the .357 from $79.00 per thousand to $88.00 per thousand. That is without shipping and shipping is also a variable. I believe I can buy from a local caster for $76.00 per thousand and I will use that.

My references for .44 Magnum was between $81.00 and $104.00 per thousand. I am going to use the price of $80.00 per thousand.
To recover your initial investment over three years with .357 Magnum you would be saving $76.00-22.57 or $53.43 per thousand. You would need to cast 1965 bullets over three years. That is 655 bullets per year.
For the .44 Magnum the math would be $80.00-34.28= $45.72per thousand. You would need to cast 2,300 bullets to recoup your cost over three years which is 764 rounds per year.


Lets look at a second scenario where the caster buys premium equipment and is involved in a lot of shooting.

20 # lead pot with bottom pour RCBS $329.00
Four Cavity Brass Mold with Handles: $128.50 (I just bought one)
Magma Sizer with one die: $365.00
Lubricant : $20.00
Shipping $40.00
With this set-up you have $882.50
My local caster charges $80.00 per thousand for the 200 gn. SWC bullet
For .45 ACP with a 200 grain cast you would have $28.57 dollars of lead in one thousand bullets. You would recoup $80.00-28.57 or $51.43 per thousand. To recoup the 882.50 invested you would need to cast 17,160 bullets. The yearly rate for three years would be 5,720 bullets per year. That is a lot of shooting and would only include shooters involved in some type of competition.
To add some time lines in this here is my estimates on time. To cast 1000 bullets and lube them with a two cavity mold 6+ hours. In 6 hours you would be saving $53.00
To cast and lube 1000 bullets with 4 Cavity Mold and a Star/Magma sizer: 4 + hours. Here you would spend 4 hours to save $51.00 on the .45 ACP bullets.

The results kind of surprised me. If your time is worth more than $9-10 per hour you would be ahead to buy your cast bullets. The only thing you could cut down on is the cost of lead. There are sources of lead other than buying such as tire shops and salvaging used wheel weights or range recovery. Even with no costs associated with your lead the decision must be made whether is is “profitable” to do your own bullet casting. Your Decision.
Another cost that I mentioned but did not include in my example was the cost of the gas checks if you go that route. Copper gas checks for the .44 caliber run between 3 and 4 cents apiece. Aluminum gas checks are around 2 cents per round. Add those costs to my example and you really have to think about casting.
Casting does add the versatility of available bullet configurations to a caliber. Also casting your own allows you to properly fit a bullet to the bore of a specific firearm. Many older firearms and especially military firearms have bores that vary in diameter. Manufacturing tolerances were harder to comply with in the 19 and 20th century. And of course during a time of war the manufacturing tolerances were reduced so that a volume of rifles could be produced to meet the sudden demand.

[odfairfaxsub]

i was thinking about it and it came down to enjoyment. its really drawn me and my dad closer to have this in common. we can shoot for less and shoot more. the other day i was thinking about financial feesablity and we did the bullet trap thing so it makes more sense now than ever!!!

[Catshooter]

For me, the most important feature of casting my own is one I don't see mentioned much: independence.

Bullets can go up to $100 each and it will never affect me as I don't use them. It could be a felony to sell a bullet; wouldn't stop me from shooting.

I guess it's just me.


Cat

[garym1a2]

I figure out it will never make sense on a cost basis, but its priceless when at a match someone says nice shooting and I can say of course my boolits go exactly where I want them to as I made them myself.

[stubshaft]

I figure out it will never make sense on a cost basis, but its priceless when at a match someone says nice shooting and I can say of course my boolits go exactly where I want them to as I made them myself.

I find it gratifying also when I harvest an animal with a boolit that I cast and loaded.

It IS cheaper than condoms if you don't go overboard with all of the supplies. But like the Lays potato chip "you can never have just one"!:castmine:

[BruceB]

Talk about preaching to the choir...

Why post two such long and simplistic articles, when the audience here ALREADY casts their own bullets and (obviously) reloads their own ammunition?

I don't see the point...maybe I'm getting cranky?

[gandydancer]

Talk about preaching to the choir...

Why post two such long and simplistic articles, when the audience here ALREADY casts their own bullets and (obviously) reloads their own ammunition?

I don't see the point...maybe I'm getting cranky?
is it cranky? or grumpy? I like grumpy. I read the whole post by wv109323 and when I finished it I had forgot the Question. I have to go lay down now. oh by the way I cast & reload because I enjoy it if I diden't I would not do it. GD

[7br]

Most of my molds were purchased used. I started with a lee 10lb and bought a saeco 20 lb pot off of ebay for $60. My sizer was in a box of junk I picked up for $10 at a gun auction. Last week I cast about 1500 boolits and I am pretty sure I will need about twice that before season is over. I buy gator checks and smelt wheel weights I purchase at $20 per hundred. Figure with smelting loss, it puts it about .50/lb

Hmm, 4 silhouette matches, 3 entries per match, 40 rounds per entry is 480 rounds in matches. Add in the internationals, and that will be at least another 320 rounds. I had better do at least that much practicing, so that puts me at 1600 rounds. Add in the 500 rounds or so for my 1911, another 500 for the ar15, and 100 or so rounds for the .280 for pre-season practice and I feel comfortable with the cost effectiveness.

2700/100 * $25 = $675 in jacketed bullets in one year.
or 2700 * (.03 per check + .01 per lead boolit) = $108
equipment cost over 3 years would be about $140/year

So I have about $427 to play with. At $10/hour, that gives me about 40 hours of casting time. That and the fact I have had most of my equipment for 20 years or so, and it has been pretty cost effective for me.

[ku4hx]

Talk about preaching to the choir...

Why post two such long and simplistic articles, when the audience here ALREADY casts their own bullets and (obviously) reloads their own ammunition?

I don't see the point...maybe I'm getting cranky?

+1 I cast my own boolits and load pretty much everything I shoot. Mostly I do both because for me NOT doing either makes no sense. Yeah, all the "official" reasons too.

I've now lived into the curmudgeon phase of my life and I like it just fine. Took me over 65 years to get here and I'm enjoying it.

[rr2241tx]

OK, but if you need 1000 30:1 .409 Creedmores lubed with Emmert's and in good enough shape to do any good in a monthly BPCR Silhouette club shoot. You don't need all the fancy equipment, just a cast iron dutch oven, the fish fryer, a lead thermometer and a $300 single cavity mould. But really, if you have just blown six grand on a single shot rifle, who could even care how much the boolits cost? You get a bunch of the guys together and cast boolits while the barbeque is going and swap lies about how this year you are absolutely not going to go 0/10 on the chickens every single month again. The cost of boolits falls in the same class as the cost of beer in the fridge when it's your turn to host.

There's always a cheaper gun and always a cheaper bullet but how many good friends do you make shooting Wal-Mart bulk .22s in a pawn shop High Standard? You go around once, make it count.

[Hang Fire]

Like other things in my life, I cast and reload, because I want to. I also kinda like the idea of spitting in the government's eye if they ever should decide to restrict or ban ammunition. And we all know their are some in government who would do it in heartbeat, tyrants love to lord it over and dictate to an unarmed populace.

[Aunegl]

In the early 80s, I got into handgun silhouettes. So reloading and casting was a no-brainer for me. I had connections to get hardcast lead for 10 cents/pound. I knew a couple of guys that had FFLs, sold me reloading and casting equipment at cost plus 10 percent. This hobby will lighten up the wallet. It's just question about how quickly.

[mpmarty]

I've got three fifty cal. ammo cans chock full of surplus 7.62 Nato ammo but still shoot cast in all my rifles. That stuff will probably outlive me.

[geargnasher]

It's a craft. If you see it any other way, you won't be doing it three years from now.

Gear

[sqlbullet]

My casting hobby pays for my shooting hobby after I account for scrap lead I refine and sell.

Would do it anyway. It is relaxing, how I get away from and recharge from selling my time for money.

[Marlin Junky]

Money may make the world go 'round; however, not everything in the world revolves around economics.

MJ

[Suo Gan]

You can't value your time. You can't break it down and put it on a spreadsheet either. The things you buy for casting are bought incrementally. You buy what you can afford. Usually a guy can spread these costs over twenty, thirty, forty, fifty years plus. But lets say you are 50 right now, and you are just starting. Lets say you will probably live to be 75 or 80. That is at least 25 years of shooting left for you.

Divide the annaul cost of your casting outfit by 25 years. You will find that it really amounts to peanuts.

If you decide you do not want to cast, you will not have the flexibility to tailor your boolits to your specific need. You will need to buy something that someone else provides you. Many times these outfits go under leaving you to find another source. A caster can set back a sizable quantity of lead for relatively little money if he waits for good deals. The lead does not eat, and you are not having to deal with the rising costs.

Usually a caster has a son or family members or friends which will defray costs to the point that they are so cheap in the long term that you cannot afford to not cast your own boolits.

What you are doing is looking at this with the microscope and the not the telescope. But it depends on the amount you plan to shoot in the long run.

No self made millionaire ever valued his time. It is not even on the radar.

[Suo Gan]

There's always a cheaper gun and always a cheaper bullet but how many good friends do you make shooting Wal-Mart bulk .22s in a pawn shop High Standard? You go around once, make it count.

That is exactly what I did with my brother in law a few weeks ago, a pawn shop Hi Standard (he has a duramatic and I have a Sport King) and a box of bulk Federals! Haha, I guess I truly am a redneck who is easily entertained because we had a blast shooting the spinners. Beautiful day too.

Cheers

[no34570]

I put it this way,I do it,for fun,to keep from going bonkers,you can make any size diameter bullet,by just altering the sizing die,you tailor the bullet to YOUR requirements(Hard,Soft,in between),you save money from not buying the jacketed version,although that is debatable about saving money,for a caster always needs another mould or die or gadget,well I do :)
But the best thing is,is when you shoot and get that prized deer,you can say I made all of it to get that,it is a good feeling.
just my two cents worth ;)

[Iron Mike Golf]

I wanted to shoot cast bullets in order to shoot more economically and I was happy to buy cast bullets. I was reloading and buying jacketed bullets.

I started casting because I was not satisfied with the fit of locally available cast bullets. They were undersized for both my Colt Series 80 and my Redhawk Hunter 44 mag. As a result of that, both leaded seriously. I tried several casters. Same problem. I later learned the lube used by them was not optimal.

Apart from the personal satisfaction of mastering a new craft, I find I can make properly fitting, excellent shooting boolits that I can not buy locally. Ordering boolits sized as I wanted them approaches the cost of jacketed bullets.

So it is partly an economic thing for me. Buying a used pot and a used lubrisizer mitigated equipment costs. I did start with used molds (older Lyman and SAECO) which have performed very well, but have moved to Mihec molds now that the bullet artisan bug has bit me.

ETA: I shoot about 600 cast boolits in vairous calibers per month.

[Iron Mike Golf]

...A by product of the gases escaping around the bullet is that the hot gases will melt the bullet and that molten lead will stick to the bore of the firearm. This is known as “leading” and it is never a good thing...

...Lubricant can be applied in two ways...

...One limit to cast bullets is the amount of heat( powder charge) that can be directly applied to the base of the bullet...

...There is a lot of controversy as to when a gas check is required but I am going to say if your reloads exceed 1200 fps then you probably need a gas check. This then indicates that your Magnum pistol calibers and all modern rifles need gas checks...

I take some issue with what you posted and most of these points are not (IMO) controversial. These are not flames, just friendly discussion.

1. Gas cutting vaporizes the bullet alloy. It's not molten alloy getting past the bullet that causes the lead deposits in that scenario, It's metal vapor that cools and condenses on the barrel metal.

2. You left out mechanical causes of leading, like tooling marks in the bore scraping lead off the bullet. Also deformation of the engraving by the lands resulting in the engraving being wider than the lands. That gives you a gas channel cut by the lands.

3. You correctly descibed three common methods of lubing. The missing name is "pan lubing". It's distinct from tumble lubing.

4. The limit related to amount of powder is more about pressure than heat. Gas checks can help a bullet withstand higher pressures. So can adjusting the alloy (hardness and toughness). I don't think you can fairly say over 1200 fps means you probably need a gas check. Maybe that's the case with specific guns, but it's not a rule of thumb.

[contender1]

The OP was an interesting cost analisis, and probably good for the newer person getting into casting or thinking of casting.
Yes, most of us cast for different reasons, spend a bit more getting our equipment, add molds & such, and most importantly, do it longer than the 3 years. But to break it down like he did is good for someone who is considering starting out. Quite often, I get questions about reloading savings. I've been at it long enough, and shot enough that my equipment has paid for itself many times over. Especially because it allowed me to shoot more often, and more rounds than if I had to buy factory stuff. Casting is the same way. Once you start it, it becomes a reason to shoot more, and that is a good thing. Shooting more often allows us to refine our skills, and be better shots. That's especially important for hunters who NEED to practice as often as they can.
All in all, a good post, and a lot of good comments afterwards!

[pdawg_shooter]

If it was about saving money, just quit shooting. That will save a bunch!

[Mike Kerr]

Interesting post. Food for thought for an experienced reloader who is thinking of adding casting to the mix. I think its worth it for reasons other than money, like control and flexibility.

regards,

:cast_boolits:

[Recluse]

Talk about preaching to the choir...

Why post two such long and simplistic articles, when the audience here ALREADY casts their own bullets and (obviously) reloads their own ammunition?

I don't see the point...maybe I'm getting cranky?

Well, if you are, you are not alone. Count me in in the cranky club. Hell, I'm already ill-tempered enough as it is.

I saw the question, then read some of the ramblings in the one-big run-on paragraph and what came to mind would be like going to a general aviation discussion forum and asking, "Why do we fly airplanes?"

Hell, we already know why we do or we wouldn't be doing it. [smilie=b:

I saw the title to the post and figured it was a new member looking for objective feedback/advice.


It's a craft. If you see it any other way, you won't be doing it three years from now.

Gear

Yep, and I'm also with Catshooter--I cast, same as I reload, not just for the craftsmanship aspect, but for the self-sustaining, independent aspect as well.

I haven't given a you-know-what about the price of factory ammo in over thirty years because I could care less what the cost is.

:coffee:

[bobthenailer]

You bought your equipment & lead at todays prices see how much more it will cost in 5 to 10 years from today and you will me making bullets at yesterdays prices , as with current today prices everything has doubled in price. 10 or so years ago primers ,brass, & J bullets were 1/2 of what the prices are today but i bet in most cases your wages havent doubled in 10 years

[Cherokee]

I like the independence, as long as I have primers, brass & powder, I can load and shoot. With a large supply of lead on hand, I can invest in the other components for loading. It saves me money and is a satisfying part of my shooting hobby. One thing about the "my time is worth$$" analysis, ask yourself: If I wasn't reloading/casting, would I be making any more money? If the answer is no, then forget that analysis. YMMV

[toddrod]

Being from South Louisiana I guess my math is different.

Lead to cast with = FREE
9mm and 40 S&W casings = FREE
Primers = Basically FREE as I use my winnings from a yearly match that normally place in the top 5and win money.
2 LEE 10 lb bottom pour pots = $40 total
LEE molds = Current price
Beeswax and Vaseline for lube making or Liquid Alox (people give me this stuff) = FREE
Gun powder = Under $10 a pound because I use Titegroup and most action shooters seem to believe you can only use N320 to reload with, and I take it off their hands for cheap.
Time to make and lube 1000 LEE 122 TC bullets = approx 1.5 hrs


If you want to pay full retail for all your casting and reloading stuff you can, but I find it free, or greatly reduced in price, so for me, the casting cost part really makes sense to me, plus I have more FREE time on my hands than I know what to do with.

[mpmarty]

I cast because I dislike retail cast boolits, too hard and the lube is no good. I shoot cast as I'm sick and tired of worrying about gilding metal fouling in my rifles and the chemistry to remove same. My 30 cal boolits go over 2000 fps without short condoms just fine and that's fast enough for my shooting.

[Texantothecore]

The ratio of guests to members nomally runs:

2.5 guests for each member

There are a lot of people looking in to determine whether they should cast their own. They probably do their research for 4 months or so and then make their decision.

[Jeffrey]

Texan, You among others all make excellent points.
I cast and re / hand load because it allows me to have ammo I would not otherwise be able to get. I have cat sneeze loads for 30-30, 30-06, and I am working one up for a 444 Marlin. These allow me to shoot in my backyard (rural south Mississippi) without scaring the chickens.
It also allows me to put a rifle in the hands of a person (me right there) who has never shot before and let them get a taste of the enjoyment of shooting.
Really it is about freedom. We are taking the right to Keep and Bear Arms to the next level. We will not be disarmed. This site has always been about making our own boolits. There are also threads about making powder and reloading primers.
We must be careful about running numbers on casting / reloading / hunting lest SWMBO take a look at them and go off about "How much did you spend on that hunting trip to get 100# of sausage!!!???"
I do it for fun and Freedom. You can not put a price tag on that.

[RoGrrr]

Bruce
Lemme tell ya why is a good idea to post (preach to the choir)
I have a couple of friends who have been complaining about the cost of shooting their newly acquired 45. They know I reload and asked why, since they don't know a thing about shooting, other than guns go BANG and are good for self protection.
I explained that reloading cuts the cost by about half but if I cast, I can load a 45 for about a nickel (.6 cents powder, 4 cents primer, boolit lube, propane to smelt the pick-up, electricity for casting). I go to an outdoor range where the manager lets me cull the berm for spent boolits. I have a sieve with 1/4 inch machine screen, which makes fast work of gathering. In less than an hour I can gather about 200 Lbs of lead. WOOHOO !
I needed some incentive for getting them into reloading and beyond that, into casting. She's not interested (girly-girl, if you know what I mean) but he's a man's man and raised his eye brows when I started to explain. I started to itemize but the OP gave some good info which is very helpful.

SO, WV, I appreciate you posting so seemingly obvious that most think it's not really necessary.
Well, maybe it's not necessary but it is darn good to know and see it in print so I can disseminate to new shooters to make them think about getting deeper into the sport/hobby.



Talk about preaching to the choir...

Why post two such long and simplistic articles, when the audience here ALREADY casts their own bullets and (obviously) reloads their own ammunition?

I don't see the point...maybe I'm getting cranky?

[Old Caster]

I cast bullets simply because I can make them more accurate than the ones I can buy. Also some are not so available.

For you guys that are cranky about this post; when you start to feel you don't like it, quit reading and go somewhere else and quit worrying about your total post count. The rest of us are tired of hearing how you have somehow been insulted. Write private Emals to each other and rail to each other there. This forum is supposed to be for everyone and not just for those who somehow have gotten stuffed full of themselves. - Bill --

[HighHook]

Casting Boolits is a waste of time. Dont do it....

BTW i am starting to have a heck of time getting my free lead WW's

[Jon]

I cast because I wouldn't be able to afford to shoot otherwise. I can reload with cast for about $.05 each. Most of that cost is the primer. I mine the berm at the range, and get a couple hundred pounds of lead at a time. There is work involved, but it beats watching tv.

[PAI-Scott]

I'm sure over my life time I will save money reloading, and casting, although the cost to get into both is fairly high. If you wanted to include my time and if you valued it anywhere near my pay rate, add the fact that I plan to work another 15 years you can never pay to reload or cast. However I look at this as a hobby and cost does not come into play at all.

There is another way to look at this. This keeps me out of the wife's hair a couple of nights a week. Divorce is not cheap, maybeing casting pays off quicker than I thought.

[RoGrrr]

Hey Jon
If I didn't know better I'd say you are joe "biteMe" oops, I mean biden. He plagarized everything and what you wrote looks just like what I posted. ^5's to ya ! :bigsmyl2:

And I thought I was the only one cheap enough to mine berms.... It's dirty work but somebody's gotta do it. After all, we environmentalists is tryin' to save the earth from LEAD POISON

Now all I need is a set of mould blocks and size/lube dies to get going on 9mm.



I cast because I wouldn't be able to afford to shoot otherwise. I can reload with cast for about $.05 each. Most of that cost is the primer. I mine the berm at the range, and get a couple hundred pounds of lead at a time. There is work involved, but it beats watching tv.

[Bullet Caster]

Well, I cast because I have fun at it. And it saves $$ for shooting. I like Jeffery's post about it being for freedom. Casting promotes freedom, i.e., freedom from higher ammunition costs, freedom to make any sized boolits, freedom from the guberment when they finally outlaw ammunition, freedom to make choices, etc.

I don't mind lengthly posts. I enjoy reading as much as casting, reloading and shooting. Of course the subject has to be about guns, as this is where my interests lie. If I cannot cast, reload and shoot, then I want to read all about it. Reading these posts on this forum has contributed to my knowledge base. Where else could one find such information?

My time does NOT play into the cost of casting, reloading and shooting. I haven't been paid for my time in the past few years so why start now? I cast, reload, and shoot for fun. When the fun stops so will my shooting. BC

[kenyerian]

If you keep your casting equipment in good shape and it lasts you 35 years or more you'll find out that it is money well spent.

[DrCaveman]

When I first started considering casting boolits (6 months ago), I would type in a statement similar to the title of this thread into google. Quick breakdowns of financial and time commitments were some of the main things I was looking for, and this thread would have been most welcome. In fact, not sure how i missed it since it started around that time.

I chose equipment similar to the first list in the OP, except I used a 6" cast iron pan on top of a Chinese 5th burner, and it worked fine to pour from the side of the pan, so I didn't spend any money on a ladle. After a few days of learning the ropes, I had myself about 500 nice 158 gr boolits which would have cost me $70 from local suppliers, maybe $40 plus shipping online. As far as I was concerned, the equipment had already paid for itself.

So I bought a furnace, more molds, a ladle, and a few other little dollar store doo-dads which have come in quite handy. I then figured that those had paid for themselves within about a week after receiving them. Now I have bought even more molds, and getting away from Lee 2-cavity molds has really slowed down the 'paying off' of the gear.

I have come to realize that many of my early 'keeper' boolits were actually pretty bad, at least compared to what I can do now with the same molds. So, while my initial thoughts about the equipment paying for itself may have been overly optimistic, I am 100% certain that I have poured enough keepers to represent a street value greater than that spent on my gear.

After 6 months.

Now, I just need to find more time and resources for shooting the darn things! I'm lucky if I can get out twice a week, and I gotta drive 40 minutes each way.

In a nutshell, I really enjoy the act of casting, and becoming better at it. Perhaps soon I can actually understand the details enough so that I can feel OK about ordering a custom mold for $150+. Not there yet.

And, when the power went out last month due to an ice storm, guess what I was doing? Back with the cast iron pan and a Coleman stove and a battery powered headlamp, pouring myself some boolits.

Hopefully a person considering casting will read this, as that is who I wrote it for.

[RoGrrr]

So I waltz into the range at closing time Sunday with a 12 pack of the manager's favorite beer and set it on the counter saying it's for him and when he couldn't figure out why (didn't remember me asking a couple weeks ago) I told him that I appreciated him letting me "mine the berm" for spent slugs.
He promptly said, "Well, you can mine the berm ANY TIME you want".
It looks like I now have a never ending source of lead to make my boolits with !

[rintinglen]

I am still waiting for the savings to start...I am sure it will be any minute now. As soon as I buy a few more molds....

[mrjog]

I like your thread wv109323. The "cranky" and "grumpy" people must not have anything better to do than to complain about it. I figure this because I myself don't have anything better to do right now. So I'm sitting on this toilet here letting you know that I approve your post.

[wv109323]

I just see where my post made it to the top again. I read many of the post that followed. The intent of the article(s) was not so much for the seasoned reloader or caster but for the novice.
The title of the articles should be a give away that it was not intended for the "professional" or someone thats been at it for a lifetime. The title "Should I Reload" or "Should I cast my own bullets" implies that the intentions is for someone comtemplating the Hobby/Cost savings over factory ammo.
It was meant for the visitor to the website that had little to no knowledge of reloading or casting. I am glad for those that corrected or added to my comments.I was not offering a thesis on reloading or casting just a basic cost analysis in simple terms.
What I have seen ( and get the impression) from the website is a total novice/beginner/visitor asks a very basic question and gets scoulded for asking a question.
If you are a "grouch", "grumpy","snide" old cout I would ask that you consider how you answer a question from a beginner. You may do more harm than good by driving away someone that is interested in "our" hobby/past time.
Can we all just get along and be kind.

[wv109323]

Let me add another comment about "The one long run on paragraph"
That was unintentional. I wrote the article in Microsoft word. When I was finished I copied and pasted it into Message box here on the forum. At that time the indentations for the different paragraphs disappeared. I don't know why.