357 to 357 Max

[gandydancer]

Just dropped off my 357 mag bullberry 21" TC match bbl at the post office going out to Mike Bellm for a rechamber to 357 max. should be shooting it in about FOUR weeks with some of my cast boolets. looking forward to it. Gandy

[Hamish]

Will be looking forward to hearing how this comes out. Have finally made up my mind to switch from .44mag to the max. for deer hunting here. Have been poking around Mike's website for awhile trying to justify what he gets for a rechamber job.

@(:^]#>:::

[gandydancer]

Will be looking forward to hearing how this comes out. Have finally made up my mind to switch from .44mag to the max. for deer hunting here. Have been poking around Mike's website for awhile trying to justify what he gets for a rechamber job.

@(:^]#>:::
Hello Hamish. Gandydancer here. he told me $95.00 and he will go all over the bbl before he sends it back. I assume that fee includes return shipping. all he asked for was the $95. bucks. I will keep you posted as to how it goes. GD

[Ole]

My 357 Max 14" T/C likes the Ranch Dog 190's pushed with 20-21 grains of H110.

I get around 1950fps out of them and good accuracy. Your 21" barrel should push them 100fps or so faster. Good times! :Fire:

[uscra112]

I use the Max in my 'Tender, but that's largely because I don't do anything in .44, while I do shoot a lot of .357 caliber stuff, from .38 Special to .35 Rem. Not sure the Max kills deer any better than the .44, and Max brass has become hard to find.

Gandydancer - I found out right away that the fit of the pivot pin is crucial to accuracy, even more so with the Max than with the .357 Magnum that my Bullberry was before I lengthened it. A proper pin is easily made from a 3/8 hardened steel dowel pin. Diamond-lap that pin to exact fit, and you avoid the rigamarole of reaming the barrel lug and/or the frame to fit one of Bellm's "standard oversizes". Only tools are the lap and a way to spin the pin, and a way to cut it to length when you have it the right fit. (I used a drill press and a side grinder.)

[357maximum]

While you await the return of your prize may I make a suggestion?


Go buy a can of Alliant MP300 and some remington 7.5 primers.:p

What boolits are you casting?

[uscra112]

300MP is a little fast for the Max, innit? Lil'Gun and H110 seem to be more the mark, at least in mine, (using 180 grainers).

[BABore]

300-MP is slower than H110/296 by 3-4 grains. Slightly faster than 1680. It seems to be best in the supermag and magnum revolver cases when bbl length gets over 14-16 inches. You get a softer launch which is cast friendly and the longer bbl length burns it well. I'm getting 2,150 fps out of a 20 inch MMP max bbl with 300-MP, Rem 7 1/2's, and 180 gr cast. 5-Shot groups run right around and inch and under at 100 yards and accuracy is there out to 400 yards.

[felix]

Compared to 4227s? A double based version? ... felix

[BABore]

IIRC, yes it's double based. Flattened, spherical, fine grained, very similar to 296 in appearance, size, and density. I think a shade faster than 4227. More like a fine grain 4759. Works up smoothly like 296 without the ignition problems. Very well behaved on starting loads. No hangfires, just normal vertical stringing and dirty bbl. When fired at pressure, the bbl shines with a very light dust after 50+ rounds. While I use Rem 7 1/2's in the Max, I usually use CCI 350/550's in the handguns. Initial scribe reviews were mixed on whether to use mag primers or not. Most of my long bbl'd revolvers did well with it, but I ran out of case before I could match 296 performance. I have yet to try it in the Hornet, but expect it to be a little too slow unless you want to just putter around. I haven't tried it in any larger rifle cases.

[blaser.306]

Not to hijack the thread ( but ) after reading some earlier threads about 300-mp I searched out and found a lb to try in 445 supermag and with a starting load under that for h110/w296 , on the very first shot I had to beat the brass from the chamber of my TC contender . A call to ATK to verify the info resulted in a simple well don't use that powder? my sugestion would be as always noted . Start low and work up to pressure signs! Just my experience and opinion ( for what it is worth ) YMMV.

[felix]

Not a hijack, blaser, but useful info. Perhaps the Hornet should be scheduled next with that powder, but using a pistol primer to compensate for the decrease in expansion ratio from 357. Assumed you used a mag primer in that 445? And, if so, was it a light boolit? ... felix

[blaser.306]

Not a hijack, blaser, but useful info. Perhaps the Hornet should be scheduled next with that powder, but using a pistol primer to compensate for the decrease in expansion ratio from 357. Assumed you used a mag primer in that 445? And, if so, was it a light boolit? ... felix

Fed #155 and a 330 gr gas checked boolit , So no I do not beleive that it would class as a "light" boolit! When the brass finaly gave up and let go , It came out of the breech black and "oily" soot covered!

[felix]

Severe ignition failure. But why? Lube contamination before and during primer action? Nitroglycerin failed to ignite up front causing a SEE condition later? Less powder could have been WORSE? ... felix

[blaser.306]

Boolit was lubed with C-Red and was loaded earlier in the day, Transported to the range in a air conditioned truck and fired before it could have been exposed to any amount of summer heat . And was also a cold barrel !

[felix]

It's looking like too much primer force; not enough boolit pull; too much freebore. ... felix

[357maximum]

I had a similar ignition issue in the 35Whelen with a 225 grain cast boolit with Rel15 at the starting charge. Turned a couple of my hairs grey. It sounded like an untuned flintlock when I squeezed the trigger. I think our cast boolits simply are too "slippery " as compared to their copper clad bretheren in some certrain scenarios.


....back on subject...

The 300MP and 180 grain cast has been well behaved in my max but I never tried babying the charge either.

The only powder that has shown "quirks" at upper end in my max is LilGun. It is a great powder until you start getting close to upper end loads and then it gets a bit exponentially knutsy cuckoo.

AA1680 never gave me accuracy or speed in my max and the speed was NEVER as advertised in the manuals. H4227 proved darn accurate but the speed was never there either but it was a one holer in the recommended charges.

My 2 favorites in the max are Vhitovouri N-120 (onobtabium lately) and MP300 which is in stock everywhere around here.


good luck and have fun,
Michael

[gandydancer]

While you await the return of your prize may I make a suggestion?


Go buy a can of Alliant MP300 and some remington 7.5 primers.:p

What boolits are you casting?

at this time a 158 SWC I'm waiting on a mold from NOE I call it the hammer no bigger bullets as yet.

Thanks Max. the powder I'll get the primers I got. and give it a shot.(pun intendd) thank you all for your input. GD

what weight do you recommend in a cast bullet?

[357maximum]

The MAX was designed for 180 grain boolits and that is what they seem to like. My favorite 357MAX moulds came from BRP but them are no longer available. The Larsen designed C-358-180 is a accurate deer killin boolit too. It has had several lee buys done for it and there is a group buy custom going on right now down in the group buy section. I would get in on that. :idea:

[MtJerry]

357Maximum ... what alloy are you using for your 357 Max loads?

I am listening intently about the MR300 powder.

[357maximum]

I use waterdropped 50/50 pure/ww exclusively in my flatnosed deer killers. I am running about 2160 fps so if you are going much slower you may just want to use the 50/50 aircooled or use a waterdropped 60/40 pure/ww blend . Not all guns are created equal and my 15 inch full bull barreled beast of an Encore can take more pressure than a contender can. I put a 180 grain RNFP BRP boolit through 3 feet of deer this year so a bit softer on alloy would not hurt anything. I shot a buck with the Lee C-358-180 that Glen larsen designed a few years back. The range was 240 yards (from a bipod assisted rest) and the boolit still performed flawlessly so the 50/50 is only a guideline....you can be off a bit as long as it is leaning to the softer side. For some reason the 50/50 mix is just a marriage made in heaven for accuracy and deer "killingness". It is tough enough to be accurate yet mallable enough to expand.....in a word it is perfect and there is no annoying antimony wash left behind either.

As far as the MP300 is concerned it is a great replacement for my favorite powder and I am liking it alot. I have been married to Vhit N-120 for quite awile but it is darn near unobtanium lately and the MP300 fills the bill nicely and it is available.

[gandydancer]

The MAX was designed for 180 grain boolits and that is what they seem to like. My favorite 357MAX moulds came from BRP but them are no longer available. The Larsen designed C-358-180 is a accurate deer killin boolit too. It has had several lee buys done for it and there is a group buy custom going on right now down in the group buy section. I would get in on that. :idea:
Thanks Max. I will check it out. GD

[nanuk]

... I am running about 2160 fps ...


2160fps with a 180gr boolit sounds like a 30/32 WCF and they have been killing deer for over a century!


I like it!

[MtJerry]

I was hoping 50/50 would be on your list :lol:

I am working on getting either the RD175 (with 50/50 it drops right at 179 lubed and checked) or the RD190 to work in my Max. I have been planning on using either H110 or IMR4227 and now need to add MP300 to the mix.

Thanks for the info!

Jerry

[uscra112]

300-MP is slower than H110/296 by 3-4 grains. Slightly faster than 1680. It seems to be best in the supermag and magnum revolver cases when bbl length gets over 14-16 inches. You get a softer launch which is cast friendly and the longer bbl length burns it well. I'm getting 2,150 fps out of a 20 inch MMP max bbl with 300-MP, Rem 7 1/2's, and 180 gr cast. 5-Shot groups run right around and inch and under at 100 yards and accuracy is there out to 400 yards.

According to a Quickload analysis using your comments, that puts it right on the speed of Lil'Gun. And Lil'Gun also has that slower initial pressure build. Hmmmmmm. "Interestinger and interestinger", said Alice.

I had the idea the 300MP was closer to AA #9, since the hot shooters in ASSRA have switched to it after some fouling issues were reported with recent lots of AA#9. Wish I lived where the stores stocked the stuff. I hate paying that HazMat for just a couple of pounds.

[lak]

Haven't tryed MP300 yet, but my 24" Max Encore shoots best with 24 grains of 1680. with 180 RCBS Sil and RCBS 200. I do NOT like Lil Gun! compare how hot the barrel get after shooting only a few round with Lil'Gun, My seems to get extremely hot after only a few rounds, if it gets that hot on the outside, whats happening inside the barrel. 445 is even worse....Lak

[357maximum]

Haven't tryed MP300 yet, but my 24" Max Encore shoots best with 24 grains of 1680. with 180 RCBS Sil and RCBS 200. I do NOT like Lil Gun! compare how hot the barrel get after shooting only a few round with Lil'Gun, My seems to get extremely hot after only a few rounds, if it gets that hot on the outside, whats happening inside the barrel. 445 is even worse....Lak

I shot alot of lilgun in my max and it shows. Lilgun in max loads in the 357max will start to toast the throat. I have done it.:sad: My 15 incher simply did not get the speed with 1680 I wanted and the muzzleflash was too much for a scoped deerhunting gun. Vhit120 and MP300 are the goldilocks solution in my 15incher....not too hot or too cold, but juuuuuusssssssssssssssssst right. :bigsmyl2: