Why some handgun groups just plain suck!

[rvpilot76]

These are both Winchester headstamp 45ACP cases with large pistol primer pockets. I'm SHOCKED with the variance in flash hole size. I don't know why I haven't noticed this before! So, if your groups suck from time to time, or you have that unexplained flyer outside that otherwise stellar group you've got going, it might be time to check the flash holes! I'm gonna do a test, weather permitting, on the same cases shown below. I'm gonna shoot each one five times, and track the accuracy, velocity, and ES/SD of each and report back. It will be some time before this happens, as I'm not walking for at least another two months in addition to the four already that I've been off my feet.

Something to see:

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a271/rvpilot76/DSCN0944.jpg

Holy Moley!

Kevin

[drklynoon]

I've seen this alot before in Winchester cases. So far the starlines have been better but I still see it from time to time.

[Czech_too]

This is why I've made it a habit to ream/deburr the flash holes on any new brass that I use.
I have some S&B brass in 22 Hornet. The flash hole initially was so small that it pulled the decapping pin out the rod. I didn't notice any resistance on the downstroke but when I went up, the pin stayed in the brass!
It'll be interesting to see what the results are, group wise, between the two.

[zuke]

I've had the same problem with 9mm S&B (sum-bitch!) brass

[Harter66]

I saw the same thing w/FC between standard cases and the non-toxic cases for 9mm . My understanding was that the NT primers needed a larger flash hole . Maybe you've aquired a small lot of NT primed 45s.

Keep us posted.

[TCLouis]

Is this a comparison of the new led-free primer vs old lead staphanate (sp) primer and the size of the flash hole?

[zomby woof]

Is this a comparison of the new led-free primer vs old lead staphanate (sp) primer and the size of the flash hole?

THIS, two different cases.

[BruceB]

This is probably not a "variance".

It's up to the individual loading the brass to inspect carefully before starting loading operations. Even just a quick glance into each case will identify a major difference such as the one illustrated here.

Large flash-holes in SOME cases are a fact of life now, since the so-called "non-toxic" primers have come into wider use.

It's up to us to sort brass accordingly; it's NOT the manufacturer's error.

[btroj]

I bet the main reason some handgun groups just plain suck is because some handgun shooters just plain suck!

[odfairfaxsub]

haha went to the range the other day, everyone had their targets at 5-7 yards shooting all over the target, i shot my target out there to 15 yards and put all my shots in the palm of my hand. everyone asked me how i did it? i said 1st things 1st i shoot everyother weekend and 2nd stop holding your gun sideways lol. joking about the 2nd part but somepeople are not ment to be good shooters because no matter how much you try to help them they can't listen.

[MBTcustom]

You know, it may be that they manufacture two diferent size flash holes, but look how off center the hole is on the right! Not that it matters at 15 yards, just sayin.

[odfairfaxsub]

winchester is making sm and lg pistol primer 45's just seperate em

[Potsy]

Loaded about 225 .45 ACP's last night and happened upon this thread today.
I've always sorted my cartridges according to headstamp after I get them loaded. That's one big reason why.
Although admittedly, I've never looked from case to case of the same brand.

[felix]

The ONLY way to distinguish a keeper from the rest is to shoot the cases. As soon as you have a full match worth, plus some "sighters", throw the remaining into the reject pile until the next time you need brass. Then repeat the process. Brand name means zilch, but it's ok to use brand name for a lot to pick from if you have mucho' brass to pick from. ... felix

[rvpilot76]

Loaded about 225 .45 ACP's last night and happened upon this thread today.
I've always sorted my cartridges according to headstamp after I get them loaded. That's one big reason why.
Although admittedly, I've never looked from case to case of the same brand.

These were both Winchester cases with large primer pockets. Sorting by headstamp wouldn't do you any good in this case once the rounds were loaded...

Kevin

[rvpilot76]

winchester is making sm and lg pistol primer 45's just seperate em

These were both Large primer pockets from the same manufacturer.

Kevin

[rvpilot76]

I bet the main reason some handgun groups just plain suck is because some handgun shooters just plain suck!

Bwahahahahahaha! I hate to admit it, but that happens to me ALL the time when I shoot a Glock! :?

Kevin