4500 problems

[Lefty SRH]

I was sizing some .45 colts and switched to .480 Ruger boolits and got about 10 sized and lubed and all of a sudden the boolits started to stick in the die and would not come back out. I ended up breaking a top bolt on the lever arms. Why would the boolits all of a sudden start getting stuck? Everything seemed to be running fine!

[Lefty SRH]

Wow, 44 veiws and not a single comment or suggestion. Not typical of this forum!

[Reload3006]

I dont know what to tell you I have a 4500 and I have not been happy with it at all I sent it to lyman and they replaced it. but It still cost me money to send it to them in addition to the money I already spent to get it. So the only thing I can suggest is send the press to Lyman have them fix it for you and then decide if you want to keep it or not. Personally Lyman will never sell me anything else ever. Why your boolits are sticking in the die I have no idea unless the bolt bent or was already broken

[pistolman44]

Are the boolits being lubed when they stick? What I mean is the lube getting to the boolits. On my 4500 I use RCBS case lube on the first boolit, if not it will stick and have to be removed with the die with boolit in it and then hammered out. I know this is not a remedy for your problem. But this is a problem I have with my 4500.

[lavenatti]

I've had a few stick - it's always been a lack of lube on the bullet.

[Lefty SRH]

There was plenty of lube on the boolits. The 1st 10 came out flawlessly (both lube grooves full) #11 it just wouldn't push the boolit back up.

[Lefty SRH]

I replaced the top pivot bolt, lubed the die, let the heater really warm up, spray lubed the 1st boolit and everything ran well. Got about 100-125 boolits done and BOOM the cam arm to the ram breaks on the up stroke. The damn boolit stuck again! I guess this *** is going back to Lyman!

[Forrest r]

I have a lyman 450 that I've owned for years (25+) & broke the cam arm on it last fall. I bought another one from lyman & put it on in november, it broke in less than 200 rounds sized. I bought another one & sent that one back to lyman & they replaced it so now I have a spare. Cheap cast parts.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

WOW...
I've been thinking of upgrading a older lyman 450 with the newer style handle/linkage.
I guess I'll just keep the 30 year old unbroken stuff on the lubesizer.
Jon

PS. I've never had a stuck boolit in a sizer ?
I'd be curious if there is an issue with the dies ? or the sizer ?

[avogunner]

Same here as JonB, I've never had a stuck boolit in my 70's vintage 450... never even close. Besides the die question, what alloy are you using? Something kryptonite hard I can kinda see doing that, but WW lead?

A head scratcher....

[Lefty SRH]

the alloy is straight wheel weights and water dropped.

[Grandpas50AE]

I've had both the 450 (older model) and a 4500 (bought 7 or 8 years ago) and an RCBS. I have both RCBS and Lyman size dies, and run gas checked boolits as well as plain base. All cast from straight WW and air cooled. Never had a boolit stick on any of them, never had any of them break. First thing I would do is take a look at the sizer die to see if it has some roughness issues.

Perhaps Lyman is succumbing to the "make cheap overseas to cut cost" accountant mentality, and that usually leads to poor customer service as well. It really would be a shame to see that be the case.

[Lefty SRH]

A friend that makes cast boolits for a living tested the hardness of some of my WW water dropped boolits and they came back 18-20BHN.
The die doesn't have any roughness issues. But I am going to take the die to work and cut some relief in the top portion to reduce the bearing surface alittle bit.

[cbrick]

How long after casting and water dropping was it before you sized them? 480 bullets but what is the as cast diameter and to what diameter are you sizing them?

20 BHN bullets are pretty tough to size plus if your sizing very much I'll bet they do stick. When I'm doing something like that I keep a little Hornady paste case lube on my fingers & just handeling the bullets to put thm in the die is enough to keep them lubed. Even so, if your sizing hardened bullets very much . . .

Rick

[btroj]

Like Rick said. Ma little lube on the bullet BEFORE sizing makes a huge difference. This is a great place to use the spray lanolin case lubes. Just a very light coat on the bullets will prevent this type of problem.

Bigger the bullet, the worse the problem is too. Look at how much surface area you have with a .477 bullet as compared to a .311.

[Hang Fire]

I keep waiting for my old #45 to give up the ghost after all these years, but it keeps on keeping on.

[Sonnypie]

That's a lot of problems!
How did you let them stack up to 4500? :shock:

[Lefty SRH]

Just ordered a .476 lee push thru die but it will be 6 week wait.

[Lefty SRH]

Parts on order to fix the 4500....

[randyrat]

Just ordered a .476 lee push thru die but it will be 6 week wait. I got a .476 (Buckshot made) you can barrow till yours comes in. Just pay the shipping and send it back when yours comes in. Just PM me. It could be on your doorstep in 3 days

[9.3X62AL]

Big boolits in hard alloy with lots of bearing length can cause drag issues inside a die, esp. if sizing down a bit. I had Buckshot make me a .461" die for the express purpose of lubing 45-70 boolits intended for the .459" die (throat match in my Ruger #1) when I use a mould that casts that wide. It is a big help with Lyman #462550 and its gas check--this casting falls out at .462" in 92/6/2, and filling the grooves @ .461" keeps them nice and wide when squeezed down to .459". The lubed boolits run smoothly in the smaller die.

I've had to replace a couple of the cross-bolts in the 450's cam assembly over the years, and Grade #8 hardware bolts do fine work in that application. I had my mouth all set to buy an RCBS LAM II shortly to house a differing lube type from my stand-by Javelina. 2 days ago on a gunshop tour of northern NV with BruceB and NVcurmudgeon, I actually went eyes-on with a new-production LAM II. The construction of its handle yoke inspires far less confidence than does the Lyman cast part, and the ejector assembly seems about 3X as much work as the Lyman's to get set. Kinda reminded me of 1970s Chrysler vehicles......best part of the car/tool was its warrantee. I saw "THERMOQUAD CARBURETOR" written all over the LAM II.

It will be a 4500, I believe. If I wasn't so deeply invested in the Lyman/RCBS system I might consider changing to another system, but I don't want to re-buy 20+ dies that cost more than Lyman-system dies. If I had THAT kind of money, I'd just shoot jacketed bullets and water my house plants with Dom Perignon.

[cbrick]

If I wasn't so deeply invested in the Lyman/RCBS system I might consider changing to another system, but I don't want to re-buy 20+ dies that cost more than Lyman-system dies. If I had THAT kind of money, I'd just shoot jacketed bullets and water my house plants with Dom Perignon.

Exactly! That's why I always recommend to those getting a lubrisizer to get a Star from the get go. Replacing, buying for a second time that many dies is a very expensive thing and more than doubles the cost of sizing dies. I've been adding to my dies for 25 years or more and if I had to replace 30+ Star dies . . . Yikes. Would be very unlikely that I would ever get back to the collection of dies that I have now.

If you think you will ever want/need to step up to a Star do it before you have a fortune tied up in other dies.

Rick

[gwpercle]

Lefty

Size the boolit before you harden it. Or get a sizer die the same diameter as the hardened boolit so you can lube it without trying to size it to a smaller diameter.

Water hardened wheel weight boolits do not like to be reduced very much if at all in the new Lyman 4500, must be the " IMPROVED " linkage they use now. I've seen others with the exact same problem.

It would seem logical that once the boolit was hardened any cold working would soften the surface. Do a test - measure bhn before sizing and bhn after resizing; Would be interested in results.

I've had my Lyman 450 since 1969 and never had any problems but i never size water dropped boolits in it either.

gary

[Lefty SRH]

Lefty

Size the boolit before you harden it. Or get a sizer die the same diameter as the hardened boolit so you can lube it without trying to size it to a smaller diameter.

Water hardened wheel weight boolits do not like to be reduced very much if at all in the new Lyman 4500, must be the " IMPROVED " linkage they use now. I've seen others with the exact same problem.

It would seem logical that once the boolit was hardened any cold working would soften the surface. Do a test - measure bhn before sizing and bhn after resizing; Would be interested in results.

I've had my Lyman 450 since 1969 and never had any problems but i never size water dropped boolits in it either.

gary

What is your procedure for hardening AFTER sizing?

[Lefty SRH]

I was recently given an older Star sizer/luber but was told NOT to use with hard boolits of large diameter as it will likely break too. I'm waiting on parts for the Star.

I have machined a solid steel link that will replace the cast link that Lyman provides.

I have a .476 LEE push thru on order it it will be a little while, 6 weeks.

I was only sizing down .002" at the VERY most and the bearing surface is approx. .550" long on the I was trying to size. the die in the press was a RCBS .476 and the few finished boolits were coming out at .477.
That was before the link broke.