rate of twist in 35 Whelen??

[smoked turkey]

Hello to all and Happy New Year. I wasn't sure whether to post this question here or in the boolit mould section because this question pertains to both. I have read some past posts regarding twist rates and frankly I can't interpret what I need to know from the vast amount of info already here in past stickies/threads. So forgive me if this topic has been beat to death already by others.
I have a 35 Whelen Ruger M77 Mark II, S.N. 788-61XXX with a 21" barrel that slugs 0.358". I tried to measure the twist rate using a cleaning rod with a piece of tape and counting one-half revolution times two to get rate. It seems high to me but I got 1 turn in 18" by this method. Do you think this is right? My question is, in theory, what weight boolit would stablize (be most accurate) for my Whelen? I have wanted for a long time a heavy boolit like the 358009, but have given up on getting an old mould. I have read that that boolit is not too accurate for a lot of people anyway. So I decided the best way to approach which mould to buy for what weight boolit should be driven by what my rifle is probably going to do the best with.
I am partial to the steel moulds by Lyman and RCBS. I like a wide meplat on the boolit because this is going to be used occasionally for hunting and that seems to be a better nose design than the roundnose boolit of the 358009 (I don't mean to ruffle feathers here with that comment..just what I seem to glean from posts on the subject).
So bottom line I am considering the RCBS 35-250 RN (says RN, but picture shows a pretty good meplat). Now comes part of the dilema. I said I prefer steel moulds. However, I don't have any brass moulds and I see a lot of casters are very fond of their Accurate brass moulds. So I am throwing that into the mix.
Would the great minds here give me some thoughts on twist rates for the Whelen and mould boolit weights? Lastly does the brass mould sound reasonable? Thanks to all.

[Mk42gunner]

When Remington submitted the .35 Whelen to SAAMI, they speced it with a 1:16" twist, which is what I have read the Remington and Ruger rifles have. Your 1:18 sounds a bit slow, weather it is measuring error or an actual slow twist. With your 21" barrel, you should have slightly over 18" of rifling; so I would retry the tight fitting brush with a barrel length stroke to see what it takes to get one full revolution.

When the Whelen was first being built as a popular wildcat in the 1920's and 30's, they were built with 1:12 or 1:14 twist to stabilize heavy buullets (275-300 grain cup and core construstion).

My own Whelen has a 1:14 twist Adams and Bennett barrel that does fine with the lighter 200 grain jacketed, but also has the potential for heavier bullets if I want to use them.

There have been a lot of threads about Whelen twist rates and the Greenhill formula, in the past few years. I am going to order the RCBS 35-200-FN for use in my Whelen and .35 Remington Marlin 336. Would I turn down a free 358009? No. Is it high on my list of desired molds? No again.

I have only used one brass mold, an Ilatian import for a .58 cal Minie ball. It worked good enough that I look at any brass mold I find to see if I can possibly find a use for it, no luck so far. No rust with a brass mold.

Robert

[W.R.Buchanan]

I have read many articles on the .35 Whelan and most state that the 1:15 twist is the most prominent and they also state that with the 1:15 you will be limited to smaller bullets of 200 225 and maybe 250 gr which kind of defeats the purpose of the .35 Whelan, since you can shoot 220 and now even some 240gr bullets from the .30-06 for alot less money.

The articles also state that a 1:14 is a better option as it will allow you to shoot longer bullets out to 300 gr. This really makes the caliber something special. Otherwise it is an expensive .30-06 with alot more recoil.

I would play it safe and get the 1:14 like "Mk42gunner" has, but I would definately talk to the barrel maker before I jumped off this cliff. If they came back with 1:15, I would talk to someone else.

Randy

[Blammer]

Saeco 35 is a steel mould and casts a great boolit for the 35 whelen. Look in to that one.

Your twist sounds really really slow. I'd try to measure it again.

try this:

put gun in a gun rest, put a tight patch in from the muzzle side, get it started about 1-2 inches, mark with a marker on the cleaning rod right where the muzzle is on the rod.

On the back of the rod near your hand, put a piece of tape with a line on it on the TOP of the rod, then push the rod into the bore slowly , letting it turn and watch the tape. when the line comes around again on the TOP of the rod, STOP.

now mark the rod where it is at the muzzle again.

pull the rod out and measure the two marks you have on the rod, this will be the distance.

If it's 12" long you have a 1/12 twist, if 14" you have 1/14 etc....

[smoked turkey]

Thank-you for the responses. I did recheck the twist rate of my Ruger M77 Mark II in 35 Whelen. I used the method outlined by Blammer and mk42gunner. This time I got 1 turn in 16". I think this is the correct twist rate for my rifle. I applied the Greenhill formula after studying some of the older posts. If my math is correct the formula seems to indicate a longer boolit will stabilize better than a shorter one with my twist rate. This correlates to a heavier boolit. I am thinking of either the RCBS 35-250-RN or Accurate 36-270B. Either will be gas checked. If I go with the Accurate I will probably go with a brass mold since I have never tried one. My bore slugs .358. I have a .360 sizing die and thought I would specify a .360 as cast diameter with wheelweights. When using the rifle to hunt I plan on a 50/50 mix wheelweights/lead for a slightly softer boolit. I wish I could find an old Lyman 3589. But they are almost never for sale. As stated in my original post I desire input on which mold a thinking person would buy. It could be that I can't go wrong with either. I value opinions here so I'm asking. Thanks for the input.

[Mk42gunner]

Check the group buy section, I think there is a small group buy getting ready for a copy of the 3589.

I am somewhat of a lead miser, so since most people say the RCBS 200 gr FN works in most .35's, that is what I am going with.

Robert

[DanLee]

If you don't mind spending the money, NEI offers some heavies in .358. I have their 358-268-GC-DD and 358-282-GC molds. They drop heavy with my range lead mystery mix--280 and 300 grains respectively, sized and lubed. The DD bullet is especially accurate, but they will both stay in 1.5" at 100 yards. I'm shooting a Remington 700 Classic in .35 Whelen with the 1-16" twist.

Dan